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10-14-2010, 10:43 PM   #1
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What about the K-5 body makes it "worth" 2x the price of the K-r KIT?

K-r kit: Amazon.com: Pentax K-r 12.4 MP Digital SLR Camera with 3.0-Inch LCD and 18-55mm f/3.5-5.6 Lens (White): Camera & Photo

K-5 kit: Amazon.com: Pentax K-5 16.3 MP Digital SLR with 18-55mm Lens and 3-Inch LCD (Black): Camera & Photo

K-5 body only (2x the K-r kit!!): Amazon.com: Pentax K-5 16.3 MP Digital SLR with 3-Inch LCD (Black Body Only): Camera & Photo


Ok, we all know the features and other bullcrap, lets forget that side of things...this is a rhetorical question and observation...one can pre-order a K-r kit for $800 or a K-5 "kit" for $1750ish...something smells here...like a the day after $2-Tuesday at a Nevada whorehouse.

I can't explain why I feel this way. I only just now started to really look at the pricing structure of HoyaTax vs. the other companies as well as the Hoya in-house pricing but it just does not seem right or consistent.

I have little doubt that the K-5 is going to be a wonderful camera. There is nothing to suggest otherwise. It is the prices...and NO IT'S NOT EXCHANGE RATES. See the exchange rate thing applies to ALL bodies not just the most expensive HoyaTax (nobody is saying the exchange rate is inflating the price of the 645D, right? I mean it's a more expensive body and if the value of the Yen vs. the USD was the issue then the new price for the 645D should now be $15,000 vs. the current $10,000 price.

I have no problem if the K-5 had features like dual processors, a-la the 7D, and other added features to make it bleeding edge.

So let's not push this into the realm of us vs. them brand wise but rather why would there be such inconsistent pricing...maybe my crap-detector is firing because from the first day of Photokina it felt as if Hoya was lying to consumers about the new body...via mis-information, lack of coordination of information and anything else one could call misdirection to focus attention away from something. What that something is, I obviously don't know...but I sense there is something.

Another example is the very fast sell-out of the K-5 on Amazon...why? Did they order like 10-bodies and refuse to order more simply because of the now dead stock K-7 bodies? Is Hoya planning to keep the K-7 in production to keep the K-5 price up?

Or, just as with the K-7 has some hardware related problem surfaced late in the production process so in order to slow sales has Hoya decided to inflate the price of the K-5 until whatever the issue could be is fixed?

I guess I am wondering if Hoya has again shot themselves in the foot with the release of their newest "higher end body" like with the sensor of the K-7 which had to be a KNOWN issue but the body was released anyway. If Pentax did not know about the K-7 sensor problem prior to the first production units leaving the warehouse then there are deeper issues than price structure at the company anyway.

Or? I dunno...and again, I am not being negative only asking the question WHY? Using exchange rates is not enough, especially considering the parts to build these things were bought months ago not yesterday.

And no, I don't think the D7000 is going to have the construction quality of the K-5, anyway I'm genetically predisposed to biologically reject anything Nikon, I've always been that way. So, Nikon is not and won't ever be an option for me...hehehehe.... Still if Nikon can do it, why can't Pentax at least get into the a closer section of the ballpark?

10-14-2010, 10:58 PM   #2
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While I see what you are saying, how about looking at a price and IQ comparison between the Nikon D3100 and the D7000? Same story.
10-14-2010, 11:01 PM   #3
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Well it's been suggested that the K-5 is disproportionately overpriced a few times, and I don't disagree. I'm not sure but the only other Pentax dSLR that reached the K-5's RRP was the very first one, the *ist D.

How could it be justified? Was SAFOX 9+ expensive to develop. Not sure about that. Did Sony charge Pentax a mint for the sensor. Can't see why amongst the competitors' offerings. Did Pentax believe the K-5 would be a quantum leap in their flagship model compared with previous successions? I don't see it as any bigger than the *ist D to K10D development.

So now I'm out of explanations myself and hope the K-5's RRP doesn't hurt sales - but it is making me consider waiting a couple of months for a price drop.
10-14-2010, 11:07 PM   #4
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QuoteOriginally posted by rawr Quote
While I see what you are saying, how about looking at a price and IQ comparison between the Nikon D3100 and the D7000? Same story.
thanks and valid point about those two bodies offering a solid comparison. I realize also it's not purely based on performance but also what price the market will bear. And really thanks for getting the ball rolling along with seeing where I am coming from here...I am just trying to understand it all.

I wonder if my trepidation is in no small degree related to the confusion from Photokina?

10-14-2010, 11:07 PM   #5
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After we see how the two cameras perform the pricing disparity will seem either justified or crazy. Still, I always thought that for people who enjoy their Pentax lenses but are dissatisfied with their camera bodies, the K-5's biggest competitor wasn't the Nikon D7000 or the Canon 7d, it was the Pentax K-r.

Then again, maybe people want the K-5 more because it's twice as expensive
10-14-2010, 11:18 PM   #6
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QuoteOriginally posted by Ash Quote
Well it's been suggested that the K-5 is disproportionately overpriced a few times, and I don't disagree. I'm not sure but the only other Pentax dSLR that reached the K-5's RRP was the very first one, the *ist D.

How could it be justified? Was SAFOX 9+ expensive to develop. Not sure about that. Did Sony charge Pentax a mint for the sensor. Can't see why amongst the competitors' offerings. Did Pentax believe the K-5 would be a quantum leap in their flagship model compared with previous successions? I don't see it as any bigger than the *ist D to K10D development.

So now I'm out of explanations myself and hope the K-5's RRP doesn't hurt sales - but it is making me consider waiting a couple of months for a price drop.
QuoteOriginally posted by Urkeldaedalus Quote
After we see how the two cameras perform the pricing disparity will seem either justified or crazy. Still, I always thought that for people who enjoy their Pentax lenses but are dissatisfied with their camera bodies, the K-5's biggest competitor wasn't the Nikon D7000 or the Canon 7d, it was the Pentax K-r.

Then again, maybe people want the K-5 more because it's twice as expensive
Ok....so, maybe I am not alone in a sort of confusion over the pricing. Not so much the utilitarian value as a piece of hardware but the value relative to maybe a product made on the floor below where the K-5 is built.

I guess we are at least coming to a time when someone will finally have production copies in their hands and some reviews under real world conditions.

So, now we have our own leetle "Pentax user support group" where we can "share our feelings"....hahahaha....
10-14-2010, 11:25 PM   #7
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I must say I found the price difference odd, it's difficult to justify almost $1000 more for the K5 over the Kr. I mean is there really THAT much difference between the two cameras? At the end of the day if you hold up two photos, one from each, I bet you couldn't tell the difference.
10-14-2010, 11:35 PM   #8
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QuoteOriginally posted by brecklundin Quote
Ok....so, maybe I am not alone in a sort of confusion over the pricing. Not so much the utilitarian value as a piece of hardware but the value relative to maybe a product made on the floor below where the K-5 is built.

I guess we are at least coming to a time when someone will finally have production copies in their hands and some reviews under real world conditions.

So, now we have our own leetle "Pentax user support group" where we can "share our feelings"....hahahaha....
Well it's more a compliment to the package that the K-r seems to offer than anything else. Basically refined K-7 AF performance combined with refined K-x sensor performance in a $800 mid entry body that will only get cheaper? The only thing I can think of against it is the plastic body, the one control wheel, and the still poorly implemented video mode (you would think they could have added a mic jack to the K-r if nothing else).

Then again, the K-r is in a weird position of being roughly twice as expensive as the still very good K-x. If someone I knew was starting in photography and wanted a good Pentax camera, I'd still probably recommend the K-x over the K-r to start with. Why? Because the differences between the two bodies for the money come in terms of small refinements that only advanced users tend to care about. I think the same could be said when comparing the K-r to the K-5, although the K-5 is an even bigger improvement versus the K-r than the K-r is toward the K-x.

Anyway, I'm interested to see how the new cameras will perform.

10-14-2010, 11:36 PM   #9
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Pentax has listed the K-5 about $300-400 too high and stubbornly kept it high even when the competition (which will sell a hell of a lot more than Pentax) has released their comparable models for less. This is a terrible mistake and in return will certainly hurt sales and all bu completely alienate first time DSLR buyers or those who may be thinking of switching to Pentax, based on this high price. Sure, Pentax will sell plenty of K-5's to those who are current Pentaxians, but let's face it, that is a small number in the scheme of things. Releasing a body which is $300 more than the flagship released only a year and a half ago is a massive mistake and makes me wonder about how this was justified by the powers that be within Hoya.

When a certain level of technology becomes more or less common place, prices should adjust downward...remember when the fancy 3.1 megapixel P&S cameras 10 years ago were selling for $700, now you get 12 megapixels and many more improvements for $300, or less. What has the K-5 brought to the game which justifies this $300 increase over the K-7? Have they really broken new ground technology-wise or released something which takes digital camera bodies to the next level with this release?

No.

K-5 should be another excellent body, but come on Hoya, what are you thinking with this release price?

Jason
10-14-2010, 11:37 PM   #10
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Yes true. But it's more than the end result otherwise there would have been no point to developing the K-7 with the K20D already available.

I'm certain the K-5 will be one fine piece of engineering but I too am dubious about the current price tag. I do reserve some judgement until I have one to try in my own hands...
10-14-2010, 11:51 PM   #11
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If I remember correctly, the K20D and the K-7 both were released for $1299...

Jason
10-15-2010, 12:11 AM   #12
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As far as the budget goes, I'm OK to buy either one, so it boils down to a question of perceived value for money.

The K-7 is a much smoother package than the K-X in terms of usage, too bad about the difference in sensor performance. Hoya was stuck with an underperforming sensor from Samsung.......that's one of the main reasons they are divorced now.

The delta in sensor capability is no longer there with the K-5/K-R , though I suspect Pentax has reserved the best for its flagship APSC-C camera.

The K-5's most obvious advantages are
Weather-Sealing (a big deal for me, living 400 miles from the Equator),
Magnesium Alloy body (and base - quite significant for a heavy user like me)
Top LCD screen
Front control wheel
Hyper P mode (only possible with 2 control wheels)
TAv mode - useful at times.
One Touch LiveView activation
Probably lots more....but I don't want to speculate....

Is the K-5 worth $ 1,000 more ?
I don't know. Probably not at this moment.
I'll wait a few months before buying, probably the K-5, when prices stabilise a bit more.
10-15-2010, 12:20 AM   #13
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Pentax finally became full digital. And in digital world everything is 2. Nothing in between So, K-r is $800, K-5 is $1600. If they are going to produce model above K-5, then it is going to be $3200

Last edited by Edvinas; 10-15-2010 at 12:31 AM.
10-15-2010, 12:24 AM   #14
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Buy a K-x, it is about half price of K-r:
- Buy a 200 USD P&S, it is about half price of K-x (1/8-th of K-5!!!)
10-15-2010, 12:26 AM   #15
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I had heard that Pentax was actually going the price the K-5 at around 1300USD at the final release, as the price of 1600USD was just tentative. But since they are selling at the price that they said during the initial launch would make K-5 a failure.
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