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09-18-2011, 12:05 AM   #61
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Happened to me, found the button on the ground, sent it in, got it back after a few days. "Retainer ring replaced". Can't see how glueing it in place could help, it has to be free to move!

Kjell

09-18-2011, 06:19 AM   #62
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these type of design errors really want to make me sell my K5 soon. It is so unreliable in terms of build quality.

Now i have a sticky shutter button (no not any fluid came into contact with my K5), the worries about the mirror overrun problem that can occur after a while, then a lens release button that falls of the camera body for many users. I really regret i started using pentax.
09-18-2011, 01:32 PM   #63
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Y luego tienes una K100Ds y nunca te ocurre nada ;D

Yo la llevaría a reparar, mas si aun tiene garantia!?

Suerte.
09-20-2011, 06:36 PM   #64
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yup and so my button just fell right off while I was changing a lens. My k5 is at about 10K clicks now. I always noticed that the release button was a bit loose/ wobbly but thought it was just new design. The release button on both of my K20d bodies are solid after roughly 70K and 30K clicks. Off to repair!

09-20-2011, 07:53 PM   #65
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Ten days ago I was taking photos at a cousin's wedding with my K-5 and all went well. Two days later I was using my camera, went to change the lens and the release button was gone. I was going to send it in anyway because the shutter and the dust removal mechanisms were getting noisier than usual for whatever reason. It is now in for warranty repair. My shutter count was 4970 when I sent it in. I still love the camera and am looking forward to getting it back. I have owned the K100D, K10D, and still own a K20D and a K-r. I have had absolutely no problems until now. Pentax is all I use and will continue to use. There is nothing made that is perfect, but Pentax cameras and lenses have have served me well over the years.
09-21-2011, 04:59 AM   #66
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QuoteOriginally posted by David T Quote
Ten days ago I was taking photos at a cousin's wedding with my K-5 and all went well. Two days later I was using my camera, went to change the lens and the release button was gone. I was going to send it in anyway because the shutter and the dust removal mechanisms were getting noisier than usual for whatever reason. It is now in for warranty repair. My shutter count was 4970 when I sent it in. I still love the camera and am looking forward to getting it back. I have owned the K100D, K10D, and still own a K20D and a K-r. I have had absolutely no problems until now. Pentax is all I use and will continue to use. There is nothing made that is perfect, but Pentax cameras and lenses have have served me well over the years.
no brand is of course perfect, but in my opinion it says a lot when a company manages to ruin little things, SLR's have lens release buttons since the beginning, it is one of the most simple mechanisms and after all those decades it shouldn't have any design flaws.
09-21-2011, 05:26 AM   #67
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QuoteOriginally posted by Rin Quote
no brand is of course perfect, but in my opinion it says a lot when a company manages to ruin little things, SLR's have lens release buttons since the beginning, it is one of the most simple mechanisms and after all those decades it shouldn't have any design flaws.
I think it a mistake to keep calling them "design flaws". Especially given the wonderful experience of K5 owners who have not experienced this or any of the other various issues (I count myself in this group) The "design" of the camera is simply top notch. I would suggest almost all the problems are the result of defective parts coming from a supplier who made the lowest bid and/or shoddy oversight during assembly. This suggests to me that Hoya might have recognised a great design the Pentax camera division had but decided to try and maximize profits by going cheap during production. Perhaps an effort to put a bright face on a division of the company they did not really want and was trying to unload. This is my personal take and why I'm reluctant to get another K5 currently on the street, (warranty work, regardless how good is a hassle), why I'd be very reluctant to buy a K5 used. and why I am so looking forward to Ricoh's takeover because they want the Pentax name to succeed. The shame (assuming my take is correct) is that Ricoh will be assuming the costs of repairing the problem K5s, Hoya's defective oversight produced.
09-21-2011, 05:43 AM   #68
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QuoteOriginally posted by geezer52 Quote
I think it a mistake to keep calling them "design flaws". Especially given the wonderful experience of K5 owners who have not experienced this or any of the other various issues (I count myself in this group) The "design" of the camera is simply top notch. I would suggest almost all the problems are the result of defective parts coming from a supplier who made the lowest bid and/or shoddy oversight during assembly. This suggests to me that Hoya might have recognised a great design the Pentax camera division had but decided to try and maximize profits by going cheap during production. Perhaps an effort to put a bright face on a division of the company they did not really want and was trying to unload. This is my personal take and why I'm reluctant to get another K5 currently on the street, (warranty work, regardless how good is a hassle), why I'd be very reluctant to buy a K5 used. and why I am so looking forward to Ricoh's takeover because they want the Pentax name to succeed. The shame (assuming my take is correct) is that Ricoh will be assuming the costs of repairing the problem K5s, Hoya's defective oversight produced.
Its a design flaw for sure, the way how the lens release button is held in place needs to have an extra security in place to prevent the lens button falling off, this has nothing to do with other suppliers. In fact you are able to pull the lens release button out of the body if you wanted it, it's only held by a small pin instead of a button made so that it cant be pull out of the camera body itself.

I chose the K5 because i like how the camera feels, the ergonomics are great and i like the color tone that Pentax cameras produce. But when i finally bought the camera suddenly i became better informed, SDM problems, shutter problems, sensor stains (this problem was handled very well by Pentax though) and more and more people have lens release buttons falling off. Realistically speaking this is not a brand with minor quality problems. I know many here love the Pentax brand and often defend it even thought it has too much shortcomings and they dont treat us customers well.

But i will let my K5 be fixed soon, after that just sell it and jump ship.

09-21-2011, 06:34 AM   #69
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QuoteOriginally posted by Rin Quote
Its a design flaw for sure, the way how the lens release button is held in place needs to have an extra security in place to prevent the lens button falling off, this has nothing to do with other suppliers. In fact you are able to pull the lens release button out of the body if you wanted it, it's only held by a small pin instead of a button made so that it cant be pull out of the camera body itself.

I chose the K5 because i like how the camera feels, the ergonomics are great and i like the color tone that Pentax cameras produce. But when i finally bought the camera suddenly i became better informed, SDM problems, shutter problems, sensor stains (this problem was handled very well by Pentax though) and more and more people have lens release buttons falling off. Realistically speaking this is not a brand with minor quality problems. I know many here love the Pentax brand and often defend it even thought it has too much shortcomings and they dont treat us customers well.

But i will let my K5 be fixed soon, after that just sell it and jump ship.
It matters not if it's a design flaw or an implementation flaw (good design, wrong material for example), Pentax has quite simply dropped the ball with this camera. The lens release button is so egregious because it's one of the things that, after something like a third of a century of putting them on cameras, they have stopped being able to do it reliably.
Bad implementation of new technology is one thing, but putting a time bomb like this in every camera is inexcusable, and the best they can come up with is that the thing has to be glued back on.
I do wonder how many of the people crowing about how good their K5s do with the challenge of photographing squirrels that have been overfed to the point of obesity will be bragging about how their lens release button has fallen off.
At this point, I can't blame anyone for jumping ship, so to speak, the K5 is probably at the bottom of the barrel for DSLR reliability.

Last edited by Wheatfield; 09-21-2011 at 07:31 AM.
09-21-2011, 08:10 AM   #70
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QuoteOriginally posted by Wheatfield Quote
It matters not if it's a design flaw or an implementation flaw (good design, wrong material for example), Pentax has quite simply dropped the ball with this camera.
It might not make a difference to the end user but it does matter. The K5 is a stellar design that had the potential to be a phenomenal success. If well implemented it could have turned Pentax's fortunes around and made them a real player. And Ricoh could have been taking over a thriving camera line but instead has to start a salvage operation. Yes Pentax (read Hoya) dropped the ball QC-wise and Ricoh will have to make a concerted effort to restore prestige to the Pentax nameplate and make it a viable alternative for future camera buyers. Saying the other brands have their own problems is no consolation because their size allows them to absorb many mis-steps, fix the problems, or simply move on. A smaller player like Pentax does not have the same luxury and relies on things like a consistent reputation for superior design, quality and value. The Pentax lineup is small, their P&S offerings are also-rans. If the K5 gets widely perceived as a quality black-hole then instead of saving Pentax, it could kill it. I still have faith, mainly in Ricoh, and have no intention of bailing out. But it's hard not to sympathize with users experiencing the many varied problems.

Pentax can not afford to be simply me-too about quality.
09-21-2011, 08:52 AM   #71
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QuoteOriginally posted by Wheatfield Quote
It matters not if it's a design flaw or an implementation flaw (good design, wrong material for example), Pentax has quite simply dropped the ball with this camera. The lens release button is so egregious because it's one of the things that, after something like a third of a century of putting them on cameras, they have stopped being able to do it reliably.
Bad implementation of new technology is one thing, but putting a time bomb like this in every camera is inexcusable, and the best they can come up with is that the thing has to be glued back on.
I do wonder how many of the people crowing about how good their K5s do with the challenge of photographing squirrels that have been overfed to the point of obesity will be bragging about how their lens release button has fallen off.
At this point, I can't blame anyone for jumping ship, so to speak, the K5 is probably at the bottom of the barrel for DSLR reliability.
Otis resents that Wheatfield, the Squirrels here are "healthy", that's all. Meanwhile my K5 has nothing falling off, works beautifully, and is a joy to use....and I am no where close to being alone.
Apparently you didn't read the story of the puking schoolchildren, but not everyone joins in the hysteria. Otis may be just a Squirrel, but he knows the difference between a few acorns falling and the whole sky coming down. Schoolchildren....they can't seem to distinguish reality from hysteria, not surprisingly.

I have no use for Hoya, never have, but I do have high hopes for Ricoh and look forward to the future, while enjoying what I have now. Hoya may have made a mistake on most of their K5 cameras and got them just right, like mine, who can say, but I am grateful they did, and again, I am no where close to being alone.

Getting a "bad" K5 is about the same odds as finding a skinny Squirrel around here...it happens, but it is not the norm.

Just Healthy!...that's all! ISO 6400 1/200 -You need speed to capture an agile critter like this!
[IMG] [/IMG]

Regards!
09-21-2011, 11:02 AM   #72
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QuoteOriginally posted by geezer52 Quote
It might not make a difference to the end user but it does matter. The K5 is a stellar design that had the potential to be a phenomenal success. If well implemented it could have turned Pentax's fortunes around and made them a real player. And Ricoh could have been taking over a thriving camera line but instead has to start a salvage operation. Yes Pentax (read Hoya) dropped the ball QC-wise and Ricoh will have to make a concerted effort to restore prestige to the Pentax nameplate and make it a viable alternative for future camera buyers. Saying the other brands have their own problems is no consolation because their size allows them to absorb many mis-steps, fix the problems, or simply move on. A smaller player like Pentax does not have the same luxury and relies on things like a consistent reputation for superior design, quality and value. The Pentax lineup is small, their P&S offerings are also-rans. If the K5 gets widely perceived as a quality black-hole then instead of saving Pentax, it could kill it. I still have faith, mainly in Ricoh, and have no intention of bailing out. But it's hard not to sympathize with users experiencing the many varied problems.

Pentax can not afford to be simply me-too about quality.
Agreed - squirrels and blind faith doesn't counter real world problems, just tries to ignore them.
A quick search seems the K5 is the first to have this issue, but anywhere I've seen a post about 'lens button fell | fall' there has always been someone else chiming in with the same problem. One user chimed in with his trash/delete button falling off.

As I think Wheatfield mentioned, it's not like the lens release is a 'new complicated feature' - the k5 re-used the K7 body, and lens releases have had decades of 'practice to make perfect.' It would be great if anyone had both a K7 and K5 diagram or picture to compare, but I doubt the K5 (very simple) release mechanism is changed from the K7 'design,' as there is no reason to do so cost-wise - no new functionality, no improvements, so I'm betting this was a bean counter issue, and a sub-standard strength retaining ring was used to save a few cents. Perhaps they went from a metal retaining ring to a plastic one? Either way, it's the equivalent of a steering wheel falling off, or a seatbelt failing to latch a few months after purchase - these things are so standardized and simple at this point there is no reason for such a failure to occur. In software, this is a regression - which of course happens occasionally, but rarely do you go and re-design or 'fix what wasn't broken and was reliable.' Re-design of mechanical items also isn't inexpensive, just more reason to believe they retained as much of the K7 (which itself likely retained mechanisms like buttons, shutter, as much as possible from preceding cameras, including the lens release, making it seem most plausible it's a material/quality issue versus a design one.

If the change was simply a cost saving measure, it's likely that they've reduced reliability to save a few cents per unit, or even that the change to a different material or retainer wasn't known to them, but it saved a few cents for whomever did the assembly. It seems more likely that given enough time, a failure will likely be seen.

By itself, this would be surprising, to manage to break something quite simple, where they had a solid, known reliable item in the K7 mechanism. Added to the other list of potential problems that people have experienced, one is left with a general picture of either bean counters are cutting costs in places they shouldn't be (quality control, possibly choosing cheaper components or assembly/manufacturing methods and/or facilities), someone contracted by Pentax is doing similar (meaning a material or assembly change could have happened without their knowledge, which may be possible in the case of the Sony sensor stains), or both of the above.

If anyone can provide part diagrams or pics comparing K5 to K7, that might be enlightening, as well as knowing if the part numbers between the two are identical for the retaining clip. It would also be interesting to see if Pentax creates a new part number for a revised (call it 'fixed') lens release pin retainer or entire assembly.

Just one more potential issue to keep sight of checking - stains, mirror flop, losing the ability to remove a lens..any of which effectively give you a very expensive paperweight. Hope for the best, but get an extended warrantee.

For those that think some people are being harsh, just google for the problem - common statements are "I've owned a half dozen DSLRs, and have never had any buttons fall off of any of them..until now" = not exactly great for reputation or expanding a market. Ensuring the problems are addressed, and believed by existing as well as new potential owners, is fairly important.
09-21-2011, 01:15 PM   #73
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I just got the K-5 and I have no problems. When I change lenses I hold my finger over the button with just a bit of pressure as the new lens clicks into place so it doesn't "snap" out as it locks. I'm sure that after I do this for a while it will just become second-nature and no inconvenience. I figure that if it ever has to go get serviced or repaired in the future for some other reason I will have the "new" button they've redesigned installed. I expect Ricoh to be better about this sort of thing. In the meantime I am happy with the camera!
09-21-2011, 01:42 PM   #74
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QuoteOriginally posted by rtpguy Quote
Agreed - squirrels and blind faith doesn't counter real world problems, just tries to ignore them.
Squirrels are very real....I have thousands of photos to prove it! No one I know of here has "tried to deny" the problems reported that I know of......but having a perfectly functioning K5 with all its buttons and dials is by no means "blind faith". it is a reality experienced by the majority of owners. Painting a picture that all K5s are defective is as unfair and dishonest as denying that any problems exist. Some acorns falling is not the sky falling...even a smart Squirrel knows that and continues on about his business of "getting healthy".

BTW- Maybe you need to scout around on the Forums of other brands......it is not as rosy as you might believe. All Mfgs. are using a variety of suppliers, and low bid contracts......cameras or cars, this can and does result in problems for select batches of the product. It in no way relinquishes responsibility from Hoya for their poor QC, but it is also not limited to Pentax by a long shot. We often see millions of cars/trucks recalled, and you can bet they have a better feel for QC than any of the camera makers, more is at risk, and more money is involved, as well as public safety. A button falling off is inconvenient, a wheel falling off can mean death or serious injury and property damage....yet, it does happen.

Will Ricoh be better? I think so, I hope so, but they will not be perfect, you see, that is just not "real world" possible.
Regards!
09-21-2011, 01:57 PM   #75
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I bought K-5 three months ago and the lens release button was lost about 5 weeks ago. The camera is "In Repair" since 09/07 with estimated repair time 4-6 weeks according to the C.R.I.S. That's a long wait and I'm not happy with Pentax/Hoya K-5 design/quality control. I have K10D for 5 years, it is much more solid camera, K-5 is not in the same category as K10D qualitywise (compare for example SD door design). The lens release button is rock-solid on K10D. The cute (but tiring) squirrels that are posted in every thread about K-5 issues are not going to help in getting back my camera...
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