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11-18-2009, 06:38 PM   #16
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QuoteOriginally posted by K McCall Quote
...

DA 12-24 for the wide end - I just can't justify any of the new primes because this lens isn't very big to begin with and shoots f/4 through the whole zoom range
FA 31/1.8
FA 43/1.9
FA 77/1.8
D-FA 100mm Macro

The one place where I see I might be lacking is in the 50-ish range, but so far none of the 50's have really grabbed my attention and made me think I _had_ to have it.
I think you hit it right on. What a wonderful lens lineup. Practical too!

As far as 50s are concerned, I have a whole bunch on my shelf and three float to the top. All are inexpensive, two ridiculously so, and all three are on my "will not sell" list:
  • Pentax-K 55/1.8
  • Auto-Rikenon 50/1.7 (M42) (has pixie dust)
  • Helios 44M 58/2 (M42) (has even more pixie dust)
Of the three, the Pentax-K is technically the best, but it is the lowly Helios that mates to the K10D most often. If you get a chance to pick up a Helios, give it a try. It is not in the same league as your FA 43 Limited, but it has its charms.

Steve

(Would also like a fast lens in the 20mm range...say something like a A 20/2.8...though I would be happy with the FA* 24/2...)


Last edited by stevebrot; 11-18-2009 at 06:50 PM.
11-19-2009, 01:16 AM   #17
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QuoteOriginally posted by Marc Sabatella Quote
This is of course a hopeless subjective question, as it depends not only on focal length preferences, but also questions as to how many lenses one wants to carry, how much one values small size over large aperture, and other equally subjective decisions. Not to mention, how much wants to spend. If this is truly a discussion of an "ideal" lineup, that wouldn't matter, but still, it's hard not to take that into consideration at least a little. Toss in the fact that some who might otherwise feel similarly on any of the above matters might feel differently regarding the preference for primes over zooms, or the need for AF, or the need for FF. And if you do consider the need for FF, how much of a compromise should that involve in choosing focal lengths (eg, choosing focal lengths tht are *perfect* for APS-C but so-so for FF, versus choosing focal lengths that are "OK" on both, etc.

I figure the chance of getting someone who feels exactly the same as you on all these counts is close to zero. So despite the fact that my own lineup is not FF-friendly at all, and I don't value AF enough to compromise (much) on focal length or price, here's what I have settled on, and I think it's "almost" perfect for me:

DA15
M28/2.8
DA40
DA70
<longer telephoto TBA>

Right now, the longer telephoto varies between the M135/3.5 (the default choice), but sometimes the M100/2.8, and sometimes the DA50-200. The 135/3.5 is really a fine compromise choice here, but I do like the 100/2.8 for being faster, and the 50-200 for being longer (as well as being a zoom and having AF). A 135/2.8 would be a possibility, but I dumped the one I had as it was just too big and heavy for what I wanted. Which is why I keep thinking the M120/2.8 may be in my future (unless a DA version comes out before I get around to it!)

The gap between 15 and 28 isn't bothering me much. I just added the 15 recently, and didn't really see the need for a lens "just a little" wider than the 28 very often before I got the 15. I was using the 18-55 when I needed wide, and found I used it right at 18, or in the 28-43 range, a lot, but rarely anywhere between 18 and 28.

I'm comfortable with pretty large gaps in my focal length range because I prefer fewer lenses over more lenses, but also prefer primes to zooms overall, and am OK with cropping if need be (took a while to overcome that reluctance, but having that available in non-destructive RAW processing helped). I do find that I like the pairing of 28 and 40 - the smallest gap in my lineup. If I compromised on a 35 instead of those two, I'd probably rethink whether maybe a 24 would also make sense, so I might still end up with the same number of lenses. And I think the idea of having two lenses relatively close to each other around the "normal" FOV - and bigger gaps the further I get from there - makes intuitive sense to me.

If Pentax put out a new DA lens somewhere near 28 - not longer, but maybe as short as, say, 27 or 26 - I might buy it replace the 28. But I don't think a 24 or a 30 would be an improvement for me in terms of focal length. 24 would open up the gap betwene that and 40 too much, 30 would close it too much. My usage of my 18-55 - which has peaks around 28 and 40 - convicnes me I'm doing about as well as I can there.
I see what you're saying Marc and I do agree with you. It just happened that by chances I ended up with 31/40/50 and it's hard for me to let any of those 3 go.
Originally I started out with DA18-55 and then got Sigma 10-20 to cover the wide end. Then I thought I'd get one prime and I'm done.... what a mistake
My wife got for me DA40, great lens and I love it to bits. But it made me embark on the journey of looking for something between 40 and 20. I got Tokina 28/2.8MF. I loved the FOV but not the lens, plus I'm rubbish in MF. I let it go and by sheer luck came to deal on F50/1.7 in mint condition. I exchanged it for never used poor quality zoom I had bought for £20. I couldn't believe my luck. I knew 40-50 is close gap but 1.5 stops difference and those extra few mms for portraits coupled with the price, and it was no brainer. Until now I love the output of this lens but out of my Pentax trio it's the least used one...
Just few months down the line Jessops UK decided to discontinue Pentax and the branch just down the road from my workplace had silver 31ltd. They offered manager's special £342.50 - brand new with warranty etc. When I first bought Pentax I never thought I'd be able to afford this lens and as the mms are close to 28 I was after I went for it. No regrets at all. Outstanding lens, just it's bit closer to 40 than I wanted.
Now out of 31-40-50 the first to are used most. Nearly 1:1 ratio with only few tens of pics difference in hundreds. I like the line up of 10-20/31/50 but I'm not willing to let my 40 go.
And the worst thing was that I got my hand on Sigma 24/2.8 AF. I fell in love with the FOV but again not with the lens so I let it go and I'm looking for replacement.
It's almost as if I'm considering 2 line ups.
a) heavy: 10-20/31/50/105 macro (for now)
b) light: 24/40
and then of course there's all those "I'd like to have but never really use them" lenses
oh well....
11-19-2009, 11:56 AM   #18
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I have post4ed the basic concept of this several times, and as others have stated, lens choise and focal length choise is a personal thing, but as a gereral approach, this is what I think should be the target of anyone who develops a serious interest in photography.

You need to plan to cover a ragne of 10mm to 400 mm (assuming ASP-C sensor)

For as much of that range as financially possible you should try to go F2.8 or faster, so here is what it breaks down to.

an ultra wide zoom SIgma 10-20, pentax 12-24 or tamron 10-24
a middle of the road lens but at F2.8 constant aperture
pentax 16-50 F2.8
sigma 24-60 or 24-70 F2.8
tamron 28-75 F2.8
or any other lens at F2.8 in this focal length range

A good tele zoom
tamron or Sigma 70-200 F2.8
pentax 50-135 F2.8


The decision of what lenses above and whether you go for a 70-200 or 50-135 zoom are up to personal use. If you do a lot of wild life then a 70-200 plus a really good TC is better than the 50-135

If you don't plan to do wild life or you plan to get something like the da 300F4 or perhaps either pentax or sigma 300 F2.8 then you might go for the 50-135.

ALso how you cover any gaps in the zoom range might need to be considered.

I have the sigma 10-20 and tamron 28-75, and fill the gap with a SMC FA-J 18-35 F4-5.6

But no matter how you cut it, these 3 or 4 zooms will form the backbone of any lens kit. For me, they make up my travel kit when combined with a 2X Sigma TC.

You can then add primes, for specific use such as portrait, low light etc. if you feel inclined, but the bottom line is that no matter the approach, you need to consider how to cover between 10mm at the wide end, and 135-200 mm at the long end, with a way to get to 300-400mm for wild life if you shoot it.

My approach is with 4 good AF zooms, and then MF primes from 24-135mm plus 300F4 and 400 F5.6
11-19-2009, 01:51 PM   #19
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here's a suitable M42 lineup of very lovable lenses that wouldn't break the bank (the money's on the 80mm)....

zenith 16mm
czj flektogon 35mm f2.4
czj pancolar 50mm f1.8 or Yashinon dx 50mm f1.4
czj pancolar 80mm f1.8
czj mc sonnar 135mm f3.5

in the realms of AF dreams i'd perhaps go
12-24 f4
fa31 f1.8
maybe 55 f1.4 or da70 if i felt the 50-135 couldn't satisfy with portraits
50-135 f2.8

in AF slightly-smaller-budget-land I'd go
sigma 10-20
tamron 28-75
fa43 f1.9
pentax 55-300
raynox macro

in reality i've a hotchpotch of some of the above-mentioned lenses and some others - gotta love LBA.

11-19-2009, 02:54 PM   #20
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Here are my favorites from my collection. FL selection is based on using a fully manual film camera.

Ultra Wide: K18/3.5
Wide: K28/2
Standard: K50/1.2
Short Telephoto/Portrait: K85/1.8 or K105/2.8
Medium Telephoto: K135/2.5 or K200/2.5
Long Telephoto: K500/4.5
Macro: K50/4


Phil.
11-19-2009, 03:10 PM   #21
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this is a fun thread to watch...

I've always been a zoom person and my first lenses for Pentax were fast F2.8 zooms, but their size got 'old' to be. I have since gravitated to a lineup that I consider close to ideal, using mainly primes.

Three autofocus limiteds for great IQ in a small package. I could go out with these and pretty much cover 90% of my shooting.
DA15
FA43
DA70

I also suppliment the 'in between' with some great M lenses (and focussing became much easier with the K-7).
M28 F3.5
M50 F1.7
M135 F3.5

I also have a 18-55 WR for times when the weather turns wet or shooting near water.

With the above, I feel like I have some excellent glass without spending huge (still spent too much!). I'd like to add a telephoto prime and since the DA* 200/300 lenses are too much $$$, I am trying to seek a nice M200 or even M*300. In addition, I will be adding the DA55-300 - it's just a matter of time before I feel comfortable swinging the purchase.

Well, that's my ideal lineup that I can afford. I won't even get into my dreaming...


QuoteOriginally posted by axl Quote
Hi everybody,

I know this is very personal decision and there is million answers with million reasons behind them. But...
What would you say is THE ideal/ultimate line up, from wide/moderate wide to short tele, preferably primes, preferably AF and preferably FF capable?
My current line up is 10-20, 31/1.8, 40/2.8/, 50/1.7, 105/2.8
I was thinking of bank breaker like: 24/2, 31/1.8, 43/1.9, 50/1.7, 77/1.8. but that would put a LOT of strain on my savings and quality of life for months/years to come. Would it be worth it if
there is a LOT of cheap(ish) manual options like K55/1.8 (is it worth it if F50/1.7 is in already?) K/A 24/2.8 (???), M85/2 etc.... And is it worth swapping 40 for 43? I do like DA40, just about everything about it but at times I wish it was faster.
any ideas, comments and suggestions are welcome.
Please don't read preferable as must be.

TIA
Peter
11-19-2009, 03:18 PM   #22
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IMO:

DA 12-24mm
FA 20-35mm
DA 40mm
DA* 50-135mm
FA* 80-200mm
FA* 85mm
FA* 200mm macro

And that just about covers everything! It's what I usually bring on trips, except I pick either the macro or the 80-200, and either the 12-24mm or the 20-35mm; not both!

Adam
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11-19-2009, 04:22 PM   #23
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QuoteOriginally posted by axl Quote
What would you say is THE ideal/ultimate line up, from wide/moderate wide to short tele, preferably primes, preferably AF and preferably FF capable?
My current line up is 10-20, 31/1.8, 40/2.8/, 50/1.7, 105/2.8
I was thinking of bank breaker like: 24/2, 31/1.8, 43/1.9, 50/1.7, 77/1.8. but that would put a LOT of strain on my savings and quality of life for months/years to come.
For a 35mm prime kit I'd want; extra wide, wide, normal, portrait and tele. I like the 1.4X rule, so 24-35-50-70-100. (31mm normal and 105mm with your kit).

I have the FA 35mm f2, FA 50mm f1.4 and D FA 100mm macro. I'm missing the FA*24mm f2 and a portrait lens. I don't have a film camera, but maybe one of these days.

11-19-2009, 04:40 PM   #24
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Dream Team Zoom kit (APS-C):
Nikon wideangle zoom / Tokina 11-16/2.8
16-50/2.8 and/or 16-45/4
Any 24-70/2.8 for single lens solution (does a bad 24(28)-70/2.8 exist?)
Canon 70-200/4 IS and/or 70-200/2.8 IS

Dream Team Prime kit (Pentax only):
DA 15 / Sigma dp-1
DA 35macro for single lens solution
Either the Three amigos (FA lims) or the Three dwarves (DA lims) or a mix of both
DA* 200
Raynox 150 + 250

Why nothing between 77 and 200; I tried several lengths in between and never really enjoyed a prime on those ranges... 55-300 would be good to cover the hole

And everyone should throw in the DA / Tokina 10-17 FE in their kit because that lens is just so much fun...

And current kit... if anyone wants to bother
K10d + taks
K100d (soon k-x) + the digital stuff
MZ-L/7 + the film stuff minus taks + DA 10-17
ME Super + taks

Last edited by Andi Lo; 11-19-2009 at 04:57 PM.
11-19-2009, 04:51 PM   #25
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The assembly of my lens collection has been anything but planned. I was startled the other day to realize that I can basically do anything I want with just a few of my lenses:

FA 20-35
DA 35
F 50/1.7
FAJ 75-300

I am sure the DA 55-300 is better than the FAJ, but I don't use the length much anyway, so 1/3 the cost appeals. And I am hanging on to my Tokina 90mm macro, A 50/1.2, DA40, f35-70, vivitar 85/1.8; among many others.
11-19-2009, 07:50 PM   #26
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I had a bag full of lenses which just made me frustrated when I was about to go out and take pictures. Could never really decide what to use, and after selling off a lot of lenses I try to go simplistic.

When walking in the forrest, enjoying nature photography, the set-up is:
DA*16-50, DA*50-135 and DA*300
Flexible, weather sealed, silent a.s.o.

For day to day photography in the city (prime set-up):
FA*24, FA50/1,4, FA*85

I am still thinkin of selling the DA*50-135 and the FA50 just to narrow down the
lens collection to a few lenses that I can "learn" and use fully. So maybe the set-up will be DA*16-50 as the flexible solution, the FA*24 & FA*85 as the standard prime setup, and the DA*300 as the lens I just cannot part with. It is just that good!

Who knows.. the lens strategy seems to change for every season..
11-19-2009, 10:22 PM   #27
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While it wouldn't necessarily meet your requirements, my ideal kit would be as follows:

DA* 16-50mm
FA 20-35mm
FA 31mm Ltd.
A 50mm f1.2
FA* 85mm
DA* 50-135mm
A* 200mm Macro
Sigma 100-300mm f4 or DA* 300mm

I'd also love to have FA* 200mm Macro, and something like an A* 400mm f2.8/300mm f2.8/600mm f4 although the latter would probably not see much use. Of course, I also wouldn't turn down any other great lenses.
11-19-2009, 10:54 PM   #28
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QuoteOriginally posted by Adam Quote
DA 12-24mm
FA 20-35mm
DA 40mm
DA* 50-135mm
FA* 80-200mm
FA* 85mm
FA* 200mm macro
You have a stronger back than I..

As I just came back to Pentax I have purchased the lineup I want based on years of experience having owned or used a very large range of pentax lenses..

DA 15/4
FA 31/1.8
DA 70/2.4
Voigtlander 90/3.5 Close focus

It is almost complete, the only three missing are the FA50/1.4 and voigtlander 58/1.4 and 180/4... The 50/1.4 I am working on as we speak and the other two will hopefully appear one day soon.. though the 180/4 is getting a bit too expensive for what it is.. The DA70 I may let go of in order to get one of the voigtlanders, time will tell ;-)
11-20-2009, 12:25 AM   #29
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QuoteOriginally posted by joele Quote
...It is almost complete, the only three missing... are the FA50/1.4 and voigtlander 58/1.4 and 180/4... The 50/1.4 I am working on as we speak and the other two will hopefully appear one day soon.. though the 180/4 is getting a bit too expensive for what it is.. The DA70 I may let go of in order to get one of the voigtlanders, time will tell ;-)
That's what I like to call the beginning of LBA

How is the DA 15mm/4 treating you? I've got the A 15mm/3.5, but obviously it's not as compact...and I'd love to have any excuse to finally pick up a DA limited other than my pancake!

Adam
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11-20-2009, 02:48 AM   #30
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Ohh it is more than begun, it has come and gone for years, you never really get over it ;-)

The 15/4 is fine, I wouldn't say it is amazing quality, in the past I had a Sigma 10-20 for UWA, and the 15/4 is optically better but not a huge amount... BUT when you consider size, weight, filter size (compatability with other lenses) then it moves ahead.. Plenty of times I used to leave my 10-20mm at home, with the 15/4 there is no reason not to take it along.. its just so handy/small..

Last edited by joele; 11-20-2009 at 04:31 AM.
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