Win a Pentax Limited Lens: Raffle Now Live!

Rupert · 01-01-2011, 02:40 PM

Originally posted by Wheatfield

Nice one Rupert.
I found with the K20 that I wasn't really happy with it past ISO 800, and I preferred staying at ISO640 or lower. The K5 seems to be as good at 3200 as the k20 was at 640, so there is a couple of stops and perhaps a bit more of ISO advantage. In the handheld at 1/20th scenario above, that couple of stops advantage could put you up to 1/100 second, though judging from the picture above, you are steady enough that it might not matter so much.
If nothing else, it would give you the ability to stop any slight motion from the subject.
And yes, I am trying to enable you into a K5....

Yes, 1/100 would cover me well in most situations. I am already planning on the K5, just waiting for a little while to let the glitches be gone......should not be long. As for FF, it does not suit my needs as well since I benefit from the crop factor on wildlife, and for everything else the difference in IQ, if you look at the K5 sots posted here in this Forum is minimal, at best. I have been well pleased with the K20D for my "Studio" adventures and although FF might be better, not enough to be worth the extra expense and lenses involved. I print mostly 8x10 or under and can go 12X19 with no problem.
I do recall where that Nikon Expert, can't recall his name now, posted two photos 8x10 crops from the D300 and D700 and asked to pick the best...couldn't be done past the point of pure chance, and so for many users FF is just not a necessity. DOF....another story, but not as important to some as others.

If the K5 is operating as specified, it is the camera to beat for most shooters, it hits all the right spots and even the price is now in line better to my liking.
Best Regards!

30v iPentax · 01-02-2011, 02:16 AM

Minäkin odotan uutta seuraajaa K-5. Täyden koon kennolla ja joku muu parempi, kun Sony.

gybp · 01-02-2011, 04:15 AM

ah.. another request for the K6/K4. please pentax please make the flash sync speed 1/250 or even 1/500, 1/160 is simply not enough these days...

tethering
manual controls with video
flash sync speed of at last 1/250
dual slot sd cards
better AF
better IS

Wheatfield · 01-02-2011, 07:00 AM

Originally posted by gybp

ah.. another request for the K6/K4. please pentax please make the flash sync speed 1/250 or even 1/500, 1/160 is simply not enough these days...

The flash sync thing has been discussed to death. If you want a faster flash sync, you will likely find that a flash that can take advantage of it will be a lot more expensive than what you are buying now, and present flashes will not allow full advantage of the higher sync speed.
This is a fairly well known problem with Canon and their high sync speed cameras.

**NaClH2O** · 01-02-2011, 07:49 AM

Originally posted by Rupert

There are all types of shooters here....needs are different for all of them, but my "old" K20D is still better than I am.....so when I get the K5 I can't imagine looking too far ahead for another model, it seems to have more of everything that I will be upgrading for.
My youngest son is going for his fourth wife this year.......do you ever reckon that the "problems" we have might be us, and a new model will not bring the satisfaction we seek? Just asking.......
Best Regards! & Happy New Year to All Here!

+1
I too have the K20D and it is more than "good enough" for my skill level. Not that I'm not lusting after the K-5, unfortunately it is out of my price range right now. Hopefully I'll get a big enough tax return to be able to afford it w/o having to endure months of hotdogs and pb&j sandwiches.
As to #4 son, you might pass on this bit of wisdom from my brother after marriage #3 went south
"I'm not getting married again, I'll just find some woman I can learn to hate, buy her a house, buy her a car and be done with it".

NaCl(in the immortal words of Pogo - "We have met the enemy and he is us" )H2O

RonHendriks1966 · 01-02-2011, 09:15 AM

Well if we adding wishes then my biggest wish is a faster system. PRIME III or dual PRIME II with DDR3 memory and SDXC. So make it again snappy because the K-5 is kinda slowish in some points.

gybp · 01-02-2011, 03:31 PM

Originally posted by Wheatfield

The flash sync thing has been discussed to death. If you want a faster flash sync, you will likely find that a flash that can take advantage of it will be a lot more expensive than what you are buying now, and present flashes will not allow full advantage of the higher sync speed.
This is a fairly well known problem with Canon and their high sync speed cameras.

almost every modern digital camera syncs at 1/250 with normal flashes...

enoeske · 01-02-2011, 03:46 PM

Originally posted by gybp

almost every modern digital camera syncs at 1/250 with normal flashes...

Canon syncs at 1/250th

Nikon 1/200 (except their hybrid electronic shutter ones)

Pentax 1/180

Leaf shutters at any speed

So, no, not every modern digital camera syncs at 1/250

kenyee · 01-02-2011, 03:56 PM

Originally posted by Wheatfield

As the K5 sits, it has one issue that I think is pretty serious, in that there is no easy work around for it in a lot of instances, this being what appears to be mirror slap at shutter speeds approaching the low end of hand holdable.
If what you do with the camera involves a lot of shooting in or around the 1/15 second range, the K5 might be a frustrating camera to use.

Does this manifest as a slightly blurred image or a very blurred image?
Curious what it looks like...

RonHendriks1966 · 01-02-2011, 03:59 PM

Originally posted by gybp

almost every modern digital camera syncs at 1/250 with normal flashes...

and what to think of Leica M9 at 1/160th or Sony with the Alpha 55 also 1/160th. On the Sony Alpha 900/850 it's only 1/250th with SteadyShot turned OFF.

Wheatfield · 01-02-2011, 05:56 PM

Originally posted by gybp

almost every modern digital camera syncs at 1/250 with normal flashes...

You are missing the technical aspect of flash. I just checked, Nikon appears to be the only manufacturer that publishes their flash duration time (~1/880) at full power.
Canon and Pentax don't appear to, nor Metz.
However, I have read on a couple of Canon oriented forums of people getting mysterious underexposures with fill flash at 1/250. It turns out that the flash units in question have a very long burn duration of ~1/200 second.
It wouldn't surprise me at all to find that the present Pentax flash units also have long burn durations.
My Metz 60 series flash has a full output burn duration of ~1/200 second as well.
The point you missed is that it may be all well and good to ask for a faster sync speed, but you need to be aware of what your flash output duration is since you may not be able to take advantage of that sync speed.

campdog · 01-02-2011, 06:21 PM

Originally posted by gybp

have you see what people is doing with the 5D, 7D, D7000? do you know that they recorded a House episode with a 5D?

Ive got a $40 VCR that records House. I wonder if my VCR takes photos.

Wheatfield · 01-02-2011, 06:24 PM

Originally posted by kenyee

Does this manifest as a slightly blurred image or a very blurred image?
Curious what it looks like...

OK, here are 3 pictures from an HDR series. The top image is shot at 1/40 sec, the second is a 100% of it, the bottom image is a crop of the next image in the sequence shot at 1/13 second.
All images were shot at f/11 with the 60-250 using a Feisol Tournament tripod and CB-50D head.
This combination is a bit heavy for this tripod.

kenyee · 01-02-2011, 07:13 PM

Thanks Wheatfield. FWIW, the last photo looked like the photos I saw out of a K5 at a show...indoor lighting and shutter was roughly 1/15 w/ a DA15. I've gotten decent photos out of a K20D at similar shutter speeds at 17mm..

violini · 01-03-2011, 10:00 AM

I would like to see the future cameras have no mirror and shutter. All you have to do are to adjust the parameters till you get the composition in live-view you want, then press a remote and the camera will record that particular frame. These mechanical mirror and shutter are very much stone-age in design.

01-02-2011, 06:24 PM	#58
Wheatfield Moderator Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: The wheatfields of Canada Posts: 15,991	Originally posted by kenyee Does this manifest as a slightly blurred image or a very blurred image? Curious what it looks like... OK, here are 3 pictures from an HDR series. The top image is shot at 1/40 sec, the second is a 100% of it, the bottom image is a crop of the next image in the sequence shot at 1/13 second. All images were shot at f/11 with the 60-250 using a Feisol Tournament tripod and CB-50D head. This combination is a bit heavy for this tripod. Last edited by Wheatfield; 02-05-2011 at 08:44 PM.

Similar Threads
Thread	Thread Starter	Forum	Replies	Last Post
How long will fresh batteries last in long exposure?	tnis0612	Troubleshooting and Beginner Help	6	05-18-2010 09:11 AM
Poll...how long is long enough for images?	FHPhotographer	Photo Critique	5	04-12-2009 02:30 PM
How long can they do?	axl	Pentax SLR Lens Discussion	3	04-02-2009 07:44 PM
How long is long enough? Bulb Setting	Garlic Capital Newby	Pentax DSLR Discussion	18	03-03-2009 10:58 AM
Some impressions from the DA* 50-135 (long...too long...)	lol101	Pentax SLR Lens Discussion	11	12-14-2007 10:17 AM

01-01-2011, 02:40 PM	#46
Rupert Veteran Member Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Texas Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 25,123	Originally posted by Wheatfield Nice one Rupert. I found with the K20 that I wasn't really happy with it past ISO 800, and I preferred staying at ISO640 or lower. The K5 seems to be as good at 3200 as the k20 was at 640, so there is a couple of stops and perhaps a bit more of ISO advantage. In the handheld at 1/20th scenario above, that couple of stops advantage could put you up to 1/100 second, though judging from the picture above, you are steady enough that it might not matter so much. If nothing else, it would give you the ability to stop any slight motion from the subject. And yes, I am trying to enable you into a K5.... Yes, 1/100 would cover me well in most situations. I am already planning on the K5, just waiting for a little while to let the glitches be gone......should not be long. As for FF, it does not suit my needs as well since I benefit from the crop factor on wildlife, and for everything else the difference in IQ, if you look at the K5 sots posted here in this Forum is minimal, at best. I have been well pleased with the K20D for my "Studio" adventures and although FF might be better, not enough to be worth the extra expense and lenses involved. I print mostly 8x10 or under and can go 12X19 with no problem. I do recall where that Nikon Expert, can't recall his name now, posted two photos 8x10 crops from the D300 and D700 and asked to pick the best...couldn't be done past the point of pure chance, and so for many users FF is just not a necessity. DOF....another story, but not as important to some as others. If the K5 is operating as specified, it is the camera to beat for most shooters, it hits all the right spots and even the price is now in line better to my liking. Best Regards!

01-02-2011, 02:16 AM	#47
30v iPentax Inactive Account Join Date: Apr 2010 Location: Suomi , Finland Posts: 368	Minäkin odotan uutta seuraajaa K-5. Täyden koon kennolla ja joku muu parempi, kun Sony.

01-02-2011, 04:15 AM	#48
gybp Senior Member Join Date: Nov 2009 Photos: Gallery Posts: 165 Original Poster	ah.. another request for the K6/K4. please pentax please make the flash sync speed 1/250 or even 1/500, 1/160 is simply not enough these days... tethering manual controls with video flash sync speed of at last 1/250 dual slot sd cards better AF better IS

01-02-2011, 07:00 AM	#49
Wheatfield Moderator Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: The wheatfields of Canada Posts: 15,991	Originally posted by gybp ah.. another request for the K6/K4. please pentax please make the flash sync speed 1/250 or even 1/500, 1/160 is simply not enough these days... The flash sync thing has been discussed to death. If you want a faster flash sync, you will likely find that a flash that can take advantage of it will be a lot more expensive than what you are buying now, and present flashes will not allow full advantage of the higher sync speed. This is a fairly well known problem with Canon and their high sync speed cameras.

01-02-2011, 07:49 AM	#50
NaClH2O Site Supporter Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Bronx NY Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 5,631	Originally posted by Rupert There are all types of shooters here....needs are different for all of them, but my "old" K20D is still better than I am.....so when I get the K5 I can't imagine looking too far ahead for another model, it seems to have more of everything that I will be upgrading for. My youngest son is going for his fourth wife this year.......do you ever reckon that the "problems" we have might be us, and a new model will not bring the satisfaction we seek? Just asking....... Best Regards! & Happy New Year to All Here! +1 I too have the K20D and it is more than "good enough" for my skill level. Not that I'm not lusting after the K-5, unfortunately it is out of my price range right now. Hopefully I'll get a big enough tax return to be able to afford it w/o having to endure months of hotdogs and pb&j sandwiches. As to #4 son, you might pass on this bit of wisdom from my brother after marriage #3 went south "I'm not getting married again, I'll just find some woman I can learn to hate, buy her a house, buy her a car and be done with it". NaCl(in the immortal words of Pogo - "We have met the enemy and he is us" )H2O

01-02-2011, 09:15 AM	#51
RonHendriks1966 Banned Join Date: Jan 2009 Photos: Gallery Posts: 9,675	Well if we adding wishes then my biggest wish is a faster system. PRIME III or dual PRIME II with DDR3 memory and SDXC. So make it again snappy because the K-5 is kinda slowish in some points.

01-02-2011, 03:31 PM	#52
gybp Senior Member Join Date: Nov 2009 Photos: Gallery Posts: 165 Original Poster	Originally posted by Wheatfield The flash sync thing has been discussed to death. If you want a faster flash sync, you will likely find that a flash that can take advantage of it will be a lot more expensive than what you are buying now, and present flashes will not allow full advantage of the higher sync speed. This is a fairly well known problem with Canon and their high sync speed cameras. almost every modern digital camera syncs at 1/250 with normal flashes...

01-02-2011, 03:46 PM	#53
enoeske Veteran Member Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: Surprise, Az Photos: Gallery Posts: 2,136	Originally posted by gybp almost every modern digital camera syncs at 1/250 with normal flashes... Canon syncs at 1/250th Nikon 1/200 (except their hybrid electronic shutter ones) Pentax 1/180 Leaf shutters at any speed So, no, not every modern digital camera syncs at 1/250

01-02-2011, 03:56 PM	#54
kenyee Veteran Member Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Boston, PRofMA Photos: Albums Posts: 3,026	Originally posted by Wheatfield As the K5 sits, it has one issue that I think is pretty serious, in that there is no easy work around for it in a lot of instances, this being what appears to be mirror slap at shutter speeds approaching the low end of hand holdable. If what you do with the camera involves a lot of shooting in or around the 1/15 second range, the K5 might be a frustrating camera to use. Does this manifest as a slightly blurred image or a very blurred image? Curious what it looks like...

01-02-2011, 03:59 PM	#55
RonHendriks1966 Banned Join Date: Jan 2009 Photos: Gallery Posts: 9,675	Originally posted by gybp almost every modern digital camera syncs at 1/250 with normal flashes... and what to think of Leica M9 at 1/160th or Sony with the Alpha 55 also 1/160th. On the Sony Alpha 900/850 it's only 1/250th with SteadyShot turned OFF.

01-02-2011, 05:56 PM	#56
Wheatfield Moderator Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: The wheatfields of Canada Posts: 15,991	Originally posted by gybp almost every modern digital camera syncs at 1/250 with normal flashes... You are missing the technical aspect of flash. I just checked, Nikon appears to be the only manufacturer that publishes their flash duration time (~1/880) at full power. Canon and Pentax don't appear to, nor Metz. However, I have read on a couple of Canon oriented forums of people getting mysterious underexposures with fill flash at 1/250. It turns out that the flash units in question have a very long burn duration of ~1/200 second. It wouldn't surprise me at all to find that the present Pentax flash units also have long burn durations. My Metz 60 series flash has a full output burn duration of ~1/200 second as well. The point you missed is that it may be all well and good to ask for a faster sync speed, but you need to be aware of what your flash output duration is since you may not be able to take advantage of that sync speed.

01-02-2011, 06:21 PM	#57
campdog Senior Member Join Date: Oct 2009 Location: Bonny Hills, NSW, Australia Photos: Gallery Posts: 202	Originally posted by gybp have you see what people is doing with the 5D, 7D, D7000? do you know that they recorded a House episode with a 5D? Ive got a $40 VCR that records House. I wonder if my VCR takes photos.

01-02-2011, 07:13 PM	#59
kenyee Veteran Member Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Boston, PRofMA Photos: Albums Posts: 3,026	Thanks Wheatfield. FWIW, the last photo looked like the photos I saw out of a K5 at a show...indoor lighting and shutter was roughly 1/15 w/ a DA15. I've gotten decent photos out of a K20D at similar shutter speeds at 17mm..

01-03-2011, 10:00 AM	#60
violini Veteran Member Join Date: Aug 2010 Location: Winnipeg MB Photos: Gallery Posts: 350	I would like to see the future cameras have no mirror and shutter. All you have to do are to adjust the parameters till you get the composition in live-view you want, then press a remote and the camera will record that particular frame. These mechanical mirror and shutter are very much stone-age in design.

how long for the K6?

Win a Pentax Limited Lens: Raffle Now Live!