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11-11-2010, 08:00 PM   #1
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DPReview's bias at work, K-5 gets a bum rap.

I was going to post this in the News Rumor section, but since it's not quite clear as to what qualifies as what. I'll just throw it here instead.

So here's the BEEF:
Just recently DPReview published their presentation of the Canon EOS 60D. Now I don't know if any of you knew this or not, but DPReview has been long accused of being in bed with Canon over the years. And though I can't confirm or deny this, I do recall reading numerous posts regarding this prior to the time DPReview was bought-out by Amazon so many moons ago.

With this in mind, I have witnessed some of the most unbelievable(foolish even) review summaries from DPReview in all of digital camera history.
Yes.. is some ways, even more insulting to ones intelligence, than that of the clowns who can't tell their P&S from a DSLR if their lives depended on it type of reviews(Wired.com anyone?)

Anyways... so here we have it yet again!
DPReview, demonstrating their lavish propaganda machine, right before the eyes of the general public!

The Case:
In order to upsell the 60D against the competition, DPReview obviously faces the challenge of presenting it in such a way so that it will 'look good' amidst the masses.
But then again, one could rightfully ask... how could one accomplish such thing?

Why the answer is simple of course...
With no pride left to squander, we must do what any other challenger would do!
And here's how it's done:

Solution: "By carefully choosing the highest ranking formula, for one particular system, while selecting the least effective for the competition"
Resultant: "We gain the advantage of a preferred presentation"

-

The Evidence:
QuoteOriginally posted by dpreview:
The Canon 50/1.4 is distinctly soft wide open on APS-C, especially towards the corners. However central sharpness increases rapidly on stopping down, with the corners slowly but surely catching up. Optimum results are obtained between F5.6 and F8, at which point the lens is very sharp right across the frame; at smaller apertures, diffraction progessively reduces sharpness, with anything beyond F16 best avoided unless extreme depth of field is critical.
QuoteOriginally posted by dpreview:
The Pentax smc FA 50mm F1.4 The lens is distinctly soft wide open, and the checkerboard crops reveal extremely low contrast with blacks rendered as blue-grey. Sharpness improves rapidly on stopping down; it's very good at F2, and excellent right across the frame in the lens's 'sweet spot' around F2.8-5.6. (The 'doughnut' profile at these apertures, with the maximum sharpness no longer in the centre, is indicative of a slight focus shift as a result of spherical aberration.) Stopping down further results in softer images due to diffraction, with F18-22 probably best avoided.
The Results:



By sampling the Canon at f/8(for the Canon) and the compeition at f/9(for the competition) respectively, the desired effect is achieved.
No rhyme or reason... That's just how the cookies crumble over at DPReview.

.../rant out!


Last edited by JohnBee; 11-11-2010 at 08:56 PM.
11-11-2010, 08:04 PM   #2
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Is this a K-5 thread? Moving it to general photo.

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11-11-2010, 08:07 PM   #3
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QuoteOriginally posted by Adam Quote
Is this a K-5 thread? Moving it to general photo.
Yes it is.
The BIAS involves slanting the K-5 numbers.
I couldn't care less about the 60D
11-11-2010, 08:10 PM   #4
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Original Poster
PS. I've updated the thread with a sample to help demonstrate the issue in question.

11-11-2010, 08:35 PM   #5
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QuoteOriginally posted by JohnBee Quote
...
So what does DPReview do to present the mighty 60D?
...

I seem to recall the old adage here that says; the most harsh critic of bias is bias.

But maybe it's me who's biased; Because, fwiw I've been considering buying a second body (alternate platform), and had after much gruelling 'till my eyes bled, the C.60D narrowed down into serious focus as 'clearly' the best overall in range tool that would meet most of my needs.

But now that bloody dpReview full(ish) review of it came on the scene!!! Cat among pigeons and all that, and they (of all) have resoundingly convinced me that it's a f..... POS and won't meet my needs and expectations as previously deduced!
So I s'pose I owe them in a way for what I got to read of their's as minimalist bullshit laying cards on tables, if only that I appreciate being saved a possible expensive mistake by some seeming non-myopic fixated on picking out petty x&y 'issues' reasonably broad coverage generally informative tome.

But of course by the same column-filling effluent filtered through other eyes and minds, they're biased! And, have a history of it... everyone™ knows... is shagging wife of... (add more well-worn cliches to reinforce argument, put on auto-cycle, rinse and repeat)

I just dunno -- but this Stone Soup is always good fun to read.

.R.

Last edited by Hypocorism; 11-11-2010 at 09:01 PM.
11-11-2010, 09:03 PM   #6
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Well ... I'll be ... !

To say the least, this "review" has me quite pissed off.

If DPReview is shagging Canon, what else are they "up to" (pun intended) when it comes to other successful brands? Let's face it, Nikon is no cheapo either; are they (DPR) also dancing with wolves here?

For those considering a second system, such as Hypocorism, what an insulting piece of doodly-doo!

Frankly, I have never in the past paid much attention to DPR stuff but this really opens my eyes!

Luckily, we have people on this forum who know enough about the intricacies of "testing" as to report such fraudulent behavior. Yes, I do think this is really installing false ideas in the consumers' minds.

That being said, I can't hardly wait to get my K5.

Cheers to you both and thanks for the appropriate and timely thread.

JP
11-11-2010, 09:12 PM   #7
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Those test shots are full of fail. Unless you're using something like the Takumar-A 28-80mm wide-open, the image will be sharper than that!

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11-11-2010, 10:07 PM   #8
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QuoteOriginally posted by Adam Quote
Those test shots are full of fail. Unless you're using something like the Takumar-A 28-80mm wide-open, the image will be sharper than that!
I think someone pointed out that the K-5 shots were upsized to match the 60D resolution. If this is true it might explain some of the softness.

I must admit i was quite surprised at the apparent softness of the K-5 images compared to both Nikon and Canon.

11-11-2010, 10:09 PM   #9
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Thats why I dont wait for DPR's reviews. I figured out this bias about 5 yrs ago. I dont care either about their ratings and awards, however its sad that lot of people make buying decisions based on Dpreview's conclusions/ratings/gold-silver awards. I trust my eyes and honesty of common photographer like us who post on forums their opinions and images.
Only thing I like about DPR is their buzzing forum.

Atindra
11-11-2010, 10:17 PM   #10
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d7000 has a yellow cast too, makes me wonder if its the camera or the testers messing up the white balance.
11-11-2010, 10:20 PM   #11
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Since both lenses were in their "sweet spot" at f/5.6, that would seem to have been the best choice. Interesting find...
11-11-2010, 10:22 PM   #12
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...but then again, I don't know if there would have been depth of field issues at f/5.6. Regardless, it seems like if they shot the Pentax at f/9, they should have done the same for the Canon.
11-11-2010, 10:23 PM   #13
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With DPReview, the trick is not to read the summaries at the end, but to study the full review. That's how I chose the K200D when they carped about the oversharpened jpegs, because they told me the "problem" could be overcome with in-camera settings or by shooting RAW. For the same reasons, I realized that the K20D was better than their final summary and recommendations, and that the 'tendency' for the K20 to underexpose (mine does) could be easily controlled (mine is).

The final summary and recommendations are where the most opportunity for bias comes in. If you don't trust them, you are much better off. For the same reasons, I don't trust the reviews of Pentax cameras or lenses by Pentax users or lovers, either (pace Adam).

That being said, I didn't find the review of the Canon 60D to be all that bad. Except for the articulated screen in Live View not being able to refresh fast enough for tracking action still shots, the camera looks pretty doggone good to me, mostly because I don't give a rat's asterisk about video on a dSLR.

On the other hand, dpreview gave a Gold Star Award to the Sony Alpha 55 BEFORE THEY HAD EVEN SEEN THE RAW FILES (on a preproduction model that couldn't shoot RAW). Now that is bias!

So either dpreview are gangbangers, or they are rather promiscuous. Either way, forget looking at the end of the review, and make up your own mind on the substantial stuff in the middle. So far, that has always led to me Pentax.
11-11-2010, 10:26 PM   #14
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It seems to be a fundamental flaw in the testing procedures that they are using completely different lenses. I think a better, more scientific approach would be to use a good 3rd party lens that is available in various mounts.

The lens I usually use on my K-x, the Tamron 28-75mm f/2.8, is distortion free at 40mm and is razor sharp at around f/8, and is available in various mounts. And as a FF lens, it produces excellent results on APS-C cameras. Why not use something like that to make sure that the playing field is level?
11-11-2010, 10:27 PM   #15
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QuoteOriginally posted by snofox Quote
So either dpreview are gangbangers, or they are rather promiscuous.
HAHAHAHAHA!

QuoteOriginally posted by Edgar_in_Indy Quote
It seems to be a fundamental flaw in the testing procedures that they are using completely different lenses. I think a better, more scientific approach would be to use a good 3rd party lens that is available in various mounts.
Makes perfect sense!
And are we the only ones thinking this way?
I have a very hard time believing no one else over at DPReview hasn't thought of such a thing tbh.
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