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View Poll Results: Has the K-5 changed your perspective on Full Frame dSLRs?
I never wanted/needed a FF dSLR 17750.86%
I've changed my mind - I don't want/need a FF dSLR anymore 5916.95%
I've changed my mind - I want/need a FF dSLR now 82.30%
I've always wanted/needed a FF dSLR and still do 10429.89%
Voters: 348. You may not vote on this poll

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10-21-2010, 04:17 PM   #16
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QuoteOriginally posted by Pablom Quote
I'd like to have a viewfinder with 1.54x magnification, how about that?
You stole my wish!

10-21-2010, 04:19 PM   #17
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QuoteOriginally posted by Raylon Quote
The option of 'a FF is still a FF and APS-C is still APS-C' isn't there which is what I would choose. IQ isn't the only thing that FF has to offer. Extremely shallow DOF is another reason for FF, something APS-C can't offer to the same magnitude.
People pull that out like as if it means something. The DOF difference between the two is small enough to pretty much be a non starter, and if you want to be fair, you have to mention in the same sentence that APS-C offers more DOF, which is more often more important than less anyway.
10-21-2010, 04:19 PM   #18
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35mm would be nice for DOF, but the 645D is better still for that. There is nothing 'magic' about 36mm x 24mm.

APS-C provides more than enough IQ for me, with the benefit of lighter and cheaper lenses, and the 'crop factor' is better for wildlife.

Times have moved on - the sensor size can be anything, it doesn't have to be 35mm, it's the image that matters.
10-21-2010, 04:26 PM   #19
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QuoteOriginally posted by Wheatfield Quote
P if you want to be fair, you have to mention in the same sentence that APS-C offers more DOF, which is more often more important than less anyway.
I know that's exactly what I meant. Each has it's own uses. Like if you want really really ultrawide pictures, APS-C won't cut it. But if you want 450mm zoom out of you 300mm, FF isn't going to help there at all.

Bascially if you want FF, it has more factors that just IQ figured into it for most people.

10-21-2010, 05:28 PM   #20
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Too many of my friends are upgrading from K-7 to 5DmkII. Despite the K-5 but used 5DmkII become readily available, it seems, for about the same money (the difference is 200€ maybe). It's not funny .... (I asked where the used 5DmkII are coming from. I heard from 1D upgraders...)

Last edited by falconeye; 10-21-2010 at 05:37 PM.
10-21-2010, 06:13 PM   #21
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I actually feel the K-5 addresses many of the issues for people who may have considered migrating to a FF of another brand, or jump ship altogether. To me the new K-5 is like using a Canon EOS 1D Mark IV (APS-H, 16.1 megapixels) in a MUCH SMALLER and a LOT LIGHTER package at a ridiculously CHEAPER PRICE. I get my 14-bit RAW files just like the top end cameras from other makes. For me, a smaller camera with such a good image quality means more photo taking opportunities because I can carry my camera just about anywhere. So why do I need to invest in a bigger and more expensive camera and more expensive lenses to lug around when the image quality from this APS-C wonder is so good? Where I am, there are actually people using other brands who have come over to Pentax because of the K-5...
10-21-2010, 06:26 PM   #22
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I would like to see a test....K-5 vs full frame...say D700 and 5D Mk. 11....before I could answer that question.
10-21-2010, 07:06 PM   #23
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I have long felt that the size/weight/expense tradeoffs of a full-frame system were too great, given my photographic needs. What the latest generation of APS-C cameras makes clear is that it is such tradeoffs are harder to justify in terms of IQ at all ISOs. Yes, with the new technology, FF will always be superior, but will it be of practical benefit for most shooters? I think that the answer is a definite "no." So what if FF will be capable of ISO 100,000? In a few short years, APS-C may be there as well. I don't think that we can rule such things out. There are those for whom no ISO is high enough. I wish them happy shooting with their FF cameras, but I suspect that their numbers will be diminishing.

Rob

10-21-2010, 07:21 PM   #24
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QuoteOriginally posted by lesmore49 Quote
I would like to see a test....K-5 vs full frame...say D700 and 5D Mk. 11....before I could answer that question.
I was a volunteer editor of a community journal , got to see and filter a lot of photos for publishing. In good lighting, almost any modern camera can produce decent shots, depending on the photographer.
I used to be able to make quite accurate guesses that some of the photos were made by High-End Full Frame cameras, mainly those taken in low-light or challenging lighting.
For some of the output I'm seeing from the K-5, yes, I could have said "FF" if this was a blind test.
10-21-2010, 09:11 PM   #25
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QuoteOriginally posted by johnmflores Quote
Has the K-5 changed your thoughts about FF dSLRs? Discuss...
No.

1. FF gives another possibility of DOF which APS-C can't offer. It's impossible for crop.
No such fast lenses.
2. High ISO is still better with FF camera. The difference is not huge, but still ~ 1 stop for 5D Mk II and ~ 2 stops for D700/D3.
3. FA43 will be 43 mm, FA31 will be outstanding wide-angle lens, not standart,
FA77 will be 77 mm. e.t.c.
10-22-2010, 12:00 AM   #26
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QuoteOriginally posted by Raylon Quote
I know that's exactly what I meant. Each has it's own uses. Like if you want really really ultrawide pictures, APS-C won't cut it. But if you want 450mm zoom out of you 300mm, FF isn't going to help there at all.

Bascially if you want FF, it has more factors that just IQ figured into it for most people.
Sigma makes a 8-16 I just used in a video shoot. That is as ultra wide as possible. Better mtf results than it's full frame 12-24 equiv. Incredible lens!
10-22-2010, 01:06 AM   #27
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QuoteOriginally posted by falconeye Quote
Too many of my friends are upgrading from K-7 to 5DmkII. Despite the K-5 but used 5DmkII become readily available, it seems, for about the same money (the difference is 200€ maybe). It's not funny .... (I asked where the used 5DmkII are coming from. I heard from 1D upgraders...)
Of course that cost is body only, Falk.
10-22-2010, 01:11 AM   #28
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QuoteOriginally posted by deadwolfbones Quote
The K-5's IQ is very good, but I won't be selling my D700.

Draw your own conclusions...
Well, for one, with and APS-C dslr like the K-5 on the market, people are not interested in FF like D700 anymore so nobody will buy it.
10-22-2010, 01:16 AM   #29
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QuoteOriginally posted by robgo2 Quote
I have long felt that the size/weight/expense tradeoffs of a full-frame system were too great, given my photographic needs. What the latest generation of APS-C cameras makes clear is that it is such tradeoffs are harder to justify in terms of IQ at all ISOs. Yes, with the new technology, FF will always be superior, but will it be of practical benefit for most shooters? I think that the answer is a definite "no."
I agree 101%.


QuoteOriginally posted by robgo2 Quote
So what if FF will be capable of ISO 100,000? In a few short years, APS-C may be there as well. I don't think that we can rule such things out. There are those for whom no ISO is high enough. I wish them happy shooting with their FF cameras, but I suspect that their numbers will be diminishing.
Rob
I think so too. The FF dslr's will get more complicated in order to diffenertiante themeseves form the " amateurish,""semi pro" etc. Until recently I could see a market for a simplified FF DSLR but with the pace of aps-sensors, a simplified FF dslr, no matter how much some prurists crave for that, won't happen again. it just won't sell.
10-22-2010, 01:30 AM   #30
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QuoteOriginally posted by ogl Quote
2. High ISO is still better with FF camera. The difference is not huge, but still ~ 1 stop for 5D Mk II and ~ 2 stops for D700/D3.
I saw quite some banding in the high-ISO shots of the 5D MkII. Did you see that too? I have yet to see any serious banding in the K-5 (maybe a hint of banding if you push the EV slider in RAW to +4 at ISO 51.600, but who does that???)

For me, the current high ISO of the K-5 is better than that of the 5D MkII and based on the reports it's better than the D700 too. But only at high ISO, at base ISO I think FF is still at advantage.
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