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07-26-2010, 04:00 PM - 1 Like   #1
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Running water cost darkroom?

This is how it was done in my school, there would be a running sink that would give a constant temperature... (I don't remember what it was anymore) but yeah, if I were to set up my own darkroom would I have to wash my prints in running water? or would like a tray of water work? I'm not going to be mass printing anything.

I think it was like 15-20mins we had to wash the prints for.

07-26-2010, 04:36 PM   #2
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QuoteOriginally posted by ChrisPlatt Quote
Several trays changed regularly will work but is a PITA. Running water is preferable.
A large shallow tray and properly adjusted Kodak Automatic Tray Siphon
will agitate and rinse your RC prints quickly using relatively little water.

Chris
What's PITA o_O? Hmm I've never heard about this Kodak thingy... I'll search it up now. Thanks !
07-26-2010, 06:19 PM   #3
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PITA = Pain In The Ass

Find yourself a Kodak tray siphon washer. It's a device that connects to a sink, and clips onto a tray (I use a 16x20 tray and it's overkill for most things).

Amazon.com: Kodak Automatic Tray Siphon: Camera & Photo

http://www.google.com/#hl=en&source=hp&q=kodak+tray+siphon&aq=0&aqi=g1&aql=&...a6e175a031317e

You can wash several prints with it (water needs to be about 70 degrees F for B&W stuff), you just keep shuffling them. You can hook the unit to a faucet and just let it hang over so it drains into the sink.

07-26-2010, 08:11 PM   #4
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QuoteOriginally posted by JeffJS Quote
PITA = Pain In The Ass

Find yourself a Kodak tray siphon washer. It's a device that connects to a sink, and clips onto a tray (I use a 16x20 tray and it's overkill for most things).

Amazon.com: Kodak Automatic Tray Siphon: Camera & Photo

Google

You can wash several prints with it (water needs to be about 70 degrees F for B&W stuff), you just keep shuffling them. You can hook the unit to a faucet and just let it hang over so it drains into the sink.

Hehe, 2 suggestions for this, I don't know why we don't have one for our school!

Seems like a good investment, I should get it ;D.

07-26-2010, 08:54 PM - 1 Like   #5
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See if you can find a tank type of print washer. I bet they are being given away these days.
Thes are washers that hold a lot of water, the prints sits in vertical slots and water runs past the prints.
They use very little water once they are initially filled, and wash to archival in the shortest times possible.
Deluxe 20 x 24 Archival Print Washer - Calumet : Processing Equipment

Definitely not a giveaway, but I suspect there are a lot of them sitting unused these days.
07-26-2010, 09:37 PM   #6
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QuoteOriginally posted by Wheatfield Quote
See if you can find a tank type of print washer. I bet they are being given away these days.
Thes are washers that hold a lot of water, the prints sits in vertical slots and water runs past the prints.
They use very little water once they are initially filled, and wash to archival in the shortest times possible.
Deluxe 20 x 24 Archival Print Washer - Calumet : Processing Equipment

Definitely not a giveaway, but I suspect there are a lot of them sitting unused these days.
They seem to still be demanding a premium price. Unfortunately they are hard to come by new and the price used was sky high the last time I checked. I would suggest that it may not be too hard to make one from plexiglass.


Steve
07-26-2010, 09:38 PM   #7
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Not for the faint at heart but I actually built my own.

DarkroomSource Print Washer

07-26-2010, 09:50 PM   #8
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QuoteOriginally posted by JeffJS Quote
Not for the faint at heart but I actually built my own.

DarkroomSource Print Washer

LOL WTF??? That's crazy...

Anyways... ;((( it seems hard to find those... maybe I will get lucky... or maybe I'll just go with something less high tech.

Seems like it would save money in the long run though.

07-26-2010, 10:12 PM   #9
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The Kodak washer is going to be your best investment. A print washer takes space to store, the kodak siphon can store in a tray. I agree that the vertical print washers are nice to have but for small batch work, probably a bit overkill. Your goal is mainly to wash the fixer and other residual chemicals off of the paper. Remember you need to be able to hold and wash the largest size you want to print. If you get to the point where you are printing dozens of prints at a time, I can see buying something like a dedicated print washer. Get yourself to the point where you can get an image on paper, properly focused, properly exposed, properly contrasted, THEN worry about if it will last 50-100 years (archival washing).

07-26-2010, 10:18 PM   #10
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QuoteOriginally posted by JeffJS Quote
The Kodak washer is going to be your best investment. A print washer takes space to store, the kodak siphon can store in a tray. I agree that the vertical print washers are nice to have but for small batch work, probably a bit overkill. Your goal is mainly to wash the fixer and other residual chemicals off of the paper. Remember you need to be able to hold and wash the largest size you want to print. If you get to the point where you are printing dozens of prints at a time, I can see buying something like a dedicated print washer. Get yourself to the point where you can get an image on paper, properly focused, properly exposed, properly contrasted, THEN worry about if it will last 50-100 years (archival washing).

LOL that's true... I'm still young and learning ;D... (ALSO YOUNG AND WITH NO MONEY! AND NO JOB >;(!)
07-27-2010, 09:23 AM   #11
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QuoteOriginally posted by stevebrot Quote
They seem to still be demanding a premium price. Unfortunately they are hard to come by new and the price used was sky high the last time I checked. I would suggest that it may not be too hard to make one from plexiglass.

Steve
And of course I made one many years ago. I saw the price of one at the store and said, yikes! I can make that much cheaper.

Well, I had to build two of them to cost-average the expense just for a piece of mind. You will not be able to cut plexiglass with an edges smooth enough for that plexiglass vulcanizing bonding compound to seal the joint without very expensive equipment. Mine leaked like a pig. I had to pour epoxy in all the joints to seal it and that was hard to do after it was built and looks ugly. So bond it with generous amounts of epoxy instead from the get-go.

Plexiglass is not cheap and it is recommended you cut it with an expensive, 150 tooth, carbide saw blade. I used a more common 80 tooth blade and the edges were still less than ideal but would be good enough for epoxy though.

And of course I couldn't use the KISS (Keep It Simple, Stupid) principle while building it. I had to make it fancy with valves to regulate the flow and what-not like I saw in the store. In the end, I had a lot of money and time in the project and at that point wished I bought one.

But the upside was I made two. One was for 11x14 prints which the store didn't have. But a more savvy builder could make this DIY project more economical than I did at the time.
07-27-2010, 10:07 AM   #12
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QuoteOriginally posted by tuco Quote
And of course I made one many years ago. I saw the price of one at the store and said, yikes! I can make that much cheaper.

Well, I had to build two of them to cost-average the expense just for a piece of mind. You will not be able to cut plexiglass with an edges smooth enough for that plexiglass vulcanizing bonding compound to seal the joint without very expensive equipment. Mine leaked like a pig. I had to pour epoxy in all the joints to seal it and that was hard to do after it was built and looks ugly. So bond it with generous amounts of epoxy instead from the get-go.

Plexiglass is not cheap and it is recommended you cut it with an expensive, 150 tooth, carbide saw blade. I used a more common 80 tooth blade and the edges were still less than ideal but would be good enough for epoxy though.

And of course I couldn't use the KISS (Keep It Simple, Stupid) principle while building it. I had to make it fancy with valves to regulate the flow and what-not like I saw in the store. In the end, I had a lot of money and time in the project and at that point wished I bought one.

But the upside was I made two. One was for 11x14 prints which the store didn't have. But a more savvy builder could make this DIY project more economical than I did at the time.
There are several ways of cutting plexiglass (or in my case, acrylic) with a very smooth edge. One being a router with a straight bit using a board as a guide edge. Makes a hell of a mess though. As long as you keep it from flopping around or vibrating, you can get a good edge. To assemble mine, I used pure clear silicone caulk. Not the prettiest but 9 years later, still holding strong with no leaks. The one thing I wish I had built into it is a drain so I can completely empty the bottom without inverting it.

07-27-2010, 10:14 AM   #13
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QuoteOriginally posted by tuco Quote
And of course I made one many years ago. I saw the price of one at the store and said, yikes! I can make that much cheaper.

Well, I had to build two of them to cost-average the expense just for a piece of mind. You will not be able to cut plexiglass with an edges smooth enough for that plexiglass vulcanizing bonding compound to seal the joint without very expensive equipment. Mine leaked like a pig. I had to pour epoxy in all the joints to seal it and that was hard to do after it was built and looks ugly. So bond it with generous amounts of epoxy instead from the get-go.

Plexiglass is not cheap and it is recommended you cut it with an expensive, 150 tooth, carbide saw blade. I used a more common 80 tooth blade and the edges were still less than ideal but would be good enough for epoxy though.

And of course I couldn't use the KISS (Keep It Simple, Stupid) principle while building it. I had to make it fancy with valves to regulate the flow and what-not like I saw in the store. In the end, I had a lot of money and time in the project and at that point wished I bought one.

But the upside was I made two. One was for 11x14 prints which the store didn't have. But a more savvy builder could make this DIY project more economical than I did at the time.
I have a home-built model too. I did not want to mention it because of the ugly factor. I used a 20 gallon glass aquarium with plexiglass dividers at each end to make a clean water header and a dirty water collector. The dividers are held in place using clear silicone cement. The plexiglass pieces are grooved to accept perforated plastic sheets used by aquarists to separate aggressive fish from each other. The only weak point in the system is a workable drain. I was too timid to attempt cutting a round hole in the glass for a drain siphon. I used a clumsy hose siphon over the edge of the tank and carefully balanced intake and output rates to avoid a flood. Not good.

Steve
07-27-2010, 02:29 PM   #14
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If it's strictly B&W, i wouldn't worry about the final rinse...that water is good for a lot of prints, it doesn't have to be "runnining" like most have said already.

Last edited by Clicker; 07-27-2010 at 02:35 PM.
07-27-2010, 02:41 PM   #15
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QuoteOriginally posted by Clicker Quote
If it's strictly B&W, i wouldn't worry about the final rinse...that water is good for a lot of prints, it doesn't have to be "runnining" like most have said already.
Yeah it's only going to be B&W not bothering with the colours ;(. I like B&W better anyways ;D.
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