Relevant news re malfunctioning AF under artificial light

KansasHorizons.com · 02-07-2011, 03:40 PM

Originally posted by Michaelina2

The new K-5 arrived and I'm astounded by the difference between the two. The re-order K-5 (397XXXX, build date is mid-January 2011) is a total joy to use and perfect in all respects that are meaningful to me. None of my DA or FA lenses require any in-camera AF adjustment... period! High light... low light... AF is dead-on... dead-solid-perfect! Now, my requirements are not at the extreme limits of the camera's spec. In fact, if you look at page 75 of the K-5 Manual (English), I rarely encounter many (if any) of the conditions so described that might cause an AF issue. If I do, I set things to MF, like Pentax suggests, fiddle focus around then soldier on. Works for me...

Well I hope this is the case for me, I waited until yesterday to order mine (amazon) and it will arrive tomorrow. I still have my K-7 for a side by side test if need be but I am hoping to figure out everything I need to test in the first few days.

DaveBlack · 02-07-2011, 04:27 PM

I got my K-5 from B&H late last week. Serial No 397xxxx. I tried to get it to FF under low tungsen light and fouc was perfect. No sensor staining. AF for BIF was perfect. I am really happy with the camera so far. Camera and I are still in our "honeymoon" stage of our relationship but everying is great so far.

Christine Tham · 02-07-2011, 04:52 PM

Originally posted by DaveBlack

I got my K-5 from B&H late last week. Serial No 397xxxx. I tried to get it to FF under low tungsen light and fouc was perfect. No sensor staining. AF for BIF was perfect. I am really happy with the camera so far. Camera and I are still in our "honeymoon" stage of our relationship but everying is great so far.

Good on you.

Based on some of the recent comments, I tried my K-5 with several different lenses, primes and zooms, and I just can't get the camera to FF in low tungsten light at all (I was mainly shooting bookshelves from an angle with the lenses wide open).

I kept turning down the dimmer until the light was so low the AF assist came on. None of the shots came out FF, and I tried varying the angle, focus distance etc. to simulate different conditions.

So it seems the current batch of K-5 has fixed the problem, since we have at least three owners with serial number 39XXXXX who can't reproduce the problem.

Anyway, my last post in the thread. I feel sorry for owners who have experienced the problem - I think I too would have been angry under similar situations. I strongly urge you to consider exchanging your camera with a new one from the current production batch. It seems quite likely now that the problem is not just firmware but hardware as well (I'm running 1.01, haven't upgraded to 1.02 yet).

areidjr · 02-07-2011, 04:58 PM

Originally posted by Christine Tham

Good on you.
So it seems the current batch of K-5 has fixed the problem, since we have at least three owners with serial number 39XXXXX who can't reproduce the problem.
yet).

FYI, mine is 3984xxxxxxx and has the FF problem. Manufacturing date of 01/17/2011.

filorp · 02-07-2011, 05:19 PM

Originally posted by Christine Tham

Anyway, my last post in the thread.

you can tell to us what is Manufacturing date of your camera... please.

Smeggypants · 02-07-2011, 07:49 PM

Originally posted by Christine Tham

Good on you.

Based on some of the recent comments, I tried my K-5 with several different lenses, primes and zooms, and I just can't get the camera to FF in low tungsten light at all (I was mainly shooting bookshelves from an angle with the lenses wide open).

I kept turning down the dimmer until the light was so low the AF assist came on. None of the shots came out FF, and I tried varying the angle, focus distance etc. to simulate different conditions.

So it seems the current batch of K-5 has fixed the problem, since we have at least three owners with serial number 39XXXXX who can't reproduce the problem.

So 3 owners clinches the deal. Never mind the multitude of 39xxxxx owners who do have the FF problem. I'm one of them.

Quote:

Anyway, my last post in the thread. I feel sorry for owners who have experienced the problem - I think I too would have been angry under similar situations. I strongly urge you to consider exchanging your camera with a new one from the current production batch. It seems quite likely now that the problem is not just firmware but hardware as well (I'm running 1.01, haven't upgraded to 1.02 yet).

What part of "We are waiting for a firmware fix" do you not understand? My UK dealer has indicated a firmware fix is on the way. This is corroborated with several other sources, including someone from Pentax Germany.

Anyway the following are like Air Miles. I'm going to collect them ...

Originally posted by Christine Tham

Anyway, I'm bowing out of the thread..

Originally posted by Christine Tham

Anyway, my last post in the thread..

**jpzk** · 02-07-2011, 07:59 PM

I have received my new K5 about three weeks ago and no problems so far.
No stains, no AF problems, no dials issues either.
S.N. 397xxxx. Where do you find the build date?

JP

sewebster · 02-07-2011, 08:38 PM

Build date is likely hidden away in the exif. Seems weird that some cameras have the ff issue and some don't if it's something easily fixable in a firmware update...

falconeye · 02-07-2011, 08:46 PM

Originally posted by Christine Tham

I kept turning down the dimmer until the light was so low the AF assist came on. None of the shots came out FF, and I tried varying the angle, focus distance etc. to simulate different conditions.

Christine,

I'll going to share some formal test results and exact test procedure this week. It would be interesting to compare your and my findings then.

A question regarding AF assist light: if it goes on, does it just go on for the initial move or for the entire hunt till AF lock?

Mine would just go on for the initial move but not when close (the last hunting corrections). This makes it miss AF even if AF assist light goes on.

Moreover, I observed two focus problems in low light: The first is reduced but still acceptable focus. I.e., the focus is ok but not as tack sharp as with contrast AF. I didn't notice that outdor but wouldn't notice it without exact measurement anyway. So, I don't want to rule out a missing lens calibration yet.

The second probem is a complete miss. The exact conditions are a bit obscure and I am working to further clarify them. In any case, it would be difficult to clearly see the effect with f/4 or smaller without measuring it (which I did).

I keep you posted and I am keen to compare our findings.

30v iPentax · 02-07-2011, 10:50 PM

iPentax K-5 paras kamera, minulla ei ole vikoja ollenkaan.

**GregK8** · 02-07-2011, 10:56 PM

LOL, check out the second comment in this blog article from 2008

PENTAX DSLRs: PART-2. Autofocus Adjustment charts for fron and back focusing problems.

Quote:

Great charts. However myself and others are finding that the cameras (K20d at least) consistently Front focus when used in Tungsten lighting. And focus correctly when in Daylight and sometime florescent light. I think you should comment that in your blog, and I would love to see a Pentax response to this.

areidjr · 02-08-2011, 06:04 AM

Originally posted by falconeye

A question regarding AF assist light: if it goes on, does it just go on for the initial move or for the entire hunt till AF lock?

Mine would just go on for the initial move but not when close (the last hunting corrections). This makes it miss AF even if AF assist light goes on.

That's exactly what I see most of the time as well. Occasionally it seems to operate the way I'd expect (come on and be active until it locks focus). Usually just an initial burst then nothing for the balance of the focus operation.

BTW, I'm on my 3rd K-5 with FF issues. Cameras were manufactured in October, November and the latest in mid January. With the number of people stating that they have no FF issues at all (i.e. the camera focuses accurately regardless of light level or type), how confident, if at all, are you that a fix can be made through FW? I'm trying to decide whether to send this one back or hold off for a fix.

Rupert · 02-08-2011, 08:14 AM

Originally posted by jthommo

Thanks for the work Christine; I suspected this might be the case - thanks for confirming...and I agree a "fix" is unnecessary.

Perhaps it is now time for the two baying bloodhounds - Don and Rupert - to test their K20Ds (if they are capable of the task) to see how they perform.

Shot under tungsten light with my K20D and FA 43 Ltd handheld, F1.9 1/15 ISO 400 at about 18 inches away. Focus locked fast and accurate, good enough for me anyhow. I am not a big low light shooter, but I do use it some and this is about as low as I get.
If you can send me a K5 that will do at least this well for me, has no "lock-up"problems, no "bounced flash" problems, no "dial problems" no "sensor stains", no other of the defects that have been reported, by all means send it! I will be as thrilled as those that report theirs are perfect and I will go away and shoot happily ever after.
Best Regards

[IMG]

[/IMG]

Catalana · 02-08-2011, 09:25 AM

There is a huge "stain" in the right of the top image. So your K20D also has them..., just kidding. The focus looks spot on

Rupert · 02-08-2011, 10:12 AM

Originally posted by Catalana

There is a huge "stain" in the right of the top image. So your K20D also has them..., just kidding. The focus looks spot on

LOL! I have no idea if this meets the requirements of those with problems, not being a "technical" shooter, but this would fit my most demanding needs. My Nokton 58mm F1.4 also meets these needs on my K20D and I have never made a lens adjustment on any lens, although I won't argue that some would most likely benefit from it, at least marginally.

If the K5 can do this, and as I said, avoid having the other problems. I want one ASAP! I am not a perfectionist, not anything other than an enthusiastic amateur with little desire other than to snap away and have a ton of fun, but I do not want to deal with a string of problems. I took my K20D out of the box almost three years ago and started shooting without a single problem that wasn't due to my error. Happy is too mild a word for my K20D experience, and I have praised it at every opportunity ever since. I want to do the same with the K5, and hope that day comes, but I don't see it yet.
I've been beat up pretty good here, and with Alligator hide, I don't mind it too much. Popularity contests are not my cup of tea, I just want to take decent photos and enjoy those that others take, and that includes some here that are my worst adversaries. Life is more about the fun part to me than the technical...but I do expect my camera to perform to specifications and without major glitches.......serious problems are not fun, and neither is FedX Roulette.
Best Regards!

02-08-2011, 06:04 AM	#432
areidjr Veteran Member Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Pittsburgh, Pa, USA Photos: Gallery Posts: 529	Originally posted by falconeye A question regarding AF assist light: if it goes on, does it just go on for the initial move or for the entire hunt till AF lock? Mine would just go on for the initial move but not when close (the last hunting corrections). This makes it miss AF even if AF assist light goes on. That's exactly what I see most of the time as well. Occasionally it seems to operate the way I'd expect (come on and be active until it locks focus). Usually just an initial burst then nothing for the balance of the focus operation. BTW, I'm on my 3rd K-5 with FF issues. Cameras were manufactured in October, November and the latest in mid January. With the number of people stating that they have no FF issues at all (i.e. the camera focuses accurately regardless of light level or type), how confident, if at all, are you that a fix can be made through FW? I'm trying to decide whether to send this one back or hold off for a fix. Last edited by areidjr; 02-08-2011 at 06:10 AM.

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02-07-2011, 03:40 PM	#421
KansasHorizons.com Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2010 Location: Kansas Photos: Gallery Posts: 183	Originally posted by Michaelina2 The new K-5 arrived and I'm astounded by the difference between the two. The re-order K-5 (397XXXX, build date is mid-January 2011) is a total joy to use and perfect in all respects that are meaningful to me. None of my DA or FA lenses require any in-camera AF adjustment... period! High light... low light... AF is dead-on... dead-solid-perfect! Now, my requirements are not at the extreme limits of the camera's spec. In fact, if you look at page 75 of the K-5 Manual (English), I rarely encounter many (if any) of the conditions so described that might cause an AF issue. If I do, I set things to MF, like Pentax suggests, fiddle focus around then soldier on. Works for me... Well I hope this is the case for me, I waited until yesterday to order mine (amazon) and it will arrive tomorrow. I still have my K-7 for a side by side test if need be but I am hoping to figure out everything I need to test in the first few days.

02-07-2011, 04:27 PM	#422
DaveBlack Veteran Member Join Date: Jan 2011 Location: Louisville, Kentucky Posts: 441	I got my K-5 from B&H late last week. Serial No 397xxxx. I tried to get it to FF under low tungsen light and fouc was perfect. No sensor staining. AF for BIF was perfect. I am really happy with the camera so far. Camera and I are still in our "honeymoon" stage of our relationship but everying is great so far.

02-07-2011, 04:52 PM	#423
Christine Tham Veteran Member Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: Sydney, Australia Photos: Gallery Posts: 2,269	Originally posted by DaveBlack I got my K-5 from B&H late last week. Serial No 397xxxx. I tried to get it to FF under low tungsen light and fouc was perfect. No sensor staining. AF for BIF was perfect. I am really happy with the camera so far. Camera and I are still in our "honeymoon" stage of our relationship but everying is great so far. Good on you. Based on some of the recent comments, I tried my K-5 with several different lenses, primes and zooms, and I just can't get the camera to FF in low tungsten light at all (I was mainly shooting bookshelves from an angle with the lenses wide open). I kept turning down the dimmer until the light was so low the AF assist came on. None of the shots came out FF, and I tried varying the angle, focus distance etc. to simulate different conditions. So it seems the current batch of K-5 has fixed the problem, since we have at least three owners with serial number 39XXXXX who can't reproduce the problem. Anyway, my last post in the thread. I feel sorry for owners who have experienced the problem - I think I too would have been angry under similar situations. I strongly urge you to consider exchanging your camera with a new one from the current production batch. It seems quite likely now that the problem is not just firmware but hardware as well (I'm running 1.01, haven't upgraded to 1.02 yet).

02-07-2011, 04:58 PM	#424
areidjr Veteran Member Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Pittsburgh, Pa, USA Photos: Gallery Posts: 529	Originally posted by Christine Tham Good on you. So it seems the current batch of K-5 has fixed the problem, since we have at least three owners with serial number 39XXXXX who can't reproduce the problem. yet). FYI, mine is 3984xxxxxxx and has the FF problem. Manufacturing date of 01/17/2011.

02-07-2011, 05:19 PM	#425
filorp Veteran Member Join Date: Jun 2008 Location: Aberdeen Scotland Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 398	Originally posted by Christine Tham Anyway, my last post in the thread. you can tell to us what is Manufacturing date of your camera... please.

02-07-2011, 07:49 PM	#426
Smeggypants Veteran Member Join Date: Sep 2010 Posts: 1,536	Originally posted by Christine Tham Good on you. Based on some of the recent comments, I tried my K-5 with several different lenses, primes and zooms, and I just can't get the camera to FF in low tungsten light at all (I was mainly shooting bookshelves from an angle with the lenses wide open). I kept turning down the dimmer until the light was so low the AF assist came on. None of the shots came out FF, and I tried varying the angle, focus distance etc. to simulate different conditions. So it seems the current batch of K-5 has fixed the problem, since we have at least three owners with serial number 39XXXXX who can't reproduce the problem. So 3 owners clinches the deal. Never mind the multitude of 39xxxxx owners who do have the FF problem. I'm one of them. Quote: Anyway, my last post in the thread. I feel sorry for owners who have experienced the problem - I think I too would have been angry under similar situations. I strongly urge you to consider exchanging your camera with a new one from the current production batch. It seems quite likely now that the problem is not just firmware but hardware as well (I'm running 1.01, haven't upgraded to 1.02 yet). What part of "We are waiting for a firmware fix" do you not understand? My UK dealer has indicated a firmware fix is on the way. This is corroborated with several other sources, including someone from Pentax Germany. Anyway the following are like Air Miles. I'm going to collect them ... Originally posted by Christine Tham Anyway, I'm bowing out of the thread.. Originally posted by Christine Tham Anyway, my last post in the thread..

02-07-2011, 07:59 PM	#427
jpzk Site Supporter Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: Québec Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 8,251	I have received my new K5 about three weeks ago and no problems so far. No stains, no AF problems, no dials issues either. S.N. 397xxxx. Where do you find the build date? JP

02-07-2011, 08:38 PM	#428
sewebster Veteran Member Join Date: Jun 2008 Location: Vancouver, BC Photos: Gallery Posts: 544	Build date is likely hidden away in the exif. Seems weird that some cameras have the ff issue and some don't if it's something easily fixable in a firmware update...

02-07-2011, 08:46 PM	#429
falconeye Veteran Member Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: Munich, Alps, Germany Photos: Gallery Posts: 6,871	Originally posted by Christine Tham I kept turning down the dimmer until the light was so low the AF assist came on. None of the shots came out FF, and I tried varying the angle, focus distance etc. to simulate different conditions. Christine, I'll going to share some formal test results and exact test procedure this week. It would be interesting to compare your and my findings then. A question regarding AF assist light: if it goes on, does it just go on for the initial move or for the entire hunt till AF lock? Mine would just go on for the initial move but not when close (the last hunting corrections). This makes it miss AF even if AF assist light goes on. Moreover, I observed two focus problems in low light: The first is reduced but still acceptable focus. I.e., the focus is ok but not as tack sharp as with contrast AF. I didn't notice that outdor but wouldn't notice it without exact measurement anyway. So, I don't want to rule out a missing lens calibration yet. The second probem is a complete miss. The exact conditions are a bit obscure and I am working to further clarify them. In any case, it would be difficult to clearly see the effect with f/4 or smaller without measuring it (which I did). I keep you posted and I am keen to compare our findings.

02-07-2011, 10:50 PM	#430
30v iPentax Inactive Account Join Date: Apr 2010 Location: Suomi , Finland Posts: 368	iPentax K-5 paras kamera, minulla ei ole vikoja ollenkaan.

02-07-2011, 10:56 PM	#431
GregK8 Site Supporter Join Date: May 2008 Location: Western New York Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 614	LOL, check out the second comment in this blog article from 2008 PENTAX DSLRs: PART-2. Autofocus Adjustment charts for fron and back focusing problems. Quote: Great charts. However myself and others are finding that the cameras (K20d at least) consistently Front focus when used in Tungsten lighting. And focus correctly when in Daylight and sometime florescent light. I think you should comment that in your blog, and I would love to see a Pentax response to this.

02-08-2011, 08:14 AM	#433
Rupert Veteran Member Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Texas Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 25,123	Originally posted by jthommo Thanks for the work Christine; I suspected this might be the case - thanks for confirming...and I agree a "fix" is unnecessary. Perhaps it is now time for the two baying bloodhounds - Don and Rupert - to test their K20Ds (if they are capable of the task) to see how they perform. Shot under tungsten light with my K20D and FA 43 Ltd handheld, F1.9 1/15 ISO 400 at about 18 inches away. Focus locked fast and accurate, good enough for me anyhow. I am not a big low light shooter, but I do use it some and this is about as low as I get. If you can send me a K5 that will do at least this well for me, has no "lock-up"problems, no "bounced flash" problems, no "dial problems" no "sensor stains", no other of the defects that have been reported, by all means send it! I will be as thrilled as those that report theirs are perfect and I will go away and shoot happily ever after. Best Regards [IMG] [/IMG]

02-08-2011, 09:25 AM	#434
Catalana Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2010 Location: California Posts: 190	There is a huge "stain" in the right of the top image. So your K20D also has them..., just kidding. The focus looks spot on

02-08-2011, 10:12 AM	#435
Rupert Veteran Member Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Texas Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 25,123	Originally posted by Catalana There is a huge "stain" in the right of the top image. So your K20D also has them..., just kidding. The focus looks spot on LOL! I have no idea if this meets the requirements of those with problems, not being a "technical" shooter, but this would fit my most demanding needs. My Nokton 58mm F1.4 also meets these needs on my K20D and I have never made a lens adjustment on any lens, although I won't argue that some would most likely benefit from it, at least marginally. If the K5 can do this, and as I said, avoid having the other problems. I want one ASAP! I am not a perfectionist, not anything other than an enthusiastic amateur with little desire other than to snap away and have a ton of fun, but I do not want to deal with a string of problems. I took my K20D out of the box almost three years ago and started shooting without a single problem that wasn't due to my error. Happy is too mild a word for my K20D experience, and I have praised it at every opportunity ever since. I want to do the same with the K5, and hope that day comes, but I don't see it yet. I've been beat up pretty good here, and with Alligator hide, I don't mind it too much. Popularity contests are not my cup of tea, I just want to take decent photos and enjoy those that others take, and that includes some here that are my worst adversaries. Life is more about the fun part to me than the technical...but I do expect my camera to perform to specifications and without major glitches.......serious problems are not fun, and neither is FedX Roulette. Best Regards!