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11-25-2010, 09:36 PM   #121
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QuoteOriginally posted by falconeye Quote
And that the K-5 renders tack-sharp images.
... I once looked at the tip of a tack under a microscope and thought "pffft! that's not sharp"

Having said that, I was mucking around with Capture NX-2 this evening and noticed that it had an elaborate moire control panel. I didn't get a chance to test it out, but I'm wondering if this wouldn't address the potential side-effects of the weaker AA filter on the D7K and.... what effects that might have on final IQ(might be interesting).

Other than that, I've been thinking of conducting some controlled tests with a K-5 and D7K using the same lens. And I wondered if anyone thought of an M42 Super Takumar(SMC) 55/1.8 would be suitable for the task?

I plan on shooting some resolution charts and various color patterns with the hope of establishing some form of conclusiveness with regards to the differences between both systems. The target date is this weekend, so if anyone has any suggestions and/or ideas to add, I'd love to hear them.

11-25-2010, 09:41 PM   #122
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Enjoyed the back and forth feuding......good points all around....I guess, but I have seen the K5 Photos posted all over the place, and they are Most Excellent! Granted, I am just an old Squirrel shooter, not much on pixel peekin' and certainly not qualified to judge any high tech test results, but I have already seen some damn good Squirrel shots with the K5 and intend to have me one very soon!....K5 that is, I already have more Squirrels than I can feed.
Best Regards!
11-25-2010, 09:46 PM   #123
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QuoteOriginally posted by falconeye Quote
JP, my entire post was meant to illustrate that "MTF" shouldn't be used in any single plain English language sentence. Not in mine and not in the OP. Nor in any "review" hiding "MTF" behind "resolution".

And that the K-5 renders tack-sharp images.
OK. K-5 has better resolution than all previous Pentax cameras, but...
photos looks not better than all previous cameras in term of sharpness.
Even resized. And even worse in some cases.


Not huge difference with K-7, but there is. And higher difference with 10 MP CCD and 12 MP CMOS.

To say honest, K-5's IQ is better than 7D. And the structure of picture is not bad.


http://fotkidepo.ru/?id=album:32163
here are (there are full-sizes pictures there) rather good pictures in terms of sharpness with Sigma 70/2.8 and not bad picture of house with DA17-70.
but, there is some blur.




This is PEF file from DPREVIEW's review made with cheapest 18-55 DAL
http://www.*************/reviews/pentaxkx/page14.asp

What can I say? Very good sharpness level even with default settings.
Put 18-55 at K-5 and you never get such photo.
http://fotkidepo.ru/photo/132601/32162qXOjQehHIw/E9QALj3fZV/567107.jpg
11-25-2010, 10:38 PM   #124
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QuoteOriginally posted by ogl Quote
This is PEF file from DPREVIEW's review made with cheapest 18-55 DAL
Speaking of the K-5 and kit lenses, what do you think about PhotographyBlog's K-5 sample PEF's, by the way:
Pentax K-5 Review - Sample Images | PhotographyBLOG

Are they of any use?

11-25-2010, 10:44 PM   #125
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Falk, first of all thanks for your "Thanks giving present". Your findings are what I expected and I'm glad Pentax did the right thing.

QuoteOriginally posted by falconeye Quote
I don't have time to involve myself into this but may give him a ring
That'll be great. There ought to be a lesson in all this for someone. If it turns out that I will have learned something after all this has been resolved, that'll be fine by me!

QuoteOriginally posted by falconeye Quote
MTF50 isn't measuring resolution.
To be fair and precise, Klaus didn't use the term "resolution" but "pixel-to-pixel sharpness" and I computed the 6% difference from the LP/PH figures he provided for the K10D & K-5 respectively.

My slight imprecision notwithstanding, I think the message was accurate in spirit.
11-25-2010, 10:53 PM   #126
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QuoteOriginally posted by ogl Quote
OK. K-5 has better resolution than all previous Pentax cameras, but...
photos looks not better than all previous cameras in term of sharpness.
?
What is your definition of "resolution" and "sharpness"? What makes you think you cannot achieve the latter (which typically is assumed to be a combination of resolution and contrast) with appropriate sharpening (contrast boost)?

QuoteOriginally posted by ogl Quote
Even resized.
I don't think the resizing was done appropriately for this purpose.

If you continue to claim that the K200D / K-x give you better sharpness than the K-5 then I can only assume that you are not looking correctly. Maybe you should try my 6MP K100D? There's more pixel to pixel contrast than with any of the other cameras mentioned here. But of course this is irrelevant for image sharpness.

You shouldn't hold it against the K-5 that it is a better microscope and thus makes the tack appear less sharp.
11-25-2010, 11:11 PM   #127
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QuoteOriginally posted by ogl Quote
No. it's not sharp.
A) That picture was taken at ISO 12800. I think it is VERY sharp for that ISO.

B) The picture was of a freaking knife. How could you miss the joke???

C) Here is a picture YOU took https://www.pentaxforums.com/gallery/images/4485/1_IMGP5727.jpg

I've seen much sharper images from the K5... e.g.,

https://www.pentaxforums.com/forums/1280571-post31.html

Stop pixel peeping, you don't know what you are doing. If you fail to understand the difference that increasing pixel density will have on your pictures viewed at 100%, you should save your money anyways because you aren't going to make use of this new, improved technology.

And it is improved. There is lots of DATA to substantiate that claim.

Last edited by paperbag846; 11-25-2010 at 11:17 PM.
11-25-2010, 11:16 PM   #128
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QuoteOriginally posted by JohnBee Quote
Super Takumar(SMC) 55/1.8
You could do that, but I would suggest having a look here Nifty 50 Shootout ERPhotoReview and considering using a sharper lens for this kind of work. These sensors are likely capable of better sharpness and contrast than the 55 1.8 is able to deliver.

11-25-2010, 11:57 PM   #129
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QuoteOriginally posted by rawr Quote
Speaking of the K-5 and kit lenses, what do you think about PhotographyBlog's K-5 sample PEF's, by the way:
Pentax K-5 Review - Sample Images | PhotographyBLOG

Are they of any use?
Already got it and converted. No good result for me.
11-26-2010, 12:02 AM   #130
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QuoteOriginally posted by Class A Quote
?
What is your definition of "resolution" and "sharpness"? What makes you think you cannot achieve the latter (which typically is assumed to be a combination of resolution and contrast) with appropriate sharpening (contrast boost)?
Sharpness is the combination of resolution and contrast.
The sharpness capacity of camera with weak or without AA filter is higher.
11-26-2010, 12:04 AM   #131
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QuoteOriginally posted by paperbag846 Quote
A) That picture was taken at ISO 12800. I think it is VERY sharp for that ISO.
To make photos at ISO12800 and then discuss the sharpness of such photos is absurdly.
11-26-2010, 12:09 AM   #132
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QuoteOriginally posted by paperbag846 Quote
A) That picture was taken at ISO 12800. I think it is VERY sharp for that ISO.


I've seen much sharper images from the K5... e.g.,


Can't you really understand that such photо has VERY GOOD resolution and rather mediocre sharpness?
Don't you see that even 100% crop is a bit blurry?
11-26-2010, 12:33 AM   #133
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QuoteOriginally posted by ogl Quote

What can I say? Very good sharpness level even with default settings.
Put 18-55 at K-5 and you never get such photo.
http://fotkidepo.ru/photo/132601/32162qXOjQehHIw/E9QALj3fZV/567107.jpg
This photo sharpness and IQ is great. Wondering what lens is used, photome doesn't tell.
11-26-2010, 01:20 AM   #134
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QuoteOriginally posted by cbaytan Quote
This photo sharpness and IQ is great. Wondering what lens is used, photome doesn't tell.
It's K-x with DAL18-55 at 35 mm @f8
(smc PENTAX-DA 18-55mm F3.5-5.6 AL II)
11-26-2010, 04:32 AM   #135
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The last from me on the subject. K-5, ISO 80, FA43 Limited, f/5.6, fullsize (focus is on top leftmost flower). Converted in ACR and saved as JPEG. If this is not good enough then I feel very sorry for you.

http://www.camerac.nl/foto/flowers.jpg

Last edited by Asahiflex; 11-26-2010 at 04:38 AM.
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