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07-03-2020, 05:53 AM - 1 Like   #1
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What went wrong?

In short, Fuji slide film was sent out to be developed and all of the pics came back like this:



My daughter took the pics and swears it was expired T64 Type II, but I will double check when the slides come back. In any event, if it was the T64, she took a second roll and had it cross processed locally and it looked like you’d expect for cross processed expired film:



Actually the cross processed colors look good albeit washed out. So we are curious as to why the “properly” processed film came out pink. The developer said it looked like heat exposure but we can’t identify when/where that may have occurred. Any thoughts?

Thanks,
Z

07-03-2020, 07:55 AM   #2
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First off...T64 is tungsten balanced. Second, the film was expired.


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07-03-2020, 08:03 AM   #3
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Understood. She uses CineStill 800T often, so is aware of the tungsten effect and actually likes it (not my taste). That is not the issue as we have NEVER had the pink issue before. And it doesn’t show on the cross processed pics taken a week later and developed about the same time (same amount of “expiration”). Hence the question.
07-03-2020, 08:12 AM   #4
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Yeah, there's a lot of this going around these days.

Young photographers are embracing the film thing, but are scooping up old film of questionable provenance and expecting magical "instagram" type effects will come easily.

Unfortunately old film is a crap shoot, and there's a very good chance it will have lost a good deal of its sensitivity and colour.

I had a young fellow bring me three rolls of film he shot on a once-in-a-lifetime trip to his European homeland, and the lab gave him negs that had only the faintest whisper of having been exposed. He was hoping I could scan them and "enhance" them to bring back his images. I had to break the news to him that there was nothing there to be enhanced. Why he trusted a European trip to badly expired film I don't understand. If you want that faded look, then Photoshop them for that look later.

07-03-2020, 08:24 AM   #5
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Ok, forgive me for being slow. Perhaps it matters that these expired films came as part of a 10 pack and *appeared* to have been manufactured at the same time. Further, I would've presumed they experienced the same conditions since they appeared to have been in the original packaging together.

Perhaps that is errant or a grand assumption on my part. Having said that, it seems the strong reddish tone (thus far in the feedback here) is considered not significant. I was trying to seek answers like "E-6 processing does that for expired film whereas C-41 doesn't, although both have the faded appearance if you back out the specific hue" . If that were the case, she would gladly just cross process the rest of the 10pack and be quite happy with it. In fact, she liked the cross processed effect.

So if no one can get past the expired or tungsten effect, we/she will just cross process and move on.

---------- Post added 07-03-20 at 09:38 AM ----------

BTW, I thought it would be too much work in PS to fix, but they actually correct easily. Photoshop is a badass program for sure...
07-03-2020, 08:58 AM   #6
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Pro film is usually sold in "bricks" of 10 rolls in individual boxes. The boxes should have the emulsion batch number and expiration dates printed on them. The batch number should all be the same. Consumer multipacks may have rolls from different batches.

If the multipack or brick was made by a retailer and not the manufacturer the batches can be mixed even with pro film.

Check the batch numbers on the cartons.

Over bleaching in the E-6 process can give similar results as I recall. I haven't looked at my E-6 processing manual in close to 40 years.
07-03-2020, 09:09 AM   #7
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QuoteOriginally posted by HomeMadeSin Quote
So if no one can get past the expired or tungsten effect, we/she will just cross process and move on.
Sorry if our answers are conventional. You asked what went wrong and those two things are the most obvious. One does not shoot expired film expecting predictable or consistent results. Both that approach and cross-processing are intentional crapshoots in hopes that something cool may come out the other end.

A Lomography forum might provide more specific and helpful information as to how to leverage the film in question.


Steve

Last edited by stevebrot; 07-03-2020 at 09:40 AM. Reason: more reasoned wording
07-03-2020, 09:34 AM   #8
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Import your images that have been cross proccesed into Photoshop and use Auto Levels. That will recover a bit more of the photo and restore some contrast, but nothing will get these to look like ones shot on good film.

07-03-2020, 11:53 AM   #9
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Again, I’ll apologize as my focus was not on image quality per se, but what I would refer to as the “infrared effect”. They almost look like in corrected shots from a digital camera that had the hot filter removed. Photoshop cleared it up with the auto levels and hence the PS comment on my last post. Once the files were “autocorrected”, the results were satisfactory albeit the washed out look of expired film. My daughter actually likes that look. I don’t, but I have to be careful since she bought the pack for me for Christmas....

So, perhaps I should have asked the question as “ignoring the image quality, why did the vendor in CA return scans with overwhelming red hue when E-6 processed versus the local vendor who did not render it that way via C-41“?

Thanks all.
07-03-2020, 07:42 PM - 1 Like   #10
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QuoteOriginally posted by HomeMadeSin Quote
Again, I’ll apologize as my focus was not on image quality per se, but what I would refer to as the “infrared effect”. They almost look like in corrected shots from a digital camera that had the hot filter removed. Photoshop cleared it up with the auto levels and hence the PS comment on my last post. Once the files were “autocorrected”, the results were satisfactory albeit the washed out look of expired film. My daughter actually likes that look. I don’t, but I have to be careful since she bought the pack for me for Christmas....

So, perhaps I should have asked the question as “ignoring the image quality, why did the vendor in CA return scans with overwhelming red hue when E-6 processed versus the local vendor who did not render it that way via C-41“?

Thanks all.
I was always only ok at b&w developing so I watched this with interest but I'm sorry I can't add to the discussion.
07-04-2020, 08:32 AM   #11
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If I were to venture a guess I would say it’s the film and the scan. The three pigment layers that form the colour image are developing differently from how they were intended. Less cyan and yellow and more magenta. Then the scan didn’t compensate for it. If you haven’t seen the actual slides it’s hard to say they could look the same but have been scanned differently.
07-04-2020, 10:07 AM   #12
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Here's a link to part of the Kodak E-6 manual on visual trouble shooting. Note the color section e.g. blue, yellow, etc. refers to overall cast not lack of other layers.

https://125px.com/docs/techpubs/kodak/z119-12.pdf
07-04-2020, 10:55 AM - 1 Like   #13
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I agree with Painter above and that the film was grossly underexposed and will be interested to see when you get the film back.
Hopefully you have a lightbox - or window, to use to take a shot of it.

07-05-2020, 03:04 PM - 1 Like   #14
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QuoteOriginally posted by LesDMess Quote
I agree with Painter above and that the film was grossly underexposed and will be interested to see when you get the film back.
Hopefully you have a lightbox - or window, to use to take a shot of it.
Those were my thoughts as well, once I figured out that the actual processed frames were still in the mail. Scanners do strange things when they have almost nothing to work with.


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07-05-2020, 05:46 PM   #15
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QuoteOriginally posted by stevebrot Quote
Those were my thoughts as well, once I figured out that the actual processed frames were still in the mail. Scanners do strange things when they have almost nothing to work with.


Steve
Agreed! Definitely seen a few errant scans and some on even perfectly well exposed frame of film.
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