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08-30-2009, 10:22 AM   #46
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QuoteOriginally posted by Lowell Goudge Quote
it is not a question of exclusive use, but the ability to do so when you need it.
And, if I may add my comment, the brighter viewfinder with the faster lens is very useful when framing your shot in available light photos, even if you are shooting at f2.8 for the DOF.

08-30-2009, 10:54 AM   #47
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I think better buy the Tamron 90mm f2.8 so you can use the same lens also for macro.

Note:
Personally I use the less expensive 50 mm f/1.7 and i'm very happy.
08-30-2009, 12:32 PM   #48
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QuoteOriginally posted by rparmar Quote
Well, normally I do not post negative comments on photos. I try to be nice and reserve positive comments for those shots that jump out at me. Plus constructive ciriticism when I find I can offer any.
but if the photo is lacking something, point this out can be helpful to both the photographer and to others looking at the lens. In this case the issues you have may not actually be against the lens but against me as a photograoher, or the photographic situation
QuoteQuote:

But now that you have called me on it, I will state that the image you post has no impact for me at all. If it is wide open I think it is good for sharpness, but if it is stopped down much, as I suspect it might be, then it is simply unimpressive. By which I mean that much much cheaper lenses could do as well.
this just might prove that cost of equipment does not make one a photographer. I don't normally do people
QuoteQuote:

You ask "what would the other lenses do differently?" Roger's cat photo has contrast, definition and sharpness plus a perfect sense of "rightness" that your shot lacks. I have seen these positive attributes of the DA70 time and again. The only reason I do not recommend it, is that for very little more on the used market you can get the significant speed increase the FA77 offers.
but would another lens do differently under uniform flat lighting of a flat character? that was the question. remember this is with available lighting which was not ideal
QuoteQuote:

Perhaps your shot is not an optimal example. But it is the one you put forward and the only one I can critique. Perhaps too, the rather "muzzy" look suits the subject in this case. In the meantime I am still waiting for a crisp incisive image from this lens that shows it is worth the money.
as for your other comment about haze over the image, it was misty at the time, not rain but fine fog or mist.
08-30-2009, 02:40 PM   #49
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Lowell, I wonder then why you posted this image as an example of something great from that lens. Doing so and then explaining away the problems as due to other factors is moving the goalposts.

08-30-2009, 03:19 PM   #50
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QuoteOriginally posted by rparmar Quote
Lowell, I wonder then why you posted this image as an example of something great from that lens. Doing so and then explaining away the problems as due to other factors is moving the goalposts.
As I said, people pictures are not presently my strong point, however, the image I took under the conditions I believed showed whgat the lens could do.

you obviously have different opinions, but in finding nothing technically wrong with the lens, and the images I have taken to date, I wanted you to explain why you don't like the lens.

I am trying to find out if what yo don't like is the lens or the photos
08-30-2009, 04:57 PM   #51
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I will try to explain my thinking

QuoteOriginally posted by Lowell Goudge Quote
I am trying to find out if what yo don't like is the lens or the photos
Since I do not have the lens, the only way I can critique it is through the photos other people present. I must try to judge these in terms of the qualities the lens is imparting, eliminating all other factors. That is difficult. But I am trying to judge the lens not the photos themselves. This can only be done by seeing quite a few photos from quite a few people.

If we are paying for f/1.4 but the lens is not perfect at that aperture, fine enough. No lens is optimal at its widest aperture (well, maybe old Sonnars are). But if we are paying for f/1.4 and the lens is not even usable at that aperture and not even so great stopped down once or twice, then I have to question the value in it. Especially when there are cheaper alternatives that are sharper and render nicer.

At the other end of the scale, an FA77 does not cost the moon. Compared to top-end Canon, Nikon, Zeiss etc. it is a complete bargain. (In fact do some of these makes even have a lens as good?) Saving a couple hundred by getting a significantly inferior lens is no bargain to me. And I am not rich; far from it.

Ultimately, however, if you are happy with the lens you are using I am not going to say you are incorrect. We all need to find the tools that suit our own ambitions and preferences. I have found that I'm pretty darned picky. This may not be a blessing, but a curse, depending on your point of view!

Anyway, I think we are way off topic here! So here's a photo that isn't a portrait, but was shot with the FA77.

08-31-2009, 09:38 PM   #52
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QuoteOriginally posted by Lowell Goudge Quote

as for your other comment about haze over the image, it was misty at the time, not rain but fine fog or mist.
Frankly, I don't see any haze, fog or mist in the image in question. But I've seen this slight "haze" often showing up in some of my images (taken with the da70), though the image needs to be blown up to ~50% before I can see any of it. May be the presence of strong reflected light has something to do with it. This seems to be affecting all f-stops. Someone had suggested that this could be motion/lens blurr, and a little extra sharpening in PP tends to be required.

While I'm at it, may I inquire, if you remember, where exactly you had focused on in that pic? I'm finding that if there isn't sufficient contrast at the focus point, my k20d/DA70 can run into trouble locking focus (unlike with DA40). Torso of those dogs can fall into that scenario. My neighbor has a black lab, and I had a hard time focusing on it -- it wasn't moving at the time -- as if the focus point had simply gotten lost in its blackness.
09-06-2009, 06:30 PM   #53
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QuoteOriginally posted by MikePerham Quote
And, if I may add my comment, the brighter viewfinder with the faster lens is very useful when framing your shot in available light photos, even if you are shooting at f2.8 for the DOF.

most DSLR viewfinders are pretty much at maximum brightness at f/2.8 so the difference is negligible. put on a f/1.4 lens on your DSLR if you have one and use the DOF preview. there's isn't any difference in brightness between f/1.4 and f/2 ....but wait that can't be right?

09-06-2009, 07:30 PM   #54
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I have noticed a lot of forum members suggest the FA77, a fabulous lens I am sure, but mainly suggest it over the DA70 because of the extra 1/2 stop. Now when comparing prices to other systems, I do think you must be fair, and realize that the canon 85mm is much more expensive because it is a F1.2, correct? I have seen fantastic shots from Canon 85mm L, 135L, and Nikon 85 as well. These lenses carry a larger price tag, for the very same reason I would imagine that the 77 is more than the 70.. it's faster at 1.8. The Canon 88 1.2 is HUGE.. that glass isn't free.

I am going to try the 70 myself, and if I don't like it, I will try the 77, but one thing that does bother me from the 77 is the bokeh. In some shots, it is just too busy, or or linear.. I don't know how to describe it, but it does, in some shots, like your flower shot, it causes distraction.

QuoteOriginally posted by rparmar Quote
... At the other end of the scale, an FA77 does not cost the moon. Compared to top-end Canon, Nikon, Zeiss etc. it is a complete bargain. (In fact do some of these makes even have a lens as good?) Saving a couple hundred by getting a significantly inferior lens is no bargain to me. And I am not rich; far from it.
09-06-2009, 09:28 PM   #55
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I recieved my 70 Limited on Friday, so far have been very impressed. IQ is great wide open, I don't think I've even bothered to try shooting stopped down yet. The build quality is exceptional (better than my M lense if only by a little).

Shot wide open in RAW, no sharpening or other PP. It would seem that cat ownership is a common trait of DA70 users...
09-07-2009, 12:00 AM   #56
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QuoteOriginally posted by designinme_1976 Quote
but one thing that does bother me from the 77 is the bokeh. In some shots, it is just too busy, or or linear.. I don't know how to describe it, but it does, in some shots, like your flower shot, it causes distraction.
you're certainly entitled to your opinion, and bokeh is a very subjective thing. however, I'll say in the FA77's defence that most people these days really don't understand bokeh well enough to know when a particular background is going to cause problems. And people often use DOF that is skirting on the precipice of being inappropriately shallow for the subject. - the bamboo is a good example of when bokeh really works with an image. the butterfly shot is a very good example where the background really gets in the way. - my excuse for that is I was testing how well HSS worked, the motion of the bees wings has been frozen perfectly at 1/2000th

Last edited by Digitalis; 08-31-2010 at 05:22 PM.
09-07-2009, 01:10 AM   #57
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QuoteOriginally posted by designinme_1976 Quote
I am going to try the 70 myself, and if I don't like it, I will try the 77, but one thing that does bother me from the 77 is the bokeh. In some shots, it is just too busy, or or linear.. I don't know how to describe it, but it does, in some shots, like your flower shot, it causes distraction.
Of course some circumstances limit how much one can throw the background OOF. And some backgrounds are simply busy.

But I really love the look of the FA77 bokeh. It is nice and smooth. I cannot stand the swirly bokeh on my Cosina 50/1.2 and that common to some Russian lenses.
09-08-2009, 10:19 AM   #58
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Probably should have stopped down a bit to get the whole fungus in focus, but didn't want to bump the ISO up.

Can't complain about the background though!

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