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01-23-2010, 10:11 PM   #181
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Guys, watching you talk about "DA*" lenses makes one thin the "*" is a place holder for an expletive.

QuoteOriginally posted by Ash Quote

Pentax Imaging Company in the US has analyzed our sales and repair data. This information shows us that the warranty repair rate on all SDM lenses is at, or in most cases well below our normal return rate.
I too wonder what the after warranty repair figures look like.

As much I would like to believe that the response Ash received is the awaited confirmation that our perceived SDM problem has been blown out of proportion and doesn't exist in reality, it makes me wonder what other things go wrong with lenses. Apart from lenses being decentred from the factory, I've never read about any problems regarding AF, apertures, etc. to an extent I've read about SDM problems. If the SDM figures only look "normal" because the optical QC isn't what it should be either then that wouldn't be good news.

Finally, if the rep can make these statements authoritatively, why didn't get Peter Zack a similar reply?

I'd like to believe that there is no real SDM issue but somehow the responses we've had so far haven't removed all my doubts.

As others, I think a prolonged warranty would be the best Pentax could do and if they are as confident about the DA* zooms as they appear to be, it shouldn't cost them that much. It may cost them more in the long run, not to react to the SDM worries, whether the latter are a result of hysteria or not. If Sigma can sell lenses with a three year warranty (Germany) that a far less expensive then Pentax should be able to do it with their top of the line products.

01-24-2010, 07:21 AM   #182
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If the failure rate is low, as Pentax claims it is, then extending the warranty costs them nothing. However, many of these failures seem to be happening a few months after the warranty expires. Extending the warranty would cost them a fortune and I suspect they are aware of that.
01-24-2010, 01:02 PM   #183
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QuoteOriginally posted by reeftool Quote
If the failure rate is low, as Pentax claims it is, then extending the warranty costs them nothing. However, many of these failures seem to be happening a few months after the warranty expires. Extending the warranty would cost them a fortune and I suspect they are aware of that.
But instead they're happy to manufacture products knowing that they have a high likelihood of failing after warranty - that would sound quite conspiring.

Then either Pentax seek to profiteer from SDM failures, or they simply don't care enough about customer concerns over SDM issues to warrant changing their warranty policies. There's not much middle ground on this the way I see it - perhaps they rely on brand loyalty to get them through?
01-24-2010, 01:52 PM   #184
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Maybe the phrase "class action" would get their attention? Start throwing that one around as a serious possibility, and I'm sure those with that problem will come crawling out of the woodwork. I can bet you'll find the out of warranty failure rate fairly quick.

01-24-2010, 02:23 PM   #185
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QuoteOriginally posted by Ash Quote
But instead they're happy to manufacture products knowing that they have a high likelihood of failing after warranty
Perhaps they don't know how to fix it, but cannot afford to stop selling SDM lenses.

Also corporations are big and sometimes the right hand doesn't know what the left hand is doing.
01-24-2010, 03:54 PM   #186
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QuoteOriginally posted by Ash Quote
Additionally, now that the lenses have been out for a while, we have been able to do significant statical reporting on their warranty service history, rather than just going by our opinions or that of a few customers.

Pentax Imaging Company in the US has analyzed our sales and repair data. This information shows us that the warranty repair rate on all SDM lenses is at, or in most cases well below our normal return rate. Additionally, this takes into account all types of warranty repair. If we analyzed only repairs related to SDM failure, the repair rate would be well below our average, indicating there is not an issue with this system.
Not pointed at you Ash but at who provided this insight... There is a serious flaw in this logic!!!! SDM failures are akin to D-SLR body screw drive focus system or motor failures! I do know the text I quoted contains "this takes into account all types of warranty repair", but I have to conclude those statistics are "all types of lens warranty repair", not body repairs, as I just don't recall seeing much of any forum discussion about focus failures of their body.

Does anyone know of very many forum discussions complaining about their K1*D, K2*D, etc., suffering a failure of their in-body focus sensors or motor? Ok, well I re-call seeing one person selling a K10D body in the marketplace that's manual focus only; but I never looked at the listing so I don't know if that's due to a mod or failure. So, I know of perhaps one... so ok, that's one.

But I think the point is clear. Based on forum discussions it sure seems SDM failures related to the motor or electronics controlling it outweigh camera body focus system or motor failures... For those actually in the know, or more read all over pentaxforums.com, am I wrong on this?
01-24-2010, 09:03 PM   #187
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In My Opinion this is a VERY close analogy.

The original generation of Canon 5D had a serious flaw that affected only a small number of users. The mirror would FALL OFF. I personally know at least 20 people who have/had that camera and I know only one of them that had the mirror fall off. I don't know what their statistics looked like in terms of percentage failure but it was pretty obviously a design flaw and Canon offered to repair it free of charge (as long as it was not grey market)

Compare that to SDM failure. I'd be willing to be that the failure rate is similar to the 5D mirror problem. Over all a relatively small number of people are affected. But it is CLEARLY a design flaw (not over-use and not abuse) and it is not an isolated incident. Even if Pentax did not officially extend the warranty on the lenses it would still be prudent to fix the problem since the problem is THEIR fault and not the consumer's.

Just some more thoughts to lump on the pile of this thread.
01-25-2010, 10:35 AM   #188
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QuoteOriginally posted by Ash Quote
But instead they're happy to manufacture products knowing that they have a high likelihood of failing after warranty - that would sound quite conspiring.

Then either Pentax seek to profiteer from SDM failures, or they simply don't care enough about customer concerns over SDM issues to warrant changing their warranty policies. There's not much middle ground on this the way I see it - perhaps they rely on brand loyalty to get them through?
If it is a design issue, they probably don't want to admit it and if they suddenly change the design, it will be an admission that they screwed up. I have serviced and repaired transport refrigeration equiptment for 35 years and have seen these issues often. After Freon 12 phased out in the 90's, the largest mfgr. had an issue of crankshafts on the compressors snapping off behind the drive couplings. They continued blaming the problem for years on improper installations by mechanics in the field even though 90% of all failures happened to compressors that had never been uncoupled. To this day, they never acknowledged that their compressors couldn't hold up to the higher pressures of the new refrigerants. In the early 2000's they quietly introduced a new compressor with a larger crank diameter and different coupling. They claimed the change was due to a new diesel engine and emission requirements. One former rep told me that most faliures happened after about 5 years and the majority of large fleets sell off their trailers after 5 years or a certain amount of miles and had very few issues. It was the smaller fleets who bought the used trailers who had to pay the bill and the really didn't care about those customers.

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