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07-03-2011, 06:01 AM   #1
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k5 max sync speed.

Hay all..

Im just wondering if anyone know's a way to trick the k5 into using higher sync speed's with flash's?

I love using flash's out doors and without going all out on tones of watt/second flashs ND filters and high Fstops the other way to over power the sun is a faster shutter speed.

I tried setting my k5 with metz flash to HHS mode and triggering a wireless recever from the pc port but anything after 1/160 and the pc port stops sending out a signal.

I also tried firing one of my studio strobes trigged by an optical recever (built into the strobe) but again nothing after 1/160.

I have other strobes I should try I guess, im also wondering if triggering the camera + strobes with the wireless triggers might work but im guessing the flash's would fire way before the mirror and that open on the camera.

Any thoughts and idea's on this or if anyone has done it Id love to know , I know other systems can use HHS and trigger flash's to get much higher than the sync speed.

07-03-2011, 06:11 AM   #2
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With Pentax flashes I think it can sync up to 1/500s, and I think the same should apply for modern metz flashes as well.

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07-03-2011, 07:45 AM   #3
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QuoteOriginally posted by Usuqa Quote
Hay all..

Im just wondering if anyone know's a way to trick the k5 into using higher sync speed's with flash's?

I love using flash's out doors and without going all out on tones of watt/second flashs ND filters and high Fstops the other way to over power the sun is a faster shutter speed.

I tried setting my k5 with metz flash to HHS mode and triggering a wireless recever from the pc port but anything after 1/160 and the pc port stops sending out a signal.

I also tried firing one of my studio strobes trigged by an optical recever (built into the strobe) but again nothing after 1/160.

I have other strobes I should try I guess, im also wondering if triggering the camera + strobes with the wireless triggers might work but im guessing the flash's would fire way before the mirror and that open on the camera.

Any thoughts and idea's on this or if anyone has done it Id love to know , I know other systems can use HHS and trigger flash's to get much higher than the sync speed.
1/180th is the max sync speed. You can get over that by using HSS with a p-ttl capable flash in the hotshoe, or wirelessly if you have a p-ttl master in the hotshoe controlling the slave. The sync port does not contain p-ttl data and as such, won't overcome the 1/180th sync speed limit. Studio strobes do not have p-ttl and so won't be able to do HSS, so they are also limited to the 1/180th sync speed.

Nikon syncs at 1/200 (i believe) and Canon at 1/250. Not even 1 stop difference at most. And there are some triggers for these systems that can transmit ttl data. The advantage here is that you can transmit HSS signal and do that off camera. However, you will get more power from the flash in the image by using normal sync. So its not that useful.
07-03-2011, 10:51 AM   #4
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yer sorry its 1/180

I know my studio strobes dont do hss, but people use a hss flash to let the bodys trigger over the sync limit and some strobes have a long flash durations enabling you to use them with the hack.

I was hoping that with a hss flash equiped and enabled that I could trick the body to send a signal to the pc port to fire my wireless triggers, but since that didn't work (no signal over 1/180) i tried my studio strobe since its the only way I can trigger optically atm. Im not sure if my studio strobes have to short a flash duration for this and maby thats why it hasn't worked?

People have been doing this with nikon/canon bodys to get 1/2000 type shutter speeds with flash's.

Ok.. I was being silly and forgot about the pre flash which is setting off my studio strobes so by the time the normal flash happens the lights away.

Using the sigma as the main flash and the metz on M slave mode (it ignores pre flash's) Im able to trigger the metz in manual slave mode upto 1/8000th of a sec.. So it seems i need some optical triggers that will ignore a preflash that I could strap to the front of my sigma and connect to a wireless trigger.


Last edited by Usuqa; 07-03-2011 at 11:16 AM.
07-04-2011, 02:55 AM   #5
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Without HSS, 1/180 is the K-5 sync speed.

However, with wireless studio strobes, I recommend 1/160s for reliable sync.
07-04-2011, 03:09 AM   #6
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Buy Z-1, it has 1/250.

07-05-2011, 02:16 AM   #7
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QuoteOriginally posted by dreamfoto Quote
Buy Z-1, it has 1/250.

Looks like a nice little camera ,

Anyway I figured out how to get past the max sync speed, I just need to get some an optical trigger that ignores the pre flash
07-05-2011, 02:34 AM   #8
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I can get 1/180 using RF-602's and the Hotshoe - weird you are only getting 1/160..

Short of getting a Nikon D70 and cheating the sync with an electronic shutter (1/4000 - broad daylight flash control.... mmmmmmm), there is exploiting 'partial frame sync' as well... (refer Strobist: Hacking Your Camera's Sync Speed, Pt. 2 ) - But not sure if this will work because I think the hotshoe/sync-port are disabled if above 1/180 unless you have a pTTL/HSS flash on it and it communicated digitally with the camera...

But check your settings, because 1/180 should work - tried in X mode ?

07-05-2011, 02:41 PM   #9
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It's not weird. He's using 1/3 stops EV increments. If he uses 1/5 EV increments or use X dial mode he should be fine with 1/180s.

Regarding the P-TTL HSS Master... i wonder if it would trigger wirelessly other manual flash above the 1/180s. Need to try it.
07-05-2011, 02:47 PM   #10
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QuoteOriginally posted by magnosantos Quote
...Regarding the P-TTL HSS Master... i wonder if it would trigger wirelessly other manual flash above the 1/180s. Need to try it.
It could. But if they contribute significantly to the exposure, then you will get shutter curtain banding because the shutter won't be open fully above 1/180th.
07-05-2011, 03:09 PM - 1 Like   #11
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pentax bodies, afaik, will disable the hotshoe when shutter is configured above sync speed (which is reasonable). hss is not a solution to your problem, neither are nd filters and aperture, the only solution is either faster sync speed or more powerful flash.(if you want fast sync on the cheap, get an old powershot and check what the chdk project can do for you ). if you want to do it with your pentax, i'm afraid the only solution is a more powerful flash (and this applies to canon and nikon too, with the exception of the cheaper nikons like the d40, which have electornic shutters, so sync speeds (arbitrarily) limited to 1/500 iirc)

ps: in case it's not clear: using a "slow-discharge" flash on full power above the sync speed doesn't solve the problem either: such a flash actually effectively limits your maximum sync speed to it's discharge speed, because otherwise you're not actually using it's full power, so you haven't achieved anything

Last edited by nanok; 07-05-2011 at 03:27 PM.
07-05-2011, 03:36 PM   #12
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QuoteOriginally posted by Usuqa Quote
Any thoughts and idea's on this or if anyone has done it Id love to know , I know other systems can use HHS and trigger flash's to get much higher than the sync speed.
They do this via wireless *TTL devices such as pocket wizards. No such device exists for Pentax pTTL so we're stuck with using long cables, or using ND filters to keep shutter down to 1/180.
07-06-2011, 02:20 AM   #13
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I know I made a mistake and that the k5 can goto 1/180, if had it on there many of times It was a mistake I made when writing the post.

As for what I was trying to do, I know that its a hack, and that with increased shutter speed's you get decreased flash power as well, but its just something Id like to try and test with my flash's to see if any of them would be any good at overpowering the sun with sync speeds over 1/180.

Why?

To use shallower DoF
To overpower the sun
To have fun and push my stuff to see what It can do.

There have been people using this type of hack on nikon/canon bodys and depending on the flash (some are better than others) can get nicely lit shots at 1/2000 and such. Ofc you are no longer using the strobe as a strobe but more like a continuous light.

I would have loved it if the pc power still triggered a flash with a hss flash enabled on the camera. But sadly after 1/180 nothing gets sent there even in hss mode so It wont trigger my radio trigger.

I need to wait till I get an optical trigger that ignores a pre flash to test my other strobes as the only strobe I have that can do that is my metz af 50. Which btw synced at 1/8000 but wasn't very powerful at these settings.
07-06-2011, 02:40 AM   #14
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Several discussions on this, but basically Pentax actually disables the flash sync pins at shutter speeds over 1/180 (unless using PTTL HSS).

So you'd probably have to hack the firmware and/or hardware internally to get the benefits of higher sync rate, even though you KNOW what you're doing and can accept the issues that go with "over-clocking" the sync speed. Argh!
07-06-2011, 02:43 AM   #15
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You'd still need a HSS flash around to talk the required pTTL.. but I wonder if a hacked pTTL Cord could help solve the issue ? I'm sure with some creative capacitor placement a 'side-circuit' based off of the TTL triggering could be rigged...
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