K-5 AF trouble catch-all

Fer · 02-25-2011, 04:21 AM

Originally posted by the swede

Translation

"Thank you for your translation.

I have reliable sources of information.

Just a little patience.

Hello everyone!"

Yes, well. At this stage I would take this source's statements on this issue with a big grain of salt. I'm not saying he's acting in bad faith at all, but he's been assuring us for 3 months already that the firmware to solve this was coming out "shortly". I echo the sentiment expressed by others in this thread. If Pentax does not fix this in the next few weeks, this is the last money they will be getting from me ever. The way they're handling this serious fault in a €1100 semi-pro camera is outrageous and unacceptable. Right now, I can only be glad I'm not too invested in Pentax gear to afford to jump ships, cause the possibility is looking more likely to me with every day that goes by without Pentax solving this issue or even officially acknowledging it.

Rupert · 02-25-2011, 07:28 AM

I read again today where Adam said a Fix is on the way. He is putting his reputation on the line here, so we should not take that too lightly. Most of us have little contact with anyone truly "in the know".......we are only going by what we don't hear from Pentax. I'm going to trust that Adam is not blowing smoke up our hinies, and a Fix is forthcoming.
I am also assuming that the Fix he speaks of is not in the next model!

Best Regards!

tmtke · 02-25-2011, 08:24 AM

I think the best practice in every acquisition is to never ever buy the very first of the thing you're after. Wait some weeks (even months) and decide. The price is better, and most of the problems are turned out or even fixed.

sterretje · 02-25-2011, 09:26 AM

Originally posted by tmtke

I think the best practice in every acquisition is to never ever buy the very first of the thing you're after. Wait some weeks (even months) and decide. The price is better, and most of the problems are turned out or even fixed.

And if everybody did that, the price would not get better and the problems would not be found till you buy one.

And you will not buy one so nobody will ever know if the product was good or bad.

opiedog · 02-25-2011, 09:41 AM

Originally posted by Fer

Yes, well. At this stage I would take this source's statements on this issue with a big grain of salt. I'm not saying he's acting in bad faith at all, but he's been assuring us for 3 months already that the firmware to solve this was coming out "shortly". I echo the sentiment expressed by others in this thread. If Pentax does not fix this in the next few weeks, this is the last money they will be getting from me ever. The way they're handling this serious fault in a €1100 semi-pro camera is outrageous and unacceptable. Right now, I can only be glad I'm not too invested in Pentax gear to afford to jump ships, cause the possibility is looking more likely to me with every day that goes by without Pentax solving this issue or even officially acknowledging it.

it could mean a few things.

1. pentax doesn't think this is serious and is putting very few resources to finding a fix via firmware
2. it can't be fixed in firmware, i.e., hardware issues.

i agree with the post that if pentax recognizes this FF issue as SERIOUS, 3 months later a firmware fix, if possible, should have already been released.

Rupert · 02-25-2011, 10:24 AM

Originally posted by opiedog

it could mean a few things.

1. pentax doesn't think this is serious and is putting very few resources to finding a fix via firmware
2. it can't be fixed in firmware, i.e., hardware issues.

i agree with the post that if pentax recognizes this FF issue as SERIOUS, 3 months later a firmware fix, if possible, should have already been released.

We don't "know" anything, and therein lies the problem. Some have said this is the "Pentax way", or the "Corporate way"....and apparently they are right. I don't think most find it acceptable though?
Regards!

**Eric Seavey** · 02-25-2011, 10:56 AM

They could release a firmware update with a "AF offset" setting in addition to the AF fine adjustment where one could enter a focus offset. Thereby covering up the FF focus issue being a problem. That would make me happy in the interim until they come up with a real FF fix.

**GregK8** · 02-25-2011, 12:43 PM

Originally posted by opiedog

it could mean a few things.

1. pentax doesn't think this is serious and is putting very few resources to finding a fix via firmware
2. it can't be fixed in firmware, i.e., hardware issues.

i agree with the post that if pentax recognizes this FF issue as SERIOUS, 3 months later a firmware fix, if possible, should have already been released.

The third option is that this is a very complex problem with very complex math involved and it takes a while to code up the firmware fix, test it to make sure they didn't break anything else and test it to make sure it actually works. Simple software problems can take weeks to solve by the time you get through the regression testing and rollout, so consider the complexity when setting your expectation.

What would you all be saying if they rushed something out that broke the white balance detection, or the AE routines?

Originally posted by ve2vfd

The worst thing Pentax could possibly do is give people a time table or deadline.... it creates hope and hype and then massive backlash when they can't meet that deadline. The only thing they will ever say is that they are aware of the problem and are working on a fix.

+1

Smeggypants · 02-25-2011, 05:52 PM

Originally posted by Rupert

We don't "know" anything, and therein lies the problem. Some have said this is the "Pentax way", or the "Corporate way"....and apparently they are right. I don't think most find it acceptable though?
Regards!

We don't even know if a fix is on the way. A few people have claimed a fix is on the way but as yet those claims have just been hot air.

This doesn't really help

people should list sources.

Tommot1965 · 02-25-2011, 06:23 PM

smeggy

Yes mate I did a double take of the forum front page this morning..as I thought at first glance it was revealing that the firmware was out..but alas no..:{

I would hope though that the forum Admin would only publish said rumours if he had a cast iron guarantee that a fix was indeed imminent ..lets hope so

Smeggypants · 02-25-2011, 06:35 PM

I do hope so. But I've heard it all before.

Rupert · 02-25-2011, 09:17 PM

Well, here we are...none of us really contributing anything, just waiting. I guess that is where we have ended up and now are just trying to maintain patience and a little hope. One way or another, the sky will not fall...we should know that, but sometimes forget. I'm often the worst , but I too get over it.
Best Regards

Smeggypants · 02-26-2011, 07:59 AM

Yup just waiting to hear if a fix is on the way.

opiedog · 02-26-2011, 09:04 AM

Originally posted by GregK8

The third option is that this is a very complex problem with very complex math involved and it takes a while to code up the firmware fix, test it to make sure they didn't break anything else and test it to make sure it actually works. Simple software problems can take weeks to solve by the time you get through the regression testing and rollout, so consider the complexity when setting your expectation.

What would you all be saying if they rushed something out that broke the white balance detection, or the AE routines?

+1

i've seen software patches that have fixed things and breaking others.
of course that's not what we want, but how long is too long?

how much "damage" will be incurred if nothing is even said thru "official" channels, not rumors?

if pentax thinks this is serious enough AND a firmware fix IS possible, why not keep the faithful at ease by announcing it?
nikon announced a fix for the d7k's video hot pixels and pentax announced the stain problem officially.

why not this?

Evolution · 02-26-2011, 04:20 PM

I just want to add my voice to the chorus of people saying this may be the straw that broke the camel's back for my relationship with Pentax. I've been clinging lovingly to my K10D watching Pentax put its best foot forward against the other guys for a few years now. In the K5 I thought they finally had a camera which in many ways outclassed everything else in its price range. I'd really love more control and better options for video, but I'm willing to forgo those for the K5's incredible dynamic range and high-iso performance with regard to noise. But the sensor stain issue and the front-focus problem in low light are both embarrassing and unacceptable.

I've actually held off on purchasing a number of prime lenses on the chance that I might decide to jump ship if Pentax couldn't live up to the competition, and now it looks like that may happen. The Canon 60D has an inferior sensor, but it can be had for less than 2/3 the price, is a better camera for video, and most importantly it works properly regardless of light conditions. Plus, I don't have to worry about potentially sending one back for stains on the sensor.

If this gets resolved relatively soon, I'll be buying a K5 and a small handful of new lenses. If it doesn't I will most likely be jumping over to Canon, not because it's popular or chic... but because I know I can rely on it. The impact of quality control and consistency on consumer psyche really cannot be overstated.

02-26-2011, 09:04 AM	#59
opiedog Inactive Account Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: NC Posts: 787	Originally posted by GregK8 The third option is that this is a very complex problem with very complex math involved and it takes a while to code up the firmware fix, test it to make sure they didn't break anything else and test it to make sure it actually works. Simple software problems can take weeks to solve by the time you get through the regression testing and rollout, so consider the complexity when setting your expectation. What would you all be saying if they rushed something out that broke the white balance detection, or the AE routines? +1 i've seen software patches that have fixed things and breaking others. of course that's not what we want, but how long is too long? how much "damage" will be incurred if nothing is even said thru "official" channels, not rumors? if pentax thinks this is serious enough AND a firmware fix IS possible, why not keep the faithful at ease by announcing it? nikon announced a fix for the d7k's video hot pixels and pentax announced the stain problem officially. why not this? Last edited by opiedog; 02-26-2011 at 09:09 AM.

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02-25-2011, 04:21 AM	#46
Fer Forum Member Join Date: Jul 2010 Location: Madrid Posts: 66	Originally posted by the swede Translation "Thank you for your translation. I have reliable sources of information. Just a little patience. Hello everyone!" Yes, well. At this stage I would take this source's statements on this issue with a big grain of salt. I'm not saying he's acting in bad faith at all, but he's been assuring us for 3 months already that the firmware to solve this was coming out "shortly". I echo the sentiment expressed by others in this thread. If Pentax does not fix this in the next few weeks, this is the last money they will be getting from me ever. The way they're handling this serious fault in a €1100 semi-pro camera is outrageous and unacceptable. Right now, I can only be glad I'm not too invested in Pentax gear to afford to jump ships, cause the possibility is looking more likely to me with every day that goes by without Pentax solving this issue or even officially acknowledging it.

02-25-2011, 07:28 AM	#47
Rupert Veteran Member Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Texas Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 25,123	I read again today where Adam said a Fix is on the way. He is putting his reputation on the line here, so we should not take that too lightly. Most of us have little contact with anyone truly "in the know".......we are only going by what we don't hear from Pentax. I'm going to trust that Adam is not blowing smoke up our hinies, and a Fix is forthcoming. I am also assuming that the Fix he speaks of is not in the next model! Best Regards!

02-25-2011, 08:24 AM	#48
tmtke New Member Join Date: Sep 2010 Location: Budapest Posts: 11	I think the best practice in every acquisition is to never ever buy the very first of the thing you're after. Wait some weeks (even months) and decide. The price is better, and most of the problems are turned out or even fixed.

02-25-2011, 09:26 AM	#49
sterretje Veteran Member Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: Roodepoort, South Africa Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 3,561	Originally posted by tmtke I think the best practice in every acquisition is to never ever buy the very first of the thing you're after. Wait some weeks (even months) and decide. The price is better, and most of the problems are turned out or even fixed. And if everybody did that, the price would not get better and the problems would not be found till you buy one. And you will not buy one so nobody will ever know if the product was good or bad.

02-25-2011, 09:41 AM	#50
opiedog Inactive Account Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: NC Posts: 787	Originally posted by Fer Yes, well. At this stage I would take this source's statements on this issue with a big grain of salt. I'm not saying he's acting in bad faith at all, but he's been assuring us for 3 months already that the firmware to solve this was coming out "shortly". I echo the sentiment expressed by others in this thread. If Pentax does not fix this in the next few weeks, this is the last money they will be getting from me ever. The way they're handling this serious fault in a €1100 semi-pro camera is outrageous and unacceptable. Right now, I can only be glad I'm not too invested in Pentax gear to afford to jump ships, cause the possibility is looking more likely to me with every day that goes by without Pentax solving this issue or even officially acknowledging it. it could mean a few things. 1. pentax doesn't think this is serious and is putting very few resources to finding a fix via firmware 2. it can't be fixed in firmware, i.e., hardware issues. i agree with the post that if pentax recognizes this FF issue as SERIOUS, 3 months later a firmware fix, if possible, should have already been released.

02-25-2011, 10:24 AM	#51
Rupert Veteran Member Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Texas Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 25,123	Originally posted by opiedog it could mean a few things. 1. pentax doesn't think this is serious and is putting very few resources to finding a fix via firmware 2. it can't be fixed in firmware, i.e., hardware issues. i agree with the post that if pentax recognizes this FF issue as SERIOUS, 3 months later a firmware fix, if possible, should have already been released. We don't "know" anything, and therein lies the problem. Some have said this is the "Pentax way", or the "Corporate way"....and apparently they are right. I don't think most find it acceptable though? Regards!

02-25-2011, 10:56 AM	#52
Eric Seavey Site Supporter Join Date: Feb 2008 Location: Irvine, CA Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 307	They could release a firmware update with a "AF offset" setting in addition to the AF fine adjustment where one could enter a focus offset. Thereby covering up the FF focus issue being a problem. That would make me happy in the interim until they come up with a real FF fix.

02-25-2011, 12:43 PM	#53
GregK8 Site Supporter Join Date: May 2008 Location: Western New York Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 614	Originally posted by opiedog it could mean a few things. 1. pentax doesn't think this is serious and is putting very few resources to finding a fix via firmware 2. it can't be fixed in firmware, i.e., hardware issues. i agree with the post that if pentax recognizes this FF issue as SERIOUS, 3 months later a firmware fix, if possible, should have already been released. The third option is that this is a very complex problem with very complex math involved and it takes a while to code up the firmware fix, test it to make sure they didn't break anything else and test it to make sure it actually works. Simple software problems can take weeks to solve by the time you get through the regression testing and rollout, so consider the complexity when setting your expectation. What would you all be saying if they rushed something out that broke the white balance detection, or the AE routines? Originally posted by ve2vfd The worst thing Pentax could possibly do is give people a time table or deadline.... it creates hope and hype and then massive backlash when they can't meet that deadline. The only thing they will ever say is that they are aware of the problem and are working on a fix. +1

02-25-2011, 05:52 PM	#54
Smeggypants Veteran Member Join Date: Sep 2010 Posts: 1,536	Originally posted by Rupert We don't "know" anything, and therein lies the problem. Some have said this is the "Pentax way", or the "Corporate way"....and apparently they are right. I don't think most find it acceptable though? Regards! We don't even know if a fix is on the way. A few people have claimed a fix is on the way but as yet those claims have just been hot air. This doesn't really help people should list sources.

02-25-2011, 06:23 PM	#55
Tommot1965 Veteran Member Join Date: Sep 2010 Location: Perth Western Australia Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 1,026	smeggy Yes mate I did a double take of the forum front page this morning..as I thought at first glance it was revealing that the firmware was out..but alas no..:{ I would hope though that the forum Admin would only publish said rumours if he had a cast iron guarantee that a fix was indeed imminent ..lets hope so

02-25-2011, 06:35 PM	#56
Smeggypants Veteran Member Join Date: Sep 2010 Posts: 1,536	I do hope so. But I've heard it all before.

02-25-2011, 09:17 PM	#57
Rupert Veteran Member Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Texas Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 25,123	Well, here we are...none of us really contributing anything, just waiting. I guess that is where we have ended up and now are just trying to maintain patience and a little hope. One way or another, the sky will not fall...we should know that, but sometimes forget. I'm often the worst , but I too get over it. Best Regards

02-26-2011, 07:59 AM	#58
Smeggypants Veteran Member Join Date: Sep 2010 Posts: 1,536	Yup just waiting to hear if a fix is on the way.

02-26-2011, 04:20 PM	#60
Evolution Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: USA Posts: 135	I just want to add my voice to the chorus of people saying this may be the straw that broke the camel's back for my relationship with Pentax. I've been clinging lovingly to my K10D watching Pentax put its best foot forward against the other guys for a few years now. In the K5 I thought they finally had a camera which in many ways outclassed everything else in its price range. I'd really love more control and better options for video, but I'm willing to forgo those for the K5's incredible dynamic range and high-iso performance with regard to noise. But the sensor stain issue and the front-focus problem in low light are both embarrassing and unacceptable. I've actually held off on purchasing a number of prime lenses on the chance that I might decide to jump ship if Pentax couldn't live up to the competition, and now it looks like that may happen. The Canon 60D has an inferior sensor, but it can be had for less than 2/3 the price, is a better camera for video, and most importantly it works properly regardless of light conditions. Plus, I don't have to worry about potentially sending one back for stains on the sensor. If this gets resolved relatively soon, I'll be buying a K5 and a small handful of new lenses. If it doesn't I will most likely be jumping over to Canon, not because it's popular or chic... but because I know I can rely on it. The impact of quality control and consistency on consumer psyche really cannot be overstated.