If it ain't broke....

starstuff · 06-15-2011, 05:36 PM

It's my second day with my new K5 -- work and life have prevented me from doing much shooting (not until the weekend), but I've been playing around with it a little in-between things, and as a K20D owner, I'm perplexed about some of Pentax's choices.

The solid plastic door to the USB port of the K20D has been replaced with a flimsy rubbery thing. Why?

The dedicated exposure bracketing button is gone (though I'm glad the RAW button can be customized for the same purpose). Why?

My SMC-DA 21mm pancake lens requires a +10 AF fine adjustment, and my test images seem less sharp than they did with the K20D. Why? [I've yet to check out my other lenses]

And with the K20D, "Delete all" could be accessed by pressing the delete button twice; now, the only way (AFAIK) to get there is by digging down into one of the menus, or selecting and checking images to be deleted one at a time. Why?

Granted, I haven't really put my K5 through its paces yet, so I am probably yet to discover how wonderful it is... but thusfar, well, I frankly WANT to be impressed, but I'm really not.

Whatever happened to "if it ain't broke, don't fix it"?

twitch · 06-15-2011, 05:50 PM

On my K-x if I keep spinning the e-dial to the left in picture review I get to a high level "per day" view of images, and I can delete all the images for a given day in one hit. Not sure if the K-5 works the same way, probably does.

JeffJS · 06-15-2011, 05:55 PM

Originally posted by starstuff

It's my second day with my new K5 -- work and life have prevented me from doing much shooting (not until the weekend), but I've been playing around with it a little in-between things, and as a K20D owner, I'm perplexed about some of Pentax's choices.

The solid plastic door to the USB port of the K20D has been replaced with a flimsy rubbery thing. Why?

They did this with the K7 and it bothered me too.

The dedicated exposure bracketing button is gone (though I'm glad the RAW button can be customized for the same purpose). Why?

My SMC-DA 21mm pancake lens requires a +10 AF fine adjustment, and my test images seem less sharp than they did with the K20D. Why? [I've yet to check out my other lenses]

And with the K20D, "Delete all" could be accessed by pressing the delete button twice; now, the only way (AFAIK) to get there is by digging down into one of the menus, or selecting and checking images to be deleted one at a time. Why?

You can access the folder (rear dial when viewing photos) and delete the entire folder.

Granted, I haven't really put my K5 through its paces yet, so I am probably yet to discover how wonderful it is... but thusfar, well, I frankly WANT to be impressed, but I'm really not.

Whatever happened to "if it ain't broke, don't fix it"?

With the bigger screen and smaller body, they moved buttons around. Something had to go I guess so they gave programming options and got rid of the bracketing button, which I never used so frankly, don't miss it. Removed the SR switch, and things like that. I don't pretend to know the Why's of what these people do but I would have happily given up the larger screen to have the left side buttons where they belong. As for your 21mm, Can't answer that. It's entirely possible though that a different k20 would have required adjustment as well.

bobmaxja · 06-15-2011, 06:04 PM

Change is part of live

Smeggypants · 06-15-2011, 06:24 PM

Originally posted by bobmaxja

Change is part of live

Did you mean 'life' ?

Blue · 06-15-2011, 06:32 PM

Originally posted by bobmaxja

Change is part of live

Some of it still sux.

foxhead · 06-15-2011, 07:27 PM

Originally posted by starstuff

The solid plastic door to the USB port of the K20D has been replaced with a flimsy rubbery thing. Why?

Over the past fifteen years I've owned several Canon and Olympus cameras with similar rubbery closures. Not one has torn off. They are probably tougher than the solid plastic doors, make a better water and dust seal, and don't require metal hinges and springs so they cost less for material and labor to assemble. After all cameras used to be made of wood and metal and I certainly think that they have improved over the years so today's are much better designs.

**bjdavey** · 06-15-2011, 07:47 PM

Originally posted by starstuff

And with the K20D, "Delete all" could be accessed by pressing the delete button twice; now, the only way (AFAIK) to get there is by digging down into one of the menus, or selecting and checking images to be deleted one at a time.

When in playback mode, dial the rear e-dial twice to the left. That will create a folder view of recent images, which can all be deleted simultaneously with the delete button.

**Schraubstock** · 06-15-2011, 09:27 PM

Originally posted by starstuff

And with the K20D, "Delete all" could be accessed by pressing the delete button twice; now, the only way (AFAIK) to get there is by digging down into one of the menus, or selecting and checking images to be deleted one at a time. Why?

Press the picture view button - turn rear e-dial to left two clicks - highlight the directory you wish to delete - press the rubbish can button - confirm delete/cancel - highlight delete - press o.k. - and bingo, all gone.

In the old method one did run the chance (as I did several times) to inadvertently press the delete button twice when you really did not want to. This happened to me when, in quick succession I wanted to delete a number of shots one by one but in my hast got the "rhythm" of button presses wrong and found I had deleted everything.

Greetings

Greetings

boone · 06-15-2011, 10:10 PM

Just select format memory card and it will delete all.

**Schraubstock** · 06-15-2011, 10:31 PM

Originally posted by starstuff

The solid plastic door to the USB port of the K20D has been replaced with a flimsy rubbery thing. Why?

You will find the old hinged door with its neat rectangular rubber O-ring, while it was nice to look at, did not provide the level of dust and water protecting quality. The new rubber door performs much better in this regard.

Also, while in the open position the door could more easily be damaged while in action. (Standing proud off the camera body and a swipe in the wrong direction and the hinges are bend. After all the K-5 is an action camera, isn't it?) Again the new setup performs much better here.

People get used to model specific functions after long use. Then when they upgrade mourn over all those familiarities they suddenly have lost or have changed. This is human nature, we all do it. Don't let emotions blind you. New and different ways of design are not always the result of cost cutting. (I know sometimes they are though). In this example, what if PENTAX was confronted with an unrealistically high amount of "door repairs" because of the above mentioned reason ? Solution ? - Rubber door with rubber hinges - problem solved.

Now of course you get used to the new features and learn to like them and when you next update... And so the wheel keeps spinning.

Oh, and when everything else fails to make sens, read the manual. (I promise I'll give it a go next week).

Greetings

starstuff · 06-16-2011, 12:18 AM

Thanks everyone, especially for the tip on how to "delete all". True, I need to give the new body a really fair chance: I plan to go out and do some shooting over the weekend. I also plan to do a more careful A:B comparison of the 21mm on the K20D body and the K5 body. Stay tuned on that one. And, you're right, I definitely need to get used to the new placement of things etc. before I issue a final verdict, & probably above all "embrace change". :-) Really, you guys made me feel much, much better about all this, so thanks.

**Schraubstock** · 06-16-2011, 12:28 AM - **1 Like**

Originally posted by starstuff

Really, you guys made me feel much, much better about all this, so thanks.

Hi
Glad to hear: Another satisfied customer.

Greetings from sunny Melbourne

sjtryon · 06-16-2011, 10:12 AM

By formatting the card as your "Delete All" option, you are also reducing the risk of losing photos from the card. Deleted photos aren't really deleted; their references in the file listing for the card are deleted. Continued use of this method risks corruption of that directory and, consequently, the inability to read from and write to the card properly.

You are always better off formatting the card to delete everything as that process wipes the directory and the files completely.

Alan Clogwyn · 06-16-2011, 11:35 AM

Originally posted by foxhead

Over the past fifteen years I've owned several Canon and Olympus cameras with similar rubbery closures. Not one has torn off. They are probably tougher than the solid plastic doors, make a better water and dust seal, and don't require metal hinges and springs so they cost less for material and labor to assemble. After all cameras used to be made of wood and metal and I certainly think that they have improved over the years so today's are much better designs.

I had an Olympus with a proper door. I dropped it and it was fine externally but the door was broke, couldn't use the camera anymore as it just locked out and sisplayed please shut card door on the screen! I'd only had it 3 days!

I must admit though I hate the rubber things on my Panasonic, trying to plug a USB cable or shutter release cable in is a one sided battle in favour of our elastomeric adversary.

06-15-2011, 05:36 PM	#1
starstuff Forum Member Join Date: Jun 2009 Location: San Francisco Posts: 57	If it ain't broke.... It's my second day with my new K5 -- work and life have prevented me from doing much shooting (not until the weekend), but I've been playing around with it a little in-between things, and as a K20D owner, I'm perplexed about some of Pentax's choices. The solid plastic door to the USB port of the K20D has been replaced with a flimsy rubbery thing. Why? The dedicated exposure bracketing button is gone (though I'm glad the RAW button can be customized for the same purpose). Why? My SMC-DA 21mm pancake lens requires a +10 AF fine adjustment, and my test images seem less sharp than they did with the K20D. Why? [I've yet to check out my other lenses] And with the K20D, "Delete all" could be accessed by pressing the delete button twice; now, the only way (AFAIK) to get there is by digging down into one of the menus, or selecting and checking images to be deleted one at a time. Why? Granted, I haven't really put my K5 through its paces yet, so I am probably yet to discover how wonderful it is... but thusfar, well, I frankly WANT to be impressed, but I'm really not. Whatever happened to "if it ain't broke, don't fix it"?

06-15-2011, 05:50 PM	#2
twitch Veteran Member Join Date: Nov 2009 Posts: 4,571	On my K-x if I keep spinning the e-dial to the left in picture review I get to a high level "per day" view of images, and I can delete all the images for a given day in one hit. Not sure if the K-5 works the same way, probably does. Last edited by twitch; 06-15-2011 at 06:02 PM.

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06-15-2011, 05:55 PM	#3
JeffJS Inactive Account Join Date: Aug 2008 Location: Michigan, USA Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 7,484	Originally posted by starstuff It's my second day with my new K5 -- work and life have prevented me from doing much shooting (not until the weekend), but I've been playing around with it a little in-between things, and as a K20D owner, I'm perplexed about some of Pentax's choices. The solid plastic door to the USB port of the K20D has been replaced with a flimsy rubbery thing. Why? They did this with the K7 and it bothered me too. The dedicated exposure bracketing button is gone (though I'm glad the RAW button can be customized for the same purpose). Why? My SMC-DA 21mm pancake lens requires a +10 AF fine adjustment, and my test images seem less sharp than they did with the K20D. Why? [I've yet to check out my other lenses] And with the K20D, "Delete all" could be accessed by pressing the delete button twice; now, the only way (AFAIK) to get there is by digging down into one of the menus, or selecting and checking images to be deleted one at a time. Why? You can access the folder (rear dial when viewing photos) and delete the entire folder. Granted, I haven't really put my K5 through its paces yet, so I am probably yet to discover how wonderful it is... but thusfar, well, I frankly WANT to be impressed, but I'm really not. Whatever happened to "if it ain't broke, don't fix it"? With the bigger screen and smaller body, they moved buttons around. Something had to go I guess so they gave programming options and got rid of the bracketing button, which I never used so frankly, don't miss it. Removed the SR switch, and things like that. I don't pretend to know the Why's of what these people do but I would have happily given up the larger screen to have the left side buttons where they belong. As for your 21mm, Can't answer that. It's entirely possible though that a different k20 would have required adjustment as well.

06-15-2011, 06:04 PM	#4
bobmaxja Veteran Member Join Date: Mar 2010 Location: Laval, Quebec Canada Posts: 2,171	Change is part of live

06-15-2011, 06:24 PM	#5
Smeggypants Veteran Member Join Date: Sep 2010 Posts: 1,536	Originally posted by bobmaxja Change is part of live Did you mean 'life' ?

06-15-2011, 06:32 PM	#6
Blue Moderator Site Supporter Join Date: Jun 2008 Location: Florida Hill Country Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 17,377	Originally posted by bobmaxja Change is part of live Some of it still sux.

06-15-2011, 07:27 PM	#7
foxhead Forum Member Join Date: Oct 2009 Location: Wisconsin Posts: 55	Originally posted by starstuff The solid plastic door to the USB port of the K20D has been replaced with a flimsy rubbery thing. Why? Over the past fifteen years I've owned several Canon and Olympus cameras with similar rubbery closures. Not one has torn off. They are probably tougher than the solid plastic doors, make a better water and dust seal, and don't require metal hinges and springs so they cost less for material and labor to assemble. After all cameras used to be made of wood and metal and I certainly think that they have improved over the years so today's are much better designs.

06-15-2011, 07:47 PM	#8
bjdavey Site Supporter Join Date: Mar 2011 Location: Alexandria, VA Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 162	Originally posted by starstuff And with the K20D, "Delete all" could be accessed by pressing the delete button twice; now, the only way (AFAIK) to get there is by digging down into one of the menus, or selecting and checking images to be deleted one at a time. When in playback mode, dial the rear e-dial twice to the left. That will create a folder view of recent images, which can all be deleted simultaneously with the delete button.

06-15-2011, 09:27 PM	#9
Schraubstock Site Supporter Join Date: Oct 2010 Location: Melbourne Photos: Gallery Posts: 3,386	Originally posted by starstuff And with the K20D, "Delete all" could be accessed by pressing the delete button twice; now, the only way (AFAIK) to get there is by digging down into one of the menus, or selecting and checking images to be deleted one at a time. Why? Press the picture view button - turn rear e-dial to left two clicks - highlight the directory you wish to delete - press the rubbish can button - confirm delete/cancel - highlight delete - press o.k. - and bingo, all gone. In the old method one did run the chance (as I did several times) to inadvertently press the delete button twice when you really did not want to. This happened to me when, in quick succession I wanted to delete a number of shots one by one but in my hast got the "rhythm" of button presses wrong and found I had deleted everything. Greetings Greetings

06-15-2011, 10:10 PM	#10
boone Inactive Account Join Date: Jan 2011 Location: Vientiane Photos: Albums Posts: 100	Just select format memory card and it will delete all.

06-15-2011, 10:31 PM	#11
Schraubstock Site Supporter Join Date: Oct 2010 Location: Melbourne Photos: Gallery Posts: 3,386	Originally posted by starstuff The solid plastic door to the USB port of the K20D has been replaced with a flimsy rubbery thing. Why? You will find the old hinged door with its neat rectangular rubber O-ring, while it was nice to look at, did not provide the level of dust and water protecting quality. The new rubber door performs much better in this regard. Also, while in the open position the door could more easily be damaged while in action. (Standing proud off the camera body and a swipe in the wrong direction and the hinges are bend. After all the K-5 is an action camera, isn't it?) Again the new setup performs much better here. People get used to model specific functions after long use. Then when they upgrade mourn over all those familiarities they suddenly have lost or have changed. This is human nature, we all do it. Don't let emotions blind you. New and different ways of design are not always the result of cost cutting. (I know sometimes they are though). In this example, what if PENTAX was confronted with an unrealistically high amount of "door repairs" because of the above mentioned reason ? Solution ? - Rubber door with rubber hinges - problem solved. Now of course you get used to the new features and learn to like them and when you next update... And so the wheel keeps spinning. Oh, and when everything else fails to make sens, read the manual. (I promise I'll give it a go next week). Greetings

06-16-2011, 12:18 AM	#12
starstuff Forum Member Join Date: Jun 2009 Location: San Francisco Posts: 57 Original Poster	Thanks everyone, especially for the tip on how to "delete all". True, I need to give the new body a really fair chance: I plan to go out and do some shooting over the weekend. I also plan to do a more careful A:B comparison of the 21mm on the K20D body and the K5 body. Stay tuned on that one. And, you're right, I definitely need to get used to the new placement of things etc. before I issue a final verdict, & probably above all "embrace change". :-) Really, you guys made me feel much, much better about all this, so thanks.

06-16-2011, 12:28 AM - 1 Like	#13
Schraubstock Site Supporter Join Date: Oct 2010 Location: Melbourne Photos: Gallery Posts: 3,386	Originally posted by starstuff Really, you guys made me feel much, much better about all this, so thanks. Hi Glad to hear: Another satisfied customer. Greetings from sunny Melbourne

06-16-2011, 10:12 AM	#14
sjtryon Senior Member Join Date: Nov 2010 Location: Upstate, NY, USA Posts: 170	By formatting the card as your "Delete All" option, you are also reducing the risk of losing photos from the card. Deleted photos aren't really deleted; their references in the file listing for the card are deleted. Continued use of this method risks corruption of that directory and, consequently, the inability to read from and write to the card properly. You are always better off formatting the card to delete everything as that process wipes the directory and the files completely.

06-16-2011, 11:35 AM	#15
Alan Clogwyn Forum Member Join Date: Apr 2011 Location: Gwynedd Photos: Gallery Posts: 93	Originally posted by foxhead Over the past fifteen years I've owned several Canon and Olympus cameras with similar rubbery closures. Not one has torn off. They are probably tougher than the solid plastic doors, make a better water and dust seal, and don't require metal hinges and springs so they cost less for material and labor to assemble. After all cameras used to be made of wood and metal and I certainly think that they have improved over the years so today's are much better designs. I had an Olympus with a proper door. I dropped it and it was fine externally but the door was broke, couldn't use the camera anymore as it just locked out and sisplayed please shut card door on the screen! I'd only had it 3 days! I must admit though I hate the rubber things on my Panasonic, trying to plug a USB cable or shutter release cable in is a one sided battle in favour of our elastomeric adversary.