Jupiter-9 85/2 - first shots. Some doubts...

Free Soul · 03-22-2009, 08:06 AM

...I have some doubts the lens I have is too soft (the copy I own is not OK?), or may be I am doing something wrong...

The portraits below are at f4 or f5.6 - they shouldn't be so soft...And the focus is not on the right place on every one, despite the shutter speed over 300...

The portraits seem to me not good...

But I can say the bokeh is great after all.

I shot on M, the focus was set on "center", the meterring is spot.

Did I do something wrong?

The images are not processed at all.

Jewelltrail · 03-22-2009, 08:11 AM

I think the images look good and they will get better as you use the lens even more.

estudleon · 03-22-2009, 09:07 AM

Your lens is OK for me.

The portraits were taken, almost sure the two of childs, at F/4. The guy's one improve, perhaps taken at F/4,8 or 5,6. The last -the beauty girl- may be with a little out of focus.
The nature pics are super!
And the others two, they were taken at my grand ma house??

bc_the_path · 03-22-2009, 09:23 AM

I have the same lens and its soft only at f/2.
However, manual focus is difficult with the current digital bodies and you may easily deceive yourself while focusing. I suggest you try more shots and test slightly different focus points. Make sure that the point you see crisp on your viewfinder is the sharpest spot on the final image.
And, do not pay too much attention to the green hexagon while using manual focus lenses. Specifically, it does not guarantee the best focus.

brkl · 03-22-2009, 09:28 AM

Hmm, are you actually closing the aperture with the dial, rather than simply choosing the aperture? There are two dials you have to use. The portraits do not look like f4 or f5.6 to me.

chhayanat · 03-22-2009, 11:27 AM

Originally posted by brkl

Hmm, are you actually closing the aperture with the dial, rather than simply choosing the aperture? There are two dials you have to use. The portraits do not look like f4 or f5.6 to me.

I agree with the above. Getting used to the manual stop-down system takes a while. One dial or ring is for setting the aperture; the other for stopping down to the set aperture for taking the picture. No wonder that automatic lenses replaced the earlier type so quickly.
Some of the pictures are quite good a new user but the first picture of the child seems to have a bit of camera shake.

estudleon · 03-22-2009, 11:28 AM

Not all the J-9 are in the same league, because the so-so QC. I only know that the MC J9 is more contrast but the not MC is a bit sharp. In my copies of course.

Igilligan · 03-22-2009, 11:52 AM

In looking at the portraits... I like the look you are getting. Although I think like some of the others are saying, they all look like F2 shots. If they had been stopped down to F4/F5 the oof area should have begun to be less smooth with more detail in the OOF areas.

As to getting used to the pre-set ap lenses.... The front dial clicks to the whatever you want the highest Ap # to be... then you spin the second dial between wide open and whatever you pre-set as you largest AP.

Once you really get used to the preset you hopefully will love it as I do.

Also if these are straight from the camera... the K10 can always take a bit of a bump in sharpening in PP, especially on re-size for web shots. Those portraits will sharpen up nicely since the oof area is so beautifully smooth.

Having said that, I really like the look of these portraits. I will take that smooth oof area and a slightly softer focus on the faces everytime over a busier OOF look but sharper faces.
Does that make sense?

Free Soul · 03-22-2009, 12:07 PM

Originally posted by brkl

Hmm, are you actually closing the aperture with the dial, rather than simply choosing the aperture? There are two dials you have to use. The portraits do not look like f4 or f5.6 to me.

Sorry, if I'll ask a stupid question

, but I don't understand...I choose the aperture by turning the lens ring...

And then the ring for focusing-distance to get a clear image - and then press the shutter.

What do you have in mind? Which two dials?

Quote:

One dial or ring is for setting the aperture; the other for stopping down to the set aperture for taking the picture.

Please explain which one is the other?

On the lens the front ring is for setting the aperture - the chosen one is beeng positioned on the red spot.

After that ring there is another, with no numbers or graphics on it. It could be turned also, I never used it...???

And the third ring is for the distance - which is for focusing the object...

So, do you have in mind the second ring??? If it so, how do you use it?

Jewelltrail, thank you.

I hope I'll get better...But I expected much more...

estudleon, thank you too. I posted here chosen pics, but lot of today's shooting were out of focus.

It is not my first M-lens, so I am wondering what is wrong...
The pictures are from a church-yard.

bc_the_pathq thank you for your advice! May be I shoud buy a viewfinder...

Thank you all.

Igilligan · 03-22-2009, 12:23 PM

If you do I can delete these.

But I just did a quick and dirty sharpening in Picasa of one of the portraits. As always it would be better to work with the original sized file but this kind of works on bringing out the subject a bit... if you have a real PP program you can of course do a much better job with variable levels of sharpening than I did here.

Here I just gave a slight boost in contrast and sharpening... Again you got the focusing spot on... nice work

Free Soul · 03-22-2009, 12:31 PM

Igilligan, thank you a lot! You also did a great job, even for a Picasa.

I was hoping you'll see that thread and post your opinion.

I am so, so stupid!

I've just test some shots with this second ring - there is a great diffrence! If the ring is set on it's right - not turned - the pics are brighter, softer and almost de-focused. But if I turn the ring clockwise - the shots become sharper and more-contrasted.

Is this what you call "stop-down"? I have only read it in some posts, but never knew what is it actually...And how it is correct to be used...

bc_the_path · 03-22-2009, 12:54 PM

The first ring sets the higher limit (say, f/2).
The second ring determines the real, functional aperture (like f/4).
This is a peculiar behaviour and you must get used to it if you want to use this particular lens.
I am sure it is very good for the price (your copy also!).

Igilligan · 03-22-2009, 01:29 PM

It took me a few tries to get the hang of the Jupiter 9 ap settings. The pre-set Ap lenses are tricky and not at all obvious the first time you use them.

I think you have got it now... you click the front ring for a top F-stop you want to limit it to at the red dot. I usually use F4 for portrait limits. Then you spin the second between the right = F2 and as you spin the dial left it goes from F2 gradually to F4, if that was your upper limit. Then green button meter and you are all set. Make sure that you green button meter at the final aperature setting. That way you pic will have proper exposure.

Many times with portraits of the girls I set f4 then I shoot one shot all the way to the right F2, then quickly spin to the left F4, hit the green button and snap another quick shot. That way I have two options...

Stopdown just means you are going for a smaller aperture like going from F2 to a smaller aperture like F4 or F8. The higher number apertures give you more in focus area, but the out of focus areas are also begins more defined too. Does that make sense?

I think for what I am seeing you have a very nice copy of the Jupiter 9. You are nailing focus and you will only get better with the controlling aperture for the 'look' you want on any given shot. But those portraits look really good with just a bit of PP...
Congrats on the lens.

Originally posted by Free Soul

Igilligan, thank you a lot! You also did a great job, even for a Picasa.

I was hoping you'll see that thread and post your opinion.

I am so, so stupid!

I've just test some shots with this second ring - there is a great diffrence! If the ring is set on it's right - not turned - the pics are brighter, softer and almost de-focused. But if I turn the ring clockwise - the shots become sharper and more-contrasted.

Is this what you call "stop-down"? I have only read it in some posts, but never knew what is it actually...And how it is correct to be used...

RonMexico · 03-22-2009, 01:31 PM

I think the shots look good.
Do you shoot for work or personal?

Transit · 03-22-2009, 01:40 PM

Originally posted by Free Soul

I am so, so stupid!

I've just test some shots with this second ring - there is a great diffrence! If the ring is set on it's right - not turned - the pics are brighter, softer and almost de-focused. But if I turn the ring clockwise - the shots become sharper and more-contrasted.

Is this what you call "stop-down"? I have only read it in some posts, but never knew what is it actually...And how it is correct to be used...

You are most certainly NOT stupid !
You are in the delicious position of learning about aperture control for the first time !
most of the old hands here have long since lost the glow of first learning

Pete

03-22-2009, 08:06 AM	#1
Free Soul Forum Member Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Bulgaria Photos: Gallery Posts: 94	Jupiter-9 85/2 - first shots. Some doubts... ...I have some doubts the lens I have is too soft (the copy I own is not OK?), or may be I am doing something wrong... The portraits below are at f4 or f5.6 - they shouldn't be so soft...And the focus is not on the right place on every one, despite the shutter speed over 300... The portraits seem to me not good... But I can say the bokeh is great after all. I shot on M, the focus was set on "center", the meterring is spot. Did I do something wrong? The images are not processed at all.

03-22-2009, 12:23 PM	#10
Igilligan Guest	I hope you do not mind If you do I can delete these. But I just did a quick and dirty sharpening in Picasa of one of the portraits. As always it would be better to work with the original sized file but this kind of works on bringing out the subject a bit... if you have a real PP program you can of course do a much better job with variable levels of sharpening than I did here. Here I just gave a slight boost in contrast and sharpening... Again you got the focusing spot on... nice work

03-22-2009, 01:29 PM	#13
Igilligan Guest	Believe me it is not just you... It took me a few tries to get the hang of the Jupiter 9 ap settings. The pre-set Ap lenses are tricky and not at all obvious the first time you use them. I think you have got it now... you click the front ring for a top F-stop you want to limit it to at the red dot. I usually use F4 for portrait limits. Then you spin the second between the right = F2 and as you spin the dial left it goes from F2 gradually to F4, if that was your upper limit. Then green button meter and you are all set. Make sure that you green button meter at the final aperature setting. That way you pic will have proper exposure. Many times with portraits of the girls I set f4 then I shoot one shot all the way to the right F2, then quickly spin to the left F4, hit the green button and snap another quick shot. That way I have two options... Stopdown just means you are going for a smaller aperture like going from F2 to a smaller aperture like F4 or F8. The higher number apertures give you more in focus area, but the out of focus areas are also begins more defined too. Does that make sense? I think for what I am seeing you have a very nice copy of the Jupiter 9. You are nailing focus and you will only get better with the controlling aperture for the 'look' you want on any given shot. But those portraits look really good with just a bit of PP... Congrats on the lens. Originally posted by Free Soul Igilligan, thank you a lot! You also did a great job, even for a Picasa. I was hoping you'll see that thread and post your opinion. I am so, so stupid! I've just test some shots with this second ring - there is a great diffrence! If the ring is set on it's right - not turned - the pics are brighter, softer and almost de-focused. But if I turn the ring clockwise - the shots become sharper and more-contrasted. Is this what you call "stop-down"? I have only read it in some posts, but never knew what is it actually...And how it is correct to be used... Last edited by Igilligan; 03-22-2009 at 01:39 PM.

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03-22-2009, 08:11 AM	#2
Jewelltrail Veteran Member Join Date: May 2008 Location: Rhode Island Photos: Albums Posts: 4,180	I think the images look good and they will get better as you use the lens even more.

03-22-2009, 09:07 AM	#3
estudleon Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2009 Posts: 228	Your lens is OK for me. The portraits were taken, almost sure the two of childs, at F/4. The guy's one improve, perhaps taken at F/4,8 or 5,6. The last -the beauty girl- may be with a little out of focus. The nature pics are super! And the others two, they were taken at my grand ma house??

03-22-2009, 09:23 AM	#4
bc_the_path Veteran Member Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Ankara, Turkey Photos: Gallery Posts: 401	I have the same lens and its soft only at f/2. However, manual focus is difficult with the current digital bodies and you may easily deceive yourself while focusing. I suggest you try more shots and test slightly different focus points. Make sure that the point you see crisp on your viewfinder is the sharpest spot on the final image. And, do not pay too much attention to the green hexagon while using manual focus lenses. Specifically, it does not guarantee the best focus.

03-22-2009, 09:28 AM	#5
brkl Veteran Member Join Date: Oct 2008 Posts: 497	Hmm, are you actually closing the aperture with the dial, rather than simply choosing the aperture? There are two dials you have to use. The portraits do not look like f4 or f5.6 to me.

03-22-2009, 11:27 AM	#6
chhayanat Senior Member Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: The Cow Belt Photos: Gallery Posts: 173	Originally posted by brkl Hmm, are you actually closing the aperture with the dial, rather than simply choosing the aperture? There are two dials you have to use. The portraits do not look like f4 or f5.6 to me. I agree with the above. Getting used to the manual stop-down system takes a while. One dial or ring is for setting the aperture; the other for stopping down to the set aperture for taking the picture. No wonder that automatic lenses replaced the earlier type so quickly. Some of the pictures are quite good a new user but the first picture of the child seems to have a bit of camera shake.

03-22-2009, 11:28 AM	#7
estudleon Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2009 Posts: 228	Not all the J-9 are in the same league, because the so-so QC. I only know that the MC J9 is more contrast but the not MC is a bit sharp. In my copies of course.

03-22-2009, 11:52 AM	#8
Igilligan Guest	In looking at the portraits... I like the look you are getting. Although I think like some of the others are saying, they all look like F2 shots. If they had been stopped down to F4/F5 the oof area should have begun to be less smooth with more detail in the OOF areas. As to getting used to the pre-set ap lenses.... The front dial clicks to the whatever you want the highest Ap # to be... then you spin the second dial between wide open and whatever you pre-set as you largest AP. Once you really get used to the preset you hopefully will love it as I do. Also if these are straight from the camera... the K10 can always take a bit of a bump in sharpening in PP, especially on re-size for web shots. Those portraits will sharpen up nicely since the oof area is so beautifully smooth. Having said that, I really like the look of these portraits. I will take that smooth oof area and a slightly softer focus on the faces everytime over a busier OOF look but sharper faces. Does that make sense?

03-22-2009, 12:07 PM	#9
Free Soul Forum Member Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Bulgaria Photos: Gallery Posts: 94 Original Poster	Originally posted by brkl Hmm, are you actually closing the aperture with the dial, rather than simply choosing the aperture? There are two dials you have to use. The portraits do not look like f4 or f5.6 to me. Sorry, if I'll ask a stupid question , but I don't understand...I choose the aperture by turning the lens ring... And then the ring for focusing-distance to get a clear image - and then press the shutter. What do you have in mind? Which two dials? Quote: One dial or ring is for setting the aperture; the other for stopping down to the set aperture for taking the picture. Please explain which one is the other? On the lens the front ring is for setting the aperture - the chosen one is beeng positioned on the red spot. After that ring there is another, with no numbers or graphics on it. It could be turned also, I never used it...??? And the third ring is for the distance - which is for focusing the object... So, do you have in mind the second ring??? If it so, how do you use it? Jewelltrail, thank you. I hope I'll get better...But I expected much more... estudleon, thank you too. I posted here chosen pics, but lot of today's shooting were out of focus. It is not my first M-lens, so I am wondering what is wrong... The pictures are from a church-yard. bc_the_pathq thank you for your advice! May be I shoud buy a viewfinder... Thank you all.

03-22-2009, 12:31 PM	#11
Free Soul Forum Member Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Bulgaria Photos: Gallery Posts: 94 Original Poster	Igilligan, thank you a lot! You also did a great job, even for a Picasa. I was hoping you'll see that thread and post your opinion. I am so, so stupid! I've just test some shots with this second ring - there is a great diffrence! If the ring is set on it's right - not turned - the pics are brighter, softer and almost de-focused. But if I turn the ring clockwise - the shots become sharper and more-contrasted. Is this what you call "stop-down"? I have only read it in some posts, but never knew what is it actually...And how it is correct to be used...

03-22-2009, 12:54 PM	#12
bc_the_path Veteran Member Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Ankara, Turkey Photos: Gallery Posts: 401	The first ring sets the higher limit (say, f/2). The second ring determines the real, functional aperture (like f/4). This is a peculiar behaviour and you must get used to it if you want to use this particular lens. I am sure it is very good for the price (your copy also!).

03-22-2009, 01:31 PM	#14
RonMexico Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: New York Photos: Gallery Posts: 215	I think the shots look good. Do you shoot for work or personal?

03-22-2009, 01:40 PM	#15
Transit Pentaxian Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: Whanganui NZ Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 4,624	Originally posted by Free Soul I am so, so stupid! I've just test some shots with this second ring - there is a great diffrence! If the ring is set on it's right - not turned - the pics are brighter, softer and almost de-focused. But if I turn the ring clockwise - the shots become sharper and more-contrasted. Is this what you call "stop-down"? I have only read it in some posts, but never knew what is it actually...And how it is correct to be used... You are most certainly NOT stupid ! You are in the delicious position of learning about aperture control for the first time ! most of the old hands here have long since lost the glow of first learning Pete