The predestinated K-7 video lens

davidt · 08-04-2009, 03:38 AM

So far my favority lens for shooting K-7 video is the DA* 16-50mm. Good focal length coverage, big zoom and focus ring, great IQ and works very well with the SR in video mode. But there are some things I'm missing:

A very smooth zoom to experiment with zooming techniques. The 16-50mm jumps a bit / is a bit tight when you turn the ring - sometimes it's going faster and sometimers harder to zoom.
A wider aperture. With F2.8 it's great for day-light scenes but for low light/night scenes I guess one would need a F1.4. Most of my LL recordings are dark and noisy (I haven't worked with exposure lock yet).

But most lenses with F1.4 are around 50mm. I found myself more in the 16mm to 30mm range when playing with video (freehand/monopod). The only one I found in that space is the Kiron 24mm F2 but hard to get I think and it's a prime.

Do you think Pentax could even release a dedicated video lens as the GH1 is offered with? Whould love to hear your thoughts - what's your favourite, versatile video lens for the K-7 by now?

ll_coffee_lP · 08-04-2009, 04:39 AM

Sigma makes a 30mm f1.4 lens. That might work better for you. They make some 24mm and 28mm's too that have large ap's.

I haven't used the video function yet on the cam for more than a couple of minutes to try it out...so no favourite lens yet.

c[_]

davidt · 08-04-2009, 04:51 AM

Thanks for the info ll_coffe_IP!

The Sigma sounds good though I would even prefer to be more closer to 20mm. Don't know why - I have no video experience - but I find a wide-angle video frame more pleasant - feels like as you would be in that scene. it's not so compressed.

**Digitalis** · 08-04-2009, 06:02 PM

20mm f/1.4 lenses are a bit thin on the ground. Personally, I'll be using my 50mm f/1.2 for my video stuff...I could probably remake the candlelit scenes from Barry Lyndon with that lens.

kbrabble · 08-04-2009, 09:11 PM

Sigma makes a 20mm f/1.8, not sure how good of a lens it is. I owned its 28mm cousin and it preformed very well.

**Just1MoreDave** · 08-04-2009, 09:31 PM

If I had the K-7, I would try a K or M lens. I might remove the bearing from the aperture ring first for a stepless aperture. I would have manual control of focus and aperture. I doubt I'd be good enough to create meaningful video out of this, but it would be fun.

davidt · 08-06-2009, 01:16 AM

Thanks for you input guys! I think I have to save some money and then going to start collecting old K/M lenses.. ;-) @Digitalis: wow, the F1.2 would be nice!

amaurosis · 08-06-2009, 06:24 AM

Originally posted by Digitalis

20mm f/1.4 lenses are a bit thin on the ground. Personally, I'll be using my 50mm f/1.2 for my video stuff...I could probably remake the candlelit scenes from Barry Lyndon with that lens.

You are kidding, right?

farfisa · 08-06-2009, 06:48 AM

Originally posted by davidt

So far my favority lens for shooting K-7 video is the DA* 16-50mm. Good focal length coverage, big zoom and focus ring, great IQ and works very well with the SR in video mode. But there are some things I'm missing:

A very smooth zoom to experiment with zooming techniques. The 16-50mm jumps a bit / is a bit tight when you turn the ring - sometimes it's going faster and sometimers harder to zoom.
A wider aperture. With F2.8 it's great for day-light scenes but for low light/night scenes I guess one would need a F1.4. Most of my LL recordings are dark and noisy (I haven't worked with exposure lock yet).

But most lenses with F1.4 are around 50mm. I found myself more in the 16mm to 30mm range when playing with video (freehand/monopod). The only one I found in that space is the Kiron 24mm F2 but hard to get I think and it's a prime.

Do you think Pentax could even release a dedicated video lens as the GH1 is offered with? Whould love to hear your thoughts - what's your favourite, versatile video lens for the K-7 by now?

If you want faster than f/2.8, you're definitely looking at a prime lens. (Okay, there's an old Tokina 28-70 that goes out to f/2.6 on the wide end, but that's about it!) The lens for the GH1 starts at f/4, and is just over a stop slower at the long end, so f/2.8 for a zoom is pretty good! Panasonic doesn't have in-body stabilization, so they needed a stabilized quiet focusing lens. If AF worked, you'd already have that in the 16-50!

The Sigma lenses mentioned here might work, but I've never been a fan of their bokeh. The FA*24 f/2 is expensive and hard to find, but that might be a great video lens for you--fast and wide!

If you do want a zoom, some of the older push-pull models might be good for video, where you pull out the barrel to zoom, and rotate to focus. Manual focus is the only option right now for video, so you may as well take advantage of the old cheap glass!

MikePerham · 08-06-2009, 07:58 AM

Originally posted by kbrabble

Sigma makes a 20mm f/1.8, not sure how good of a lens it is. I owned its 28mm cousin and it preformed very well.

I have that lens, also a very good lens. I think the whole series, 20, 24 and 28 were all good and had a really good reputation. Since going digital I have not used it much, thinking of trading it to a DA 14mm, but keep deferring in the hope Pentax will introduce a DA Star version of the Tokina 11-16 f/2.8.

**Digitalis** · 08-06-2009, 09:04 AM

Originally posted by amaurosis

You are kidding, right?

It would be technically possible, but to say I have the same brand of cinematic genius that Stanley kubrick had would be stretching things a bit.

and the sigma 20mm f/1.8 isn't exactly the best 20mm lens out there, sure it's probably one of the fastest.However, it really isn't that sharp in the corners..even when it is stopped down, central resolution is quite high though.

**NaClH2O** · 08-06-2009, 09:13 AM

Dave: Sigma has pretty much got the fast and wide market sewn up. I have the Sigma 24mm F1.4 and it is an excellent lens, but of course it is a prime.
For a video zoom I'd go with farfisa's recommendation for a push/pull zoom. They are called "one touch" because the same ring on the lens controls both zoom and focus. I own the Pentax A 70-710 F4.0 which is a 'one touch' lens and it is a stellar performer, but probably not wide enough for you. You might want to check out the lens Db here or visit B. Dimtrov's wonderful site to find a wider 'one touch' zoom.

NaCl(there is no AF for video anyway, a manual 'one touch' is a good way to go)H2O

amaurosis · 08-06-2009, 09:35 AM

Originally posted by Digitalis

It would be technically possible, but to say I have the same brand of cinematic genius that Stanley kubrick had would be stretching things a bit.

Kubrick used ultra sensitive film and a Zeiss 50mm F/0.7 MF prototype lens originally designed for NASA to shoot those candle-lit scenes which he actually had to modify to obtain a wider field of view (and for other things). So the aperture alone was almost two stops faster. No disrespect intended but I have some doubts you can replicate that

Edit: Oh, you actually even posted the link to that site.

**Digitalis** · 08-06-2009, 05:01 PM

Originally posted by amaurosis

Kubrick used ultra sensitive film and a Zeiss 50mm F/0.7 MF prototype lens originally designed for NASA to shoot those candle-lit scenes which he actually had to modify to obtain a wider field of view (and for other things). So the aperture alone was almost two stops faster. No disrespect intended but I have some doubts you can replicate that

Edit: Oh, you actually even posted the link to that site.

due to the light absorption of air, it's impossible to make a lens faster than f/0.5 and the adapters that he used to make that 50mm lens in to a 36.6mm lens actually made the lens slightly slower, not faster and it certainly didn't do wonders as far as it's handling of chromatic aberrations.. Kubrick actually push developed the film for the candle lit scenes to the best of my knowledge the fastest cine film available in the early to mid 1970s was about ISO 500 and he pushed it to ISO 1000 so, ISO 3200 with a 50mm f/1.2 works out to roughly the same exposure on a 50mm f/0.7 give or take a 1/3rd of a stop.

nostatic · 08-06-2009, 06:02 PM

Originally posted by Digitalis

due to the light absorption of air, it's impossible to make a lens faster than f/0.5 and the adapters that he used to make that 50mm lens in to a 36.6mm lens actually made the lens slightly slower, not faster and it certainly didn't do wonders as far as it's handling of chromatic aberrations.. Kubrick actually push developed the film for the candle lit scenes to the best of my knowledge the fastest cine film available in the early to mid 1970s was about ISO 500 and he pushed it to ISO 1000 so, ISO 3200 with a 50mm f/1.2 works out to roughly the same exposure on a 50mm f/0.7 give or take a 1/3rd of a stop.

It still was an annoying film.

It took me three sittings to get through it. At some point I was so mad I viewed it as a personal challenge to make it to the end.

I love Kubrick but that film had some serious issues. Not the least of which was Ryan O'Neal's "what country am I from now" drifting accent.

08-04-2009, 03:38 AM	#1
davidt Forum Member Join Date: Apr 2009 Location: Vienna Posts: 50	The predestinated K-7 video lens So far my favority lens for shooting K-7 video is the DA* 16-50mm. Good focal length coverage, big zoom and focus ring, great IQ and works very well with the SR in video mode. But there are some things I'm missing: A very smooth zoom to experiment with zooming techniques. The 16-50mm jumps a bit / is a bit tight when you turn the ring - sometimes it's going faster and sometimers harder to zoom. A wider aperture. With F2.8 it's great for day-light scenes but for low light/night scenes I guess one would need a F1.4. Most of my LL recordings are dark and noisy (I haven't worked with exposure lock yet). But most lenses with F1.4 are around 50mm. I found myself more in the 16mm to 30mm range when playing with video (freehand/monopod). The only one I found in that space is the Kiron 24mm F2 but hard to get I think and it's a prime. Do you think Pentax could even release a dedicated video lens as the GH1 is offered with? Whould love to hear your thoughts - what's your favourite, versatile video lens for the K-7 by now?

08-06-2009, 06:48 AM	#9
farfisa Veteran Member Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: Toronto, Canada Photos: Gallery Posts: 1,274	Originally posted by davidt So far my favority lens for shooting K-7 video is the DA* 16-50mm. Good focal length coverage, big zoom and focus ring, great IQ and works very well with the SR in video mode. But there are some things I'm missing: A very smooth zoom to experiment with zooming techniques. The 16-50mm jumps a bit / is a bit tight when you turn the ring - sometimes it's going faster and sometimers harder to zoom. A wider aperture. With F2.8 it's great for day-light scenes but for low light/night scenes I guess one would need a F1.4. Most of my LL recordings are dark and noisy (I haven't worked with exposure lock yet). But most lenses with F1.4 are around 50mm. I found myself more in the 16mm to 30mm range when playing with video (freehand/monopod). The only one I found in that space is the Kiron 24mm F2 but hard to get I think and it's a prime. Do you think Pentax could even release a dedicated video lens as the GH1 is offered with? Whould love to hear your thoughts - what's your favourite, versatile video lens for the K-7 by now? If you want faster than f/2.8, you're definitely looking at a prime lens. (Okay, there's an old Tokina 28-70 that goes out to f/2.6 on the wide end, but that's about it!) The lens for the GH1 starts at f/4, and is just over a stop slower at the long end, so f/2.8 for a zoom is pretty good! Panasonic doesn't have in-body stabilization, so they needed a stabilized quiet focusing lens. If AF worked, you'd already have that in the 16-50! The Sigma lenses mentioned here might work, but I've never been a fan of their bokeh. The FA*24 f/2 is expensive and hard to find, but that might be a great video lens for you--fast and wide! If you do want a zoom, some of the older push-pull models might be good for video, where you pull out the barrel to zoom, and rotate to focus. Manual focus is the only option right now for video, so you may as well take advantage of the old cheap glass!

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08-04-2009, 04:39 AM	#2
ll_coffee_lP Inactive Account Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: Ontario, Canada Posts: 1,972	Sigma makes a 30mm f1.4 lens. That might work better for you. They make some 24mm and 28mm's too that have large ap's. I haven't used the video function yet on the cam for more than a couple of minutes to try it out...so no favourite lens yet. c[_]

08-04-2009, 04:51 AM	#3
davidt Forum Member Join Date: Apr 2009 Location: Vienna Posts: 50 Original Poster	Thanks for the info ll_coffe_IP! The Sigma sounds good though I would even prefer to be more closer to 20mm. Don't know why - I have no video experience - but I find a wide-angle video frame more pleasant - feels like as you would be in that scene. it's not so compressed.

08-04-2009, 06:02 PM	#4
Digitalis Site Supporter Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Melbourne, Victoria Photos: Gallery Posts: 11,694	20mm f/1.4 lenses are a bit thin on the ground. Personally, I'll be using my 50mm f/1.2 for my video stuff...I could probably remake the candlelit scenes from Barry Lyndon with that lens.

08-04-2009, 09:11 PM	#5
kbrabble Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2006 Posts: 181	Sigma makes a 20mm f/1.8, not sure how good of a lens it is. I owned its 28mm cousin and it preformed very well.

08-04-2009, 09:31 PM	#6
Just1MoreDave Site Supporter Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Aurora, CO Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 6,340	If I had the K-7, I would try a K or M lens. I might remove the bearing from the aperture ring first for a stepless aperture. I would have manual control of focus and aperture. I doubt I'd be good enough to create meaningful video out of this, but it would be fun.

08-06-2009, 01:16 AM	#7
davidt Forum Member Join Date: Apr 2009 Location: Vienna Posts: 50 Original Poster	Thanks for you input guys! I think I have to save some money and then going to start collecting old K/M lenses.. ;-) @Digitalis: wow, the F1.2 would be nice!

08-06-2009, 06:24 AM	#8
amaurosis Forum Member Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Vienna Posts: 96	Originally posted by Digitalis 20mm f/1.4 lenses are a bit thin on the ground. Personally, I'll be using my 50mm f/1.2 for my video stuff...I could probably remake the candlelit scenes from Barry Lyndon with that lens. You are kidding, right?

08-06-2009, 07:58 AM	#10
MikePerham Veteran Member Join Date: May 2007 Location: Prince George, BC Canada Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 642	Originally posted by kbrabble Sigma makes a 20mm f/1.8, not sure how good of a lens it is. I owned its 28mm cousin and it preformed very well. I have that lens, also a very good lens. I think the whole series, 20, 24 and 28 were all good and had a really good reputation. Since going digital I have not used it much, thinking of trading it to a DA 14mm, but keep deferring in the hope Pentax will introduce a DA Star version of the Tokina 11-16 f/2.8.

08-06-2009, 09:04 AM	#11
Digitalis Site Supporter Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Melbourne, Victoria Photos: Gallery Posts: 11,694	Originally posted by amaurosis You are kidding, right? It would be technically possible, but to say I have the same brand of cinematic genius that Stanley kubrick had would be stretching things a bit. and the sigma 20mm f/1.8 isn't exactly the best 20mm lens out there, sure it's probably one of the fastest.However, it really isn't that sharp in the corners..even when it is stopped down, central resolution is quite high though.

08-06-2009, 09:13 AM	#12
NaClH2O Site Supporter Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Bronx NY Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 5,631	Dave: Sigma has pretty much got the fast and wide market sewn up. I have the Sigma 24mm F1.4 and it is an excellent lens, but of course it is a prime. For a video zoom I'd go with farfisa's recommendation for a push/pull zoom. They are called "one touch" because the same ring on the lens controls both zoom and focus. I own the Pentax A 70-710 F4.0 which is a 'one touch' lens and it is a stellar performer, but probably not wide enough for you. You might want to check out the lens Db here or visit B. Dimtrov's wonderful site to find a wider 'one touch' zoom. NaCl(there is no AF for video anyway, a manual 'one touch' is a good way to go)H2O

08-06-2009, 09:35 AM	#13
amaurosis Forum Member Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Vienna Posts: 96	Originally posted by Digitalis It would be technically possible, but to say I have the same brand of cinematic genius that Stanley kubrick had would be stretching things a bit. Kubrick used ultra sensitive film and a Zeiss 50mm F/0.7 MF prototype lens originally designed for NASA to shoot those candle-lit scenes which he actually had to modify to obtain a wider field of view (and for other things). So the aperture alone was almost two stops faster. No disrespect intended but I have some doubts you can replicate that Edit: Oh, you actually even posted the link to that site.

08-06-2009, 05:01 PM	#14
Digitalis Site Supporter Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Melbourne, Victoria Photos: Gallery Posts: 11,694	Originally posted by amaurosis Kubrick used ultra sensitive film and a Zeiss 50mm F/0.7 MF prototype lens originally designed for NASA to shoot those candle-lit scenes which he actually had to modify to obtain a wider field of view (and for other things). So the aperture alone was almost two stops faster. No disrespect intended but I have some doubts you can replicate that Edit: Oh, you actually even posted the link to that site. due to the light absorption of air, it's impossible to make a lens faster than f/0.5 and the adapters that he used to make that 50mm lens in to a 36.6mm lens actually made the lens slightly slower, not faster and it certainly didn't do wonders as far as it's handling of chromatic aberrations.. Kubrick actually push developed the film for the candle lit scenes to the best of my knowledge the fastest cine film available in the early to mid 1970s was about ISO 500 and he pushed it to ISO 1000 so, ISO 3200 with a 50mm f/1.2 works out to roughly the same exposure on a 50mm f/0.7 give or take a 1/3rd of a stop.

08-06-2009, 06:02 PM	#15
nostatic Veteran Member Join Date: Feb 2008 Location: socal Photos: Gallery Posts: 1,575	Originally posted by Digitalis due to the light absorption of air, it's impossible to make a lens faster than f/0.5 and the adapters that he used to make that 50mm lens in to a 36.6mm lens actually made the lens slightly slower, not faster and it certainly didn't do wonders as far as it's handling of chromatic aberrations.. Kubrick actually push developed the film for the candle lit scenes to the best of my knowledge the fastest cine film available in the early to mid 1970s was about ISO 500 and he pushed it to ISO 1000 so, ISO 3200 with a 50mm f/1.2 works out to roughly the same exposure on a 50mm f/0.7 give or take a 1/3rd of a stop. It still was an annoying film. It took me three sittings to get through it. At some point I was so mad I viewed it as a personal challenge to make it to the end. I love Kubrick but that film had some serious issues. Not the least of which was Ryan O'Neal's "what country am I from now" drifting accent.