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12-01-2010, 07:56 PM   #31
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QuoteOriginally posted by Kazy Quote

Do ever want to try shooting tethered on Pentax? Too bad. Pentax stopped supporting it after the K20D.

Most importantly is the flash system. If you use flash, you're going to get a LOT more out of Nikon's CLS system than Pentax's wireless flash system which doesn't do nearly as much.

In reality, the D7000 outclasses the K-5 in anything that matters in a real-world setting. And it does it for $400 less. So the people saying that the Nikon glass is more expensive? The price difference in the cameras more than makes up for it.
I thought I read that the K-5 can do tethered shooting now, but I'm not sure about that.

The flash system is an important point. I'd say this is true from what I've heard about Nikon flashes, combined with my experience with Pentax' flashes.

But I disagree with the "anything that matters in a real-world setting" statement. I think there are many real-world settings where the K-5 would be preferred.

As to the price, I found it rather humorous last night when dpreview posted the 7000D review - according to their price links, the prices for the K-5 and 7000D are the same right now! Apparently online retailers, such as Amazon, are offering the 7000D for $300 over list price, while the K-5 is being offered for around $100 under! I presume this is due to short supply of the Nikon right now. Since the Pentax' price is expected to keep dropping, I think they may both be at near-parity for a while.

The $400 price difference is an aberration. It's $0 - $300 now. The Nikon should drop little because it's already considered a bargain at list.

However, even a $400 difference would never "more than make up" for the difference in lens costs. It's completely irrelevant, in fact. To make the most of these bodies one is going to have to invest a minimum of $3000-$4000 in lenses (if that's his only system). In Pentax, it only takes 3 FA Ltds and 2 DA* zooms to hit that mark, and one still hasn't covered ultra-wide/Fisheye, Macro, or 200mm+ needs. In Nikon that will get you a 24-70/2.8 and one of the 70-200/2.8 VRs - two of the best lenses you can buy - but an even less complete kit. You could then add the 14-24/2.8 for another $1500-2000. At that point you absolutely will have superior zooms, but only one with VR and nothing faster than f/2.8, at a much higher cost. You can finish off the kit with other fantastic current Nikon glass - each of which will also cost more than Pentax.

So while I can accept the possibility that someone may be able to put together used Nikon glass cheaper than Pentax, I think the statement that the body's cost matters at all damages the credibility of the entire argument.

Does anyone else have insight as to whether the "cheaper Nikon glass" argument is still valid?

12-01-2010, 08:26 PM   #32
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I think it all depends on what you are looking for. Buy for the glass and get the body that you can afford. Eventually you will up grade your body, but the glass will remain the same from camera to camera. People generally buy into Nikon for the upper end zooms, which are very nice and very expensive. Without repeating all of the now long gone posts, I think Pentax offers reasonably priced weather sealing options (which Nikon doesn't have) and its DA * lenses are cheaper than Nikon equivalents (although they will likely focus slower).

It is hard to compare individual lenses, because if you try to, you can make any system look expensive or cheap, depending on which lenses you choose. The Nikon 70-200 f2.8 VR II is currently selling for 2300 dollars on Amazon -- that's enough to buy a couple of D7000s.
12-01-2010, 08:31 PM   #33
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QuoteOriginally posted by Kazy Quote
In reality, the D7000 outclasses the K-5 in anything that matters in a real-world setting. And it does it for $400 less. So the people saying that the Nikon glass is more expensive? The price difference in the cameras more than makes up for it.
Having wrote a much more detailed response earlier which has since been lost, I'll just summarize the exchange.

JohnBee: Nah...
Kazy: Nuhuuh...
JohnBee: uhuuh...
Kazy: Nuhuuh...

JohnBee: prove it...
Kazy: "crickets..."

12-02-2010, 05:03 AM   #34
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What the trolls are missing is that what the K7000 (or any competitors camera) can or can't do doesn't matter much on a Pentax dedicated forum. I'm far more interested in what my camera can do than what a camera that I have absolutely no interest in is able to muster.
The trolls just don't seem to get this, and so they keep coming back like the drunken jerk who won't leave you alone at the bar.
I guess all a person can do is dream of two to the chest, one to the head for these morons, and put them on ignore, in the hope that they'll grow up and figure out that what they want to talk about, or at least the way they want to talk about it, is immature sandbox talk that wouldn't even be tolerated from a 4 year old.

12-02-2010, 09:39 AM   #35
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Having bought into the Pentax system, it would take an awful lot to make me want to flip my lenses and bodies. When a new camera body comes out, I try to figure out if there are enough improvements from the previous body to make me want to get it, or if I can skip a generation. I know there are people who switch systems regularly, but I am sure they take a financial loss each time they do so and my feeling is that in the end they aren't happier than if they had stuck with their original brand.

I do want to see Pentax turn out cameras and lenses that match up well against the competition, as it will guarantee that there will continue to be new, great products coming out.
12-02-2010, 09:43 AM   #36
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QuoteOriginally posted by Rondec Quote
I do want to see Pentax turn out cameras and lenses that match up well against the competition, as it will guarantee that there will continue to be new, great products coming out.
+1 and I will add to it that we should not see any more third party lens makers leaving Pentax. Cosina and Zeiss both have stopped production for k mount now.
12-02-2010, 10:03 AM   #37
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I am also seeing better futures for Pentax than the Canikons... as I rather have a k-5 combo with Pentax EVIL (APS-C) next year than a 5D MKII combo with G12; as most of my friends have. The sensor based SR plays well in the EVIL mirrorless space with smaller lenses which will be dominated by Sony and Pentax. Canikon will have a tougher time to compete since they have mostly bulky lenses.

That's why I don't really care too much whether D7k is better or equal to k-5 in every respect... I would still prefer k-5, for me anyway and I don't have to justify that to anyone.

Last edited by aleonx3; 12-02-2010 at 11:09 AM. Reason: added one more comment.
12-02-2010, 10:33 AM   #38
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QuoteOriginally posted by dexmus Quote
+1 and I will add to it that we should not see any more third party lens makers leaving Pentax. Cosina and Zeiss both have stopped production for k mount now.
I'll miss new Cosina/Voitlanders [I got the two I wanted at the time ...how much you wanna offer me for my Voigtlander 125/2.5? ] but Zeiss always seemed to call for a higher pricetag than warranted to me. It appears Sigma is filling the hole nicely w/their exceptional AF macros and large pricetag long lenses. ... I'll take that MF->AF / short->long swap of offerings.

12-02-2010, 05:10 PM   #39
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D7000 sounds like a DUD now

I'm the OP of this thread asking about shutter life between the d7000 and k-5. After a little more research I found that MANY people are having problems with hot or dead pixels in the d7000 while I can find none of this for the K-5. There is a cnet review on the d7000 and 4 out of 6 user opinions had this happen. On another nikon forum I read some guy had many hot pixels (either 10 or 15 cant remember) basically enough to where it would be OBVIOUS in video and he returned it to nikon for repair...nikon sent it back stating it was within their tolerances and it needed nothing...the guy takes it back to the store...tests two more BRAND NEW ones at the store...and both have them too (the story I present here may not be exact but you get the picture). The problem appears to be rampant.

I WOULDNT TOUCH THAT THING WITH A 10 FOOT POLE.

I really feel sorry for those people that bought the d7000 now, especially online. Wow with nikons response especially to the guy that sent it back, I don't ever think I would be interested in ANY nikon now or in the future. boy the nikon QC really dropped the ball on this one...seriously how could they not know about this before making them available...WOW
12-02-2010, 05:15 PM   #40
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QuoteOriginally posted by harleynitelite Quote
I'm the OP of this thread asking about shutter life between the d7000 and k-5. After a little more research I found that MANY people are having problems with hot or dead pixels in the d7000 while I can find none of this for the K-5. There is a cnet review on the d7000 and 4 out of 6 user opinions had this happen. On another nikon forum I read some guy had many hot pixels (either 10 or 15 cant remember) basically enough to where it would be OBVIOUS in video and he returned it to nikon for repair...nikon sent it back stating it was within their tolerances and it needed nothing...the guy takes it back to the store...tests two more BRAND NEW ones at the store...and both have them too (the story I present here may not be exact but you get the picture). The problem appears to be rampant.

I WOULDNT TOUCH THAT THING WITH A 10 FOOT POLE.

I really feel sorry for those people that bought the d7000 now, especially online. Wow with nikons response especially to the guy that sent it back, I don't ever think I would be interested in ANY nikon now or in the future. boy the nikon QC really dropped the ball on this one...seriously how could they not know about this before making them available...WOW
Quoted for Kazy's benefit.
12-02-2010, 05:23 PM   #41
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QuoteOriginally posted by harleynitelite Quote
I'm the OP of this thread asking about shutter life between the d7000 and k-5. After a little more research I found that MANY people are having problems with hot or dead pixels in the d7000 while I can find none of this for the K-5. There is a cnet review on the d7000 and 4 out of 6 user opinions had this happen. On another nikon forum I read some guy had many hot pixels (either 10 or 15 cant remember) basically enough to where it would be OBVIOUS in video and he returned it to nikon for repair...nikon sent it back stating it was within their tolerances and it needed nothing...the guy takes it back to the store...tests two more BRAND NEW ones at the store...and both have them too (the story I present here may not be exact but you get the picture). The problem appears to be rampant.

I WOULDNT TOUCH THAT THING WITH A 10 FOOT POLE.

I really feel sorry for those people that bought the d7000 now, especially online. Wow with nikons response especially to the guy that sent it back, I don't ever think I would be interested in ANY nikon now or in the future. boy the nikon QC really dropped the ball on this one...seriously how could they not know about this before making them available...WOW
hot pixels are not a problem when you can map them out... the D7000 doesn't allow that
also, bare in mind this

Roger’s Rule of Problem Announcements: Once its announced that 5% of lens X has a certain problem, 50% of the members of any online forum will announce their lens has the problem. Whether they own lens X or not.
same goes for cameras
12-02-2010, 05:36 PM   #42
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Two key issues you should think about. Lens availablility and external flash performance. Pentax lacks in both areas.
12-02-2010, 05:50 PM - 1 Like   #43
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QuoteOriginally posted by HeavyD Quote
Two key issues you should think about. Lens availablility and external flash performance. Pentax lacks in both areas.
I find it amusing you pushing the lens availability argument when you have OK Nikon & Canon bodies, both fitted with two very ordinary consumer grade lenses.
12-02-2010, 05:52 PM   #44
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QuoteOriginally posted by HeavyD Quote
Two key issues you should think about. Lens availablility and external flash performance. Pentax lacks in both areas.
Unless A: what Pentax has available suits your needs, and B, if Nikon's superior flash performance matters a whit to you.
It's already been pointed out that Pentax is still somewhat less expensive to buy lenses for, and until Nikon gets decent anti reflection coatings that clean up the rather severe flare that their lenses can be prone to, the only hard reason to buy a Nikon is if you really need what they offer in their upper tier 135 form factor bodies where Pentax doesn't compete.
12-02-2010, 05:53 PM   #45
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This question should be asked on a Canon forum to get rid of bias.

My opinion would be:

1. Make a budget
2. Pick what lenses you want from each system
3. Compare costs
4. Decide on system
5. Pick a body that suits your needs from that system.

Body should be last thing to worry about, because in a year, it will be obsolete. Lenses could last decades or more.
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