K-5 problem or are my eyes going bad???

excanonfd · 07-24-2011, 12:31 PM

Originally posted by Ubuntu_user

Hmm... That makes me feel a little better, at least I know that it's probably not my eyes now!

Definitely let us know how the repair goes...

I'm scratching my head on how it could have happened if that is the case. Hmm... I've never replaced/exchanged a focus screen so I don't know anything about it; how can I get it back into place if it did get whacked?

Place the camera in front of you, with the pentaprism at 12 o'clock position. Put some folded lens paper on the mirror to protect it, using a small precision screwdriver pry open the focus screen retainer clip - it will swing down on to the mirror. Check to see that the shim/gasket is in place on the pentaprism properly (it will look like a miniature license plate frame). Make sure that the focus screen is sitting properly inside the retainer frame (may have jarred loose when the retainer frame dropped down), gently lift up with the screwdriver tip and clip the focus screen assembly back in place. Blow out the mirror box with canned air/rocket blower, mount a lens and test.

Hope this helps,

Ubuntu_user · 07-24-2011, 12:50 PM

Originally posted by Raffwal

As we have AF finetuning for individual lenses and also a global setting, I wonder if the latter affects MF too somehow?

I doubt it because the AF compensation/fine tuning is electronic (at least that's the way I understand it). And, I don't have the global setting set (in other words, it's at 0).

Raffwal · 07-24-2011, 01:02 PM

Originally posted by Ubuntu_user

I doubt it because the AF compensation/fine tuning is electronic (at least that's the way I understand it). And, I don't have the global setting set (in other words, it's at 0).

Doesn't AF fine tuning actually move the sensor level towards or away from the lens. So if a visually adjusted MF lens focuses on a level different from the sensor, couldn't the adjustment help?

Just my theory, but having posted previously I googled the net and some others seem to agree. Worth giving a try IMO.

hcarvalhoalves · 07-24-2011, 05:16 PM

Originally posted by Raffwal

Doesn't AF fine tuning actually move the sensor level towards or away from the lens.

I don't think so. It should calibrate the screwdriver to turn plus (or minus) N degrees from the point the camera PD system finds focus.

Smeggypants · 07-24-2011, 05:26 PM

Originally posted by Ubuntu_user

I doubt it because the AF compensation/fine tuning is electronic (at least that's the way I understand it). And, I don't have the global setting set (in other words, it's at 0).

it won't affect what you see on the screen, but will affect the focus confirmation with MF lenses.

If you're trying to MF with an aperture wider than about f2.0 then use Live view, as the standard focus screen can't resolve shallower DOFs

Ubuntu_user · 07-25-2011, 12:51 PM

Originally posted by Smeggypants

If you're trying to MF with an aperture wider than about f2.0 then use Live view, as the standard focus screen can't resolve shallower DOFs

Yes, I thought about that, but I'm having trouble even at f/5.6!

Ubuntu_user · 08-05-2011, 11:33 AM

I've been gone so I haven't posted, but it seems that I'm still experiencing problems. I pulled out the focusing screen and put it back in but everything seemed to be in right and tight. So, I'm not entirely sure what to do... but I do know that this isn't very fun.

Maybe I'll try to learn to shoot with my right eye and see if that makes a difference.

JeffJS · 08-05-2011, 01:09 PM

What happens with Live View?

David&karen · 08-06-2011, 12:33 AM

Hi everyone, I think I have an answer to this one, but it happened with Karens K7. When we first got that camera, the AF was less than precise with many lenses(sent it in for service and that ended). So I ordered a Katzeye micro/split screen for it. then it consistantly front focussed and it was a mystery, so I called Katzeye: Rachel there said that the K7, and I have learned that this is also the same in the K5, use various thicknesses of shims for the focussing screen to prism interface, and that it can be all over the map. if it is not perfect, using the screen will do exactly what the OP described. Karen's K7 was off by quite a bit and the changed shims made the new screen perfect. I just put the orig. back in and it too is perfect. She can do the shim for you or guide you to do it yourself. YMMV, but this worked for us.

David

Rin · 08-06-2011, 04:12 AM

isnt it also a problem with focus shifting? many lenses shift focus when focusing first on wide open aperture and after that closing the aperture up.

NogBoy13 · 08-06-2011, 06:39 AM

The dipopter is really just a fine tuner for your eyes. Get the image as focussed as you can and tweak till you get the sharpest image. But I'' wager it isnt that!

If you look up my old Dpreview NogBoy13 posts you'll see I had LOTS of this problem with my K10 and K20. Looks fine in the finder, but when you actually looked at the completed image its waaaayy out. Drove me absolutely crazy. I reckon you're having the same issues I did. Definitely something not lined up somewhere. I gave up using my old primes altogether cos it was just too depressing. Even the visit to CR Kennedy was useless. I got LOTS of response that it was my flawed technique diopter etc etc ad finitum... and I knew it wasnt those. My K-5 seems to be much less problematic, tho that may change. I often wondered if it might be either the SR feature or something to do with what is essentially 'full frame' lenses. Perhaps the view train line up was flawed somewhere.

Sorry, given my experience I have bugger all I can offer that's much help. Be interested to see if you do solve it how you did it... and I was surprised this issue wasnt more widely recognized back then. Good luck. Nogster

Ubuntu_user · 08-07-2011, 10:34 AM

Well everyone, this is very strange—all of the sudden I'm having no trouble at all now! Focusing is just like it always use to be: precise.

I'm no longer getting the FF issues.
But, I have no clue what changed. Maybe my eyes were playing tricks with me!

08-06-2011, 06:39 AM	#26
NogBoy13 Junior Member Join Date: Jul 2011 Location: Bunbury Posts: 29	Oh... this sounds familiar The dipopter is really just a fine tuner for your eyes. Get the image as focussed as you can and tweak till you get the sharpest image. But I'' wager it isnt that! If you look up my old Dpreview NogBoy13 posts you'll see I had LOTS of this problem with my K10 and K20. Looks fine in the finder, but when you actually looked at the completed image its waaaayy out. Drove me absolutely crazy. I reckon you're having the same issues I did. Definitely something not lined up somewhere. I gave up using my old primes altogether cos it was just too depressing. Even the visit to CR Kennedy was useless. I got LOTS of response that it was my flawed technique diopter etc etc ad finitum... and I knew it wasnt those. My K-5 seems to be much less problematic, tho that may change. I often wondered if it might be either the SR feature or something to do with what is essentially 'full frame' lenses. Perhaps the view train line up was flawed somewhere. Sorry, given my experience I have bugger all I can offer that's much help. Be interested to see if you do solve it how you did it... and I was surprised this issue wasnt more widely recognized back then. Good luck. Nogster

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07-24-2011, 12:31 PM	#16
excanonfd Veteran Member Join Date: Jan 2010 Location: Vancouver, BC Posts: 1,421	Originally posted by Ubuntu_user Hmm... That makes me feel a little better, at least I know that it's probably not my eyes now! Definitely let us know how the repair goes... I'm scratching my head on how it could have happened if that is the case. Hmm... I've never replaced/exchanged a focus screen so I don't know anything about it; how can I get it back into place if it did get whacked? Place the camera in front of you, with the pentaprism at 12 o'clock position. Put some folded lens paper on the mirror to protect it, using a small precision screwdriver pry open the focus screen retainer clip - it will swing down on to the mirror. Check to see that the shim/gasket is in place on the pentaprism properly (it will look like a miniature license plate frame). Make sure that the focus screen is sitting properly inside the retainer frame (may have jarred loose when the retainer frame dropped down), gently lift up with the screwdriver tip and clip the focus screen assembly back in place. Blow out the mirror box with canned air/rocket blower, mount a lens and test. Hope this helps,

07-24-2011, 12:50 PM	#17
Ubuntu_user Veteran Member Join Date: Mar 2010 Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 1,545 Original Poster	Originally posted by Raffwal As we have AF finetuning for individual lenses and also a global setting, I wonder if the latter affects MF too somehow? I doubt it because the AF compensation/fine tuning is electronic (at least that's the way I understand it). And, I don't have the global setting set (in other words, it's at 0).

07-24-2011, 01:02 PM	#18
Raffwal Veteran Member Join Date: Oct 2010 Location: The North Posts: 879	Originally posted by Ubuntu_user I doubt it because the AF compensation/fine tuning is electronic (at least that's the way I understand it). And, I don't have the global setting set (in other words, it's at 0). Doesn't AF fine tuning actually move the sensor level towards or away from the lens. So if a visually adjusted MF lens focuses on a level different from the sensor, couldn't the adjustment help? Just my theory, but having posted previously I googled the net and some others seem to agree. Worth giving a try IMO.

07-24-2011, 05:16 PM	#19
hcarvalhoalves Pentaxian Join Date: Aug 2010 Location: São Paulo, Brazil Photos: Gallery Posts: 1,019	Originally posted by Raffwal Doesn't AF fine tuning actually move the sensor level towards or away from the lens. I don't think so. It should calibrate the screwdriver to turn plus (or minus) N degrees from the point the camera PD system finds focus.

07-24-2011, 05:26 PM	#20
Smeggypants Veteran Member Join Date: Sep 2010 Posts: 1,536	Originally posted by Ubuntu_user I doubt it because the AF compensation/fine tuning is electronic (at least that's the way I understand it). And, I don't have the global setting set (in other words, it's at 0). it won't affect what you see on the screen, but will affect the focus confirmation with MF lenses. If you're trying to MF with an aperture wider than about f2.0 then use Live view, as the standard focus screen can't resolve shallower DOFs

07-25-2011, 12:51 PM	#21
Ubuntu_user Veteran Member Join Date: Mar 2010 Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 1,545 Original Poster	Originally posted by Smeggypants If you're trying to MF with an aperture wider than about f2.0 then use Live view, as the standard focus screen can't resolve shallower DOFs Yes, I thought about that, but I'm having trouble even at f/5.6!

08-05-2011, 11:33 AM	#22
Ubuntu_user Veteran Member Join Date: Mar 2010 Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 1,545 Original Poster	I've been gone so I haven't posted, but it seems that I'm still experiencing problems. I pulled out the focusing screen and put it back in but everything seemed to be in right and tight. So, I'm not entirely sure what to do... but I do know that this isn't very fun. Maybe I'll try to learn to shoot with my right eye and see if that makes a difference.

08-05-2011, 01:09 PM	#23
JeffJS Inactive Account Join Date: Aug 2008 Location: Michigan, USA Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 7,484	What happens with Live View?

08-06-2011, 12:33 AM	#24
David&karen Veteran Member Join Date: Jan 2011 Posts: 327	Hi everyone, I think I have an answer to this one, but it happened with Karens K7. When we first got that camera, the AF was less than precise with many lenses(sent it in for service and that ended). So I ordered a Katzeye micro/split screen for it. then it consistantly front focussed and it was a mystery, so I called Katzeye: Rachel there said that the K7, and I have learned that this is also the same in the K5, use various thicknesses of shims for the focussing screen to prism interface, and that it can be all over the map. if it is not perfect, using the screen will do exactly what the OP described. Karen's K7 was off by quite a bit and the changed shims made the new screen perfect. I just put the orig. back in and it too is perfect. She can do the shim for you or guide you to do it yourself. YMMV, but this worked for us. David

08-06-2011, 04:12 AM	#25
Rin Forum Member Join Date: Nov 2010 Posts: 87	isnt it also a problem with focus shifting? many lenses shift focus when focusing first on wide open aperture and after that closing the aperture up.

08-07-2011, 10:34 AM	#27
Ubuntu_user Veteran Member Join Date: Mar 2010 Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 1,545 Original Poster	Well everyone, this is very strange—all of the sudden I'm having no trouble at all now! Focusing is just like it always use to be: precise. I'm no longer getting the FF issues. But, I have no clue what changed. Maybe my eyes were playing tricks with me!