Czj Biotar 58mm f/2.0

gemini · 03-23-2009, 01:17 AM

also for me CZ Biotar is a nice lens.
and if you are lucky , you can find a Helios 44 (copy of the CZ Biotar) for few euro\dollars!

georgweb · 03-23-2009, 10:10 AM

Hey Hin,
great portrait shots, well done! I recently picked up the Biotar with the T symbol, it does look just like yours, blue coating on the lens, I guess it is just the same.

M42 CZJ Biotar 2/58 + Skylight 1B @f/2 on K100D, no postprocess

Best, Georg (the other)

hinman · 03-23-2009, 10:23 AM

Originally posted by Igilligan

I thought you said your boys would not sit still enough for MF lenses...

These are nice shots of the boys, they are becoming very good models.

This may be one of the best 'family' shots I have seen in a while... It captures so much personality and emotion...

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3040/3377018809_6e821b7307.jpg

Hey Gus, thanks for the comment. My older boy is always moving and I have much less pictures on him than my younger boy. That particular shot was taken when my wife was reading to him and I had that rare moment that he was not avoiding my camera. My younger boy on the other hand is much more cooperative with pictures.

Thank you for inspiring me in trying manual focus lens on my boys.

hinman · 03-23-2009, 10:26 AM

Originally posted by georgweb

Hey Hin,
great portrait shots, well done! I recently picked up the Biotar with the T symbol, it does look just like yours, blue coating on the lens, I guess it is just the same.

M42 CZJ Biotar 2/58 + Skylight 1B @f/2 on K100D, no postprocess

Best, Georg (the other)

Georg, thank you! That is a serious and solemn shot. I think your red T is actually better. With all the information gather, the red T has better coating than mine. I tend to bring in a lens hood along with a UV filter. The Biotar seems quite sharp even wide open but I do find a bit vignetting in wide open shots.

Originally posted by gemini

also for me CZ Biotar is a nice lens.
and if you are lucky , you can find a Helios 44 (copy of the CZ Biotar) for few euro\dollars!

Gemini, thank you for the comment. I initially look for Helios 44 due to influence from Gus but when I find the Czj Biotar in chrome color, I couldn't resist as I found a very good copy that looks like brand new to me. My Biotar is a preset with a hidden preset ring. I wonder if the Helios is also a preset lens.

georgweb · 03-23-2009, 04:23 PM

Quote:

Hin said: ...the red T has better coating than mine. I tend to bring in a lens hood along with a UV filter. The Biotar seems quite sharp even wide open but I do find a bit vignetting in wide open shots.

I don't see anything missing in your portrait shots, detail is just perfect IMO. I have put a 1B filter on the lens, which gives a warmer tone and more color pop. The vignetting should come from your lenshood/filter combination, I can't see another reason why this should happen with a full frame lens on an APS-C camera.

Quote:

Hin asked: I wonder if the Helios is also a preset lens.

Well well, I know somebody who has some of those Helios, so I put my Biotar besides them. This guy is crazy :-)

Mother Biotar and her daughters: left side preset, right side 'auto' converted to 'manual', all at f/4

BTW the two preset Helios here are like your Jupiter Hin, they have the click-ring and the open-close-ring beneath. Only the Biotar has the real old school push-pull-ring.

Best, Georg (the other)

hinman · 03-24-2009, 10:18 PM

Georg,

Thank you for showing the picture of the Helios . I would like to think that the Czj really stand out in chrome color from the rest

. I love how the pull-turn-push preset ring works in the Czj -- I never bother that it exists as I always preset it to f/16, and adjust f/stop with aperture ring. When I used the Jupiter9, I always have to look at the two rings with confusion. In the Czj, there is no confusion as the preset ring is only engaged when I pull the aperture ring towards the camera body.

I think my version does suffer from a tendency of cold blue tone. When I test pictures in the early morning under shadow, many test pictures do come out with a bluish tone. And you teach me another thing on the 1B filter to try next. Much thanks!

Thanks,
Hin

ggc · 09-14-2009, 01:15 PM

Didn't know about the 1Q symbol, i have checked and mine has it.

I have a red T one ( n° 3644069 ) and it has 12 blades. Never tried with digital (yet).

hinman · 09-14-2009, 07:37 PM

Originally posted by ggc

Didn't know about the 1Q symbol, i have checked and mine has it.

I have a red T one ( n° 3644069 ) and it has 12 blades. Never tried with digital (yet).

You've got to try your Biotar lens on your digital. I use Av mode for all my M42 lens and the Biotar is quite a lens with beauty and character.

Thanks,
Hin

Ron Redwood · 09-14-2009, 08:47 PM

Originally posted by Igilligan

I thought you said your boys would not sit still enough for MF lenses...

These are nice shots of the boys, they are becoming very good models.

This may be one of the best 'family' shots I have seen in a while... It captures so much personality and emotion...

Also....something I believe,when in doubt,get closer.

Those kids have great eyes....and remarkable...they can even keep still for 1/125 of a sec.

At one point I quit shooting kids and horses...they are just TOO easy. Both just instinctively set you up with a pose that's just right..yet natural.

One of my best shots (blue ribbon winner) was a Blue Macaw that GAVE me a perfect pose. I wanted to get IN CLOSE, had a 100 mm with a macro tube....and the bird turned profile and put near every feather in the DOF plane...that was a Kodachrome and the stunning blue + gold, the full detail of each feather,the cocked head with one eye looking right into you...in perfect sunny daylight,was a rare mix. I just took 2 shots and said thank you to that bird as I KNEW I'd nailed a winner shot.

Years ago, a meadow near here had a large Pear tree that in autumn had great colors. There were a few horses in the meadow and the most photogenic,a pinto, would walk over under that gorgeous Pear tree and start posing. Uncanny.

these days...I'm a bit lazy and if I come across some kids,horses or macaws...I'd be happy to shoot more film and let them do their stuff.

Ron Redwood · 09-14-2009, 08:58 PM

Originally posted by hinman

Georg,

Thank you for showing the picture of the Helios . I would like to think that the Czj really stand out in chrome color from the rest

. I love how the pull-turn-push preset ring works in the Czj -- I never bother that it exists as I always preset it to f/16, and adjust f/stop with aperture ring. When I used the Jupiter9, I always have to look at the two rings with confusion. In the Czj, there is no confusion as the preset ring is only engaged when I pull the aperture ring towards the camera body.

I think my version does suffer from a tendency of cold blue tone. When I test pictures in the early morning under shadow, many test pictures do come out with a bluish tone. And you teach me another thing on the 1B filter to try next. Much thanks!

Thanks,
Hin

A 1B is even a bit mild for blue reduction,though Un-bluing is easy in post process.
I used as I tecall a warmer 70 B...I live in the redwood forests of California so a greenish blue cast can be a common issue.

When I used a CJ Tessar I thought it was warmish and now I use a Novoflexar for a bellows lens and its on the warm side...which I tend to prefer.

ovim · 09-14-2009, 10:34 PM

Here's the M39 version of Helios 44. The resemblance is clear.

And one taken with it yesterday:

Asahiflex · 09-15-2009, 12:27 AM

I also have the Biotar, but an older version. Basically it has the prewar barrel but with postwar elements (the so-called "slim Biotar"). It's the version with 17 diaphragm blades and T coating. You can see it here in the middle (the left one is a prewar 7,5cm 1:1.9 Meyer Primoplan and on the right is an even older 5,8cm Biotar with Praktina mount):

Blue · 09-15-2009, 07:19 AM

What happened to your K200d?

hinman · 09-16-2009, 07:36 PM

Thanks for all the discussions. I get tempted to take out my zeiss glass for more product shots to share. It is a sure chrome beauty. Mine actually stinks from with awful smell. I thought it was from smoke but I couldn't be sure.

Just a snap shot to show the relative size of the 58mm biotar f/2.0 with a Carl Zeiss Jena Sonnar 180mm f/2.8 -- my zebra football lens that weights 3.5 lb, front cap is 112mm in size, I forget the filter size, likely in the 85-95mm range. It is big and macho.

I only see 7 blades in my Sonnar 180mm f/2.8
but pretty rounded in f/5.6 and f/8.0

The Zeiss 180mm f/2.8 actually has f/32

the preset ring that I learned from Georg

the unique I with an o sign

The aperture opening is pretty rounded with 10 blades, and I would think more rounded with the 12+ blades. I seldom see any lens like these in modern age

Thanks,
Hin

hinman · 09-16-2009, 07:57 PM

Originally posted by Ron Redwood

A 1B is even a bit mild for blue reduction,though Un-bluing is easy in post process.
I used as I tecall a warmer 70 B...I live in the redwood forests of California so a greenish blue cast can be a common issue.

When I used a CJ Tessar I thought it was warmish and now I use a Novoflexar for a bellows lens and its on the warm side...which I tend to prefer.

Much thanks for the comment and discussion.

03-23-2009, 10:23 AM	#18
hinman Veteran Member Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: Fremont, CA Photos: Albums Posts: 3,473 Original Poster	Originally posted by Igilligan I thought you said your boys would not sit still enough for MF lenses... These are nice shots of the boys, they are becoming very good models. This may be one of the best 'family' shots I have seen in a while... It captures so much personality and emotion... http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3040/3377018809_6e821b7307.jpg Hey Gus, thanks for the comment. My older boy is always moving and I have much less pictures on him than my younger boy. That particular shot was taken when my wife was reading to him and I had that rare moment that he was not avoiding my camera. My younger boy on the other hand is much more cooperative with pictures. Thank you for inspiring me in trying manual focus lens on my boys. Last edited by hinman; 03-23-2009 at 04:35 PM.

03-24-2009, 10:18 PM	#21
hinman Veteran Member Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: Fremont, CA Photos: Albums Posts: 3,473 Original Poster	Georg, Thank you for showing the picture of the Helios . I would like to think that the Czj really stand out in chrome color from the rest . I love how the pull-turn-push preset ring works in the Czj -- I never bother that it exists as I always preset it to f/16, and adjust f/stop with aperture ring. When I used the Jupiter9, I always have to look at the two rings with confusion. In the Czj, there is no confusion as the preset ring is only engaged when I pull the aperture ring towards the camera body. I think my version does suffer from a tendency of cold blue tone. When I test pictures in the early morning under shadow, many test pictures do come out with a bluish tone. And you teach me another thing on the 1B filter to try next. Much thanks! Thanks, Hin Last edited by hinman; 03-24-2009 at 10:29 PM.

09-14-2009, 10:34 PM	#26
ovim Veteran Member Join Date: Sep 2008 Location: Tre, Finland Photos: Gallery Posts: 1,229	The resemblance is uncanny Here's the M39 version of Helios 44. The resemblance is clear. And one taken with it yesterday:

09-16-2009, 07:36 PM	#29
hinman Veteran Member Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: Fremont, CA Photos: Albums Posts: 3,473 Original Poster	Thanks for all the discussions. I get tempted to take out my zeiss glass for more product shots to share. It is a sure chrome beauty. Mine actually stinks from with awful smell. I thought it was from smoke but I couldn't be sure. Just a snap shot to show the relative size of the 58mm biotar f/2.0 with a Carl Zeiss Jena Sonnar 180mm f/2.8 -- my zebra football lens that weights 3.5 lb, front cap is 112mm in size, I forget the filter size, likely in the 85-95mm range. It is big and macho. I only see 7 blades in my Sonnar 180mm f/2.8 but pretty rounded in f/5.6 and f/8.0 The Zeiss 180mm f/2.8 actually has f/32 the preset ring that I learned from Georg the unique I with an o sign The aperture opening is pretty rounded with 10 blades, and I would think more rounded with the 12+ blades. I seldom see any lens like these in modern age Thanks, Hin Last edited by hinman; 09-16-2009 at 07:55 PM.

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03-23-2009, 01:17 AM	#16
gemini Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2009 Posts: 256	also for me CZ Biotar is a nice lens. and if you are lucky , you can find a Helios 44 (copy of the CZ Biotar) for few euro\dollars!

03-23-2009, 10:10 AM	#17
georgweb Veteran Member Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: Berlin, Germany Photos: Gallery Posts: 1,386	Hey Hin, great portrait shots, well done! I recently picked up the Biotar with the T symbol, it does look just like yours, blue coating on the lens, I guess it is just the same. M42 CZJ Biotar 2/58 + Skylight 1B @f/2 on K100D, no postprocess Best, Georg (the other)

03-23-2009, 10:26 AM	#19
hinman Veteran Member Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: Fremont, CA Photos: Albums Posts: 3,473 Original Poster	Originally posted by georgweb Hey Hin, great portrait shots, well done! I recently picked up the Biotar with the T symbol, it does look just like yours, blue coating on the lens, I guess it is just the same. M42 CZJ Biotar 2/58 + Skylight 1B @f/2 on K100D, no postprocess Best, Georg (the other) Georg, thank you! That is a serious and solemn shot. I think your red T is actually better. With all the information gather, the red T has better coating than mine. I tend to bring in a lens hood along with a UV filter. The Biotar seems quite sharp even wide open but I do find a bit vignetting in wide open shots. Originally posted by gemini also for me CZ Biotar is a nice lens. and if you are lucky , you can find a Helios 44 (copy of the CZ Biotar) for few euro\dollars! Gemini, thank you for the comment. I initially look for Helios 44 due to influence from Gus but when I find the Czj Biotar in chrome color, I couldn't resist as I found a very good copy that looks like brand new to me. My Biotar is a preset with a hidden preset ring. I wonder if the Helios is also a preset lens.

03-23-2009, 04:23 PM	#20
georgweb Veteran Member Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: Berlin, Germany Photos: Gallery Posts: 1,386	Quote: Hin said: ...the red T has better coating than mine. I tend to bring in a lens hood along with a UV filter. The Biotar seems quite sharp even wide open but I do find a bit vignetting in wide open shots. I don't see anything missing in your portrait shots, detail is just perfect IMO. I have put a 1B filter on the lens, which gives a warmer tone and more color pop. The vignetting should come from your lenshood/filter combination, I can't see another reason why this should happen with a full frame lens on an APS-C camera. Quote: Hin asked: I wonder if the Helios is also a preset lens. Well well, I know somebody who has some of those Helios, so I put my Biotar besides them. This guy is crazy :-) Mother Biotar and her daughters: left side preset, right side 'auto' converted to 'manual', all at f/4 BTW the two preset Helios here are like your Jupiter Hin, they have the click-ring and the open-close-ring beneath. Only the Biotar has the real old school push-pull-ring. Best, Georg (the other)

09-14-2009, 01:15 PM	#22
ggc Inactive Account Join Date: Aug 2009 Posts: 10	Didn't know about the 1Q symbol, i have checked and mine has it. I have a red T one ( n° 3644069 ) and it has 12 blades. Never tried with digital (yet).

09-14-2009, 07:37 PM	#23
hinman Veteran Member Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: Fremont, CA Photos: Albums Posts: 3,473 Original Poster	Originally posted by ggc Didn't know about the 1Q symbol, i have checked and mine has it. I have a red T one ( n° 3644069 ) and it has 12 blades. Never tried with digital (yet). You've got to try your Biotar lens on your digital. I use Av mode for all my M42 lens and the Biotar is quite a lens with beauty and character. Thanks, Hin

09-14-2009, 08:47 PM	#24
Ron Redwood Inactive Account Join Date: Jun 2009 Location: Santa Cruz Mountains Posts: 53	Originally posted by Igilligan I thought you said your boys would not sit still enough for MF lenses... These are nice shots of the boys, they are becoming very good models. This may be one of the best 'family' shots I have seen in a while... It captures so much personality and emotion... Also....something I believe,when in doubt,get closer. Those kids have great eyes....and remarkable...they can even keep still for 1/125 of a sec. At one point I quit shooting kids and horses...they are just TOO easy. Both just instinctively set you up with a pose that's just right..yet natural. One of my best shots (blue ribbon winner) was a Blue Macaw that GAVE me a perfect pose. I wanted to get IN CLOSE, had a 100 mm with a macro tube....and the bird turned profile and put near every feather in the DOF plane...that was a Kodachrome and the stunning blue + gold, the full detail of each feather,the cocked head with one eye looking right into you...in perfect sunny daylight,was a rare mix. I just took 2 shots and said thank you to that bird as I KNEW I'd nailed a winner shot. Years ago, a meadow near here had a large Pear tree that in autumn had great colors. There were a few horses in the meadow and the most photogenic,a pinto, would walk over under that gorgeous Pear tree and start posing. Uncanny. these days...I'm a bit lazy and if I come across some kids,horses or macaws...I'd be happy to shoot more film and let them do their stuff.

09-14-2009, 08:58 PM	#25
Ron Redwood Inactive Account Join Date: Jun 2009 Location: Santa Cruz Mountains Posts: 53	Originally posted by hinman Georg, Thank you for showing the picture of the Helios . I would like to think that the Czj really stand out in chrome color from the rest . I love how the pull-turn-push preset ring works in the Czj -- I never bother that it exists as I always preset it to f/16, and adjust f/stop with aperture ring. When I used the Jupiter9, I always have to look at the two rings with confusion. In the Czj, there is no confusion as the preset ring is only engaged when I pull the aperture ring towards the camera body. I think my version does suffer from a tendency of cold blue tone. When I test pictures in the early morning under shadow, many test pictures do come out with a bluish tone. And you teach me another thing on the 1B filter to try next. Much thanks! Thanks, Hin A 1B is even a bit mild for blue reduction,though Un-bluing is easy in post process. I used as I tecall a warmer 70 B...I live in the redwood forests of California so a greenish blue cast can be a common issue. When I used a CJ Tessar I thought it was warmish and now I use a Novoflexar for a bellows lens and its on the warm side...which I tend to prefer.

09-15-2009, 12:27 AM	#27
Asahiflex Pentaxian Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: Netherlands Photos: Gallery Posts: 2,795	I also have the Biotar, but an older version. Basically it has the prewar barrel but with postwar elements (the so-called "slim Biotar"). It's the version with 17 diaphragm blades and T coating. You can see it here in the middle (the left one is a prewar 7,5cm 1:1.9 Meyer Primoplan and on the right is an even older 5,8cm Biotar with Praktina mount):

09-15-2009, 07:19 AM	#28
Blue Moderator Site Supporter Join Date: Jun 2008 Location: Florida Hill Country Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 17,377	What happened to your K200d?

09-16-2009, 07:57 PM	#30
hinman Veteran Member Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: Fremont, CA Photos: Albums Posts: 3,473 Original Poster	Originally posted by Ron Redwood A 1B is even a bit mild for blue reduction,though Un-bluing is easy in post process. I used as I tecall a warmer 70 B...I live in the redwood forests of California so a greenish blue cast can be a common issue. When I used a CJ Tessar I thought it was warmish and now I use a Novoflexar for a bellows lens and its on the warm side...which I tend to prefer. Much thanks for the comment and discussion.