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JeffJS · 08-22-2011, 07:36 PM

Originally posted by amoringello

Just need to make sure that the background is actually flat and there is not a building behind? Does the same banding appear when the lens cap is on?

The K5 holds a LOT of data in the shadows, and pushing up the exposure can show things you would not have expected it to have seen.
You'll see examples on the site where the shot appears almost black, but with pushing up the exposure the resulting image becomes almost "usable". (won't win any contests, but a discernible image of reasonable quality can appear)

I have not seen such banding myself and have to agree it may need servicing if it is that bad.

It is not a flat background and could in fact be something else (a fence) in the background. The photo was taken very late at night or very early in the morning (depending on how you look at it) and is in fact, nearly black to the unadjusted eye beyond the icy roof of the car. The point of posting those photos was to show what it looks like. I don't know if it's actually Banding or not (now that you mention it). No I have not tried with the lens cap on but I've shot at much higher ISOs, as I show in the later post, and there is no such phenomenon. I'm really not concerned about it at this point.

JeffJS · 08-23-2011, 09:26 AM

For giggles and grins (or not) I took a picture of the lens cap (lens cap on) at ISO 10000 to see what it looks like. Pushed it 4 stops in ACR and boosted the fill light 100% (about as extreme as it gets with ACR) to see what is really there. Lots of color noise (the above is converted to monochrome) but other than that, no apparent 'banding'. Did the same at ISO 32000, basically the same result.

falconeye · 08-23-2011, 11:54 AM

Originally posted by JeffJS

For giggles and grins (or not) I took a picture of the lens cap (lens cap on) at ISO 10000 to see shat it looks like. ...

Interesting image.
Anybody wondering if the remaining structures is pattern noise or not ...

Here is an image I created from a mathematical random generator which should exhibit no pattern noise. Any patterns you see are created in your brain

NicoleAu · 08-23-2011, 08:35 PM

This is mine at 12800 with the same treatment as Jeffs but in LR

JeffJS · 08-24-2011, 10:28 AM

Originally posted by NicoleAu

This is mine at 12800 with the same treatment as Jeffs but in LR

If this is a valid way to push banding out into the open, I'm not seeing any in your shot Nicole. Maybe you could post an example where You see banding?

NicoleAu · 08-24-2011, 03:43 PM

You can't see all the lines going across? When they're in colour they're green and a magenta colour.

JeffJS · 08-24-2011, 03:51 PM

Originally posted by NicoleAu

You can't see all the lines going across? When they're in colour they're green and a magenta colour.

Now that you mention them, Yes. When I think of banding, I think vertical rather than horizontal. Perhaps asking for an exchange if you still can, wouldn't be a bad idea especially if you're seeing this in your photos without any extreme pushing.

NicoleAu · 08-24-2011, 05:17 PM

I've emailed the company I've bought it from, so we'll see what happens.

NicoleAu · 08-24-2011, 08:41 PM

The reply I got back was that artefacts were normal and could they have an exmple of a normal shot taken with it. I've included this photo, taken of hubby at 6400 iso

JeffJS · 08-24-2011, 11:02 PM

Maybe it's just me so don't take this as disagreement with what you see, but I'm not seeing a problem in that photo. The only thing I would possibly look at with this image is the area where his left shoulder meets the background looks like it Could be banding but it may also just be the way the two out of focus areas are blending. At first I thought I saw it on his left shoulder (reddish and gray horizontal area) but I think that's just the design of the sweater(?). This all probably shouldn't be worth much to you because I've seen Many posts where people reported banding with various cameras and I've typically failed to see it, on multiple screens.

NicoleAu · 08-24-2011, 11:18 PM

It's not the design of his sweater, the same lines continue onto his t-shirt. The lines are vertical on this as I had it in portrait orientation. The rep from the company said he can see the banding very clearly and is contacting Pentax. So we'll see what happens from here I guess.

JeffJS · 08-24-2011, 11:27 PM

Originally posted by NicoleAu

It's not the design of his sweater, the same lines continue onto his t-shirt. The lines are vertical on this as I had it in portrait orientation. The rep from the company said he can see the banding very clearly and is contacting Pentax. So we'll see what happens from here I guess.

That's what I thought I was seeing but I didn't want to make any assumptions here (camera orientation, could have been a crop from a landscape shot, I do it all the time). Warranty should get it taken care of for you. Good luck with it.

philbaum · 08-25-2011, 07:32 AM

Originally posted by NicoleAu

It's not the design of his sweater, the same lines continue onto his t-shirt. The lines are vertical on this as I had it in portrait orientation. The rep from the company said he can see the banding very clearly and is contacting Pentax. So we'll see what happens from here I guess.

I made the same assumption that Jeff did, that the gray and red patch was a part of the sweater. If possible always send in a written description of the problem area with the photo when talking to the mfr. Better more explanation than complaining afterwards

But i agree, there seems to be something badly wrong with that sensor - good luck to you!

RonHendriks1966 · 08-25-2011, 07:53 AM

Originally posted by NicoleAu

This is mine at 12800 with the same treatment as Jeffs but in LR

Do you also have this banding when you make a videoclip FullHD with cap on it and then extract one image out of it?

Your banding looks not normal!

NicoleAu · 08-25-2011, 03:17 PM

I've never used the video on it, I'll give that a go later.

I have noticed if the photographs are taken in well lit areas, you can't really see the banding, but taken in shadowed areas, it's very noticeable.

08-23-2011, 09:26 AM	#32
JeffJS Inactive Account Join Date: Aug 2008 Location: Michigan, USA Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 7,484	For giggles and grins (or not) I took a picture of the lens cap (lens cap on) at ISO 10000 to see what it looks like. Pushed it 4 stops in ACR and boosted the fill light 100% (about as extreme as it gets with ACR) to see what is really there. Lots of color noise (the above is converted to monochrome) but other than that, no apparent 'banding'. Did the same at ISO 32000, basically the same result. Last edited by JeffJS; 08-23-2011 at 01:03 PM.

08-23-2011, 11:54 AM	#33
falconeye Veteran Member Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: Munich, Alps, Germany Photos: Gallery Posts: 6,871	Originally posted by JeffJS For giggles and grins (or not) I took a picture of the lens cap (lens cap on) at ISO 10000 to see shat it looks like. ... Interesting image. Anybody wondering if the remaining structures is pattern noise or not ... Here is an image I created from a mathematical random generator which should exhibit no pattern noise. Any patterns you see are created in your brain Last edited by falconeye; 06-23-2012 at 03:12 AM.

08-25-2011, 03:17 PM	#45
NicoleAu Veteran Member Join Date: Jul 2010 Location: Central Coast, NSW, Australia Photos: Gallery Posts: 539	I've never used the video on it, I'll give that a go later. I have noticed if the photographs are taken in well lit areas, you can't really see the banding, but taken in shadowed areas, it's very noticeable. Last edited by NicoleAu; 08-25-2011 at 03:23 PM.

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08-22-2011, 07:36 PM	#31
JeffJS Inactive Account Join Date: Aug 2008 Location: Michigan, USA Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 7,484	Originally posted by amoringello Just need to make sure that the background is actually flat and there is not a building behind? Does the same banding appear when the lens cap is on? The K5 holds a LOT of data in the shadows, and pushing up the exposure can show things you would not have expected it to have seen. You'll see examples on the site where the shot appears almost black, but with pushing up the exposure the resulting image becomes almost "usable". (won't win any contests, but a discernible image of reasonable quality can appear) I have not seen such banding myself and have to agree it may need servicing if it is that bad. It is not a flat background and could in fact be something else (a fence) in the background. The photo was taken very late at night or very early in the morning (depending on how you look at it) and is in fact, nearly black to the unadjusted eye beyond the icy roof of the car. The point of posting those photos was to show what it looks like. I don't know if it's actually Banding or not (now that you mention it). No I have not tried with the lens cap on but I've shot at much higher ISOs, as I show in the later post, and there is no such phenomenon. I'm really not concerned about it at this point.

08-23-2011, 08:35 PM	#34
NicoleAu Veteran Member Join Date: Jul 2010 Location: Central Coast, NSW, Australia Photos: Gallery Posts: 539	This is mine at 12800 with the same treatment as Jeffs but in LR

08-24-2011, 10:28 AM	#35
JeffJS Inactive Account Join Date: Aug 2008 Location: Michigan, USA Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 7,484	Originally posted by NicoleAu This is mine at 12800 with the same treatment as Jeffs but in LR If this is a valid way to push banding out into the open, I'm not seeing any in your shot Nicole. Maybe you could post an example where You see banding?

08-24-2011, 03:43 PM	#36
NicoleAu Veteran Member Join Date: Jul 2010 Location: Central Coast, NSW, Australia Photos: Gallery Posts: 539	You can't see all the lines going across? When they're in colour they're green and a magenta colour.

08-24-2011, 03:51 PM	#37
JeffJS Inactive Account Join Date: Aug 2008 Location: Michigan, USA Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 7,484	Originally posted by NicoleAu You can't see all the lines going across? When they're in colour they're green and a magenta colour. Now that you mention them, Yes. When I think of banding, I think vertical rather than horizontal. Perhaps asking for an exchange if you still can, wouldn't be a bad idea especially if you're seeing this in your photos without any extreme pushing.

08-24-2011, 05:17 PM	#38
NicoleAu Veteran Member Join Date: Jul 2010 Location: Central Coast, NSW, Australia Photos: Gallery Posts: 539	I've emailed the company I've bought it from, so we'll see what happens.

08-24-2011, 08:41 PM	#39
NicoleAu Veteran Member Join Date: Jul 2010 Location: Central Coast, NSW, Australia Photos: Gallery Posts: 539	The reply I got back was that artefacts were normal and could they have an exmple of a normal shot taken with it. I've included this photo, taken of hubby at 6400 iso

08-24-2011, 11:02 PM	#40
JeffJS Inactive Account Join Date: Aug 2008 Location: Michigan, USA Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 7,484	Maybe it's just me so don't take this as disagreement with what you see, but I'm not seeing a problem in that photo. The only thing I would possibly look at with this image is the area where his left shoulder meets the background looks like it Could be banding but it may also just be the way the two out of focus areas are blending. At first I thought I saw it on his left shoulder (reddish and gray horizontal area) but I think that's just the design of the sweater(?). This all probably shouldn't be worth much to you because I've seen Many posts where people reported banding with various cameras and I've typically failed to see it, on multiple screens.

08-24-2011, 11:18 PM	#41
NicoleAu Veteran Member Join Date: Jul 2010 Location: Central Coast, NSW, Australia Photos: Gallery Posts: 539	It's not the design of his sweater, the same lines continue onto his t-shirt. The lines are vertical on this as I had it in portrait orientation. The rep from the company said he can see the banding very clearly and is contacting Pentax. So we'll see what happens from here I guess.

08-24-2011, 11:27 PM	#42
JeffJS Inactive Account Join Date: Aug 2008 Location: Michigan, USA Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 7,484	Originally posted by NicoleAu It's not the design of his sweater, the same lines continue onto his t-shirt. The lines are vertical on this as I had it in portrait orientation. The rep from the company said he can see the banding very clearly and is contacting Pentax. So we'll see what happens from here I guess. That's what I thought I was seeing but I didn't want to make any assumptions here (camera orientation, could have been a crop from a landscape shot, I do it all the time). Warranty should get it taken care of for you. Good luck with it.

08-25-2011, 07:32 AM	#43
philbaum Veteran Member Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: Port Townsend, Washington State, USA Posts: 3,659	Originally posted by NicoleAu It's not the design of his sweater, the same lines continue onto his t-shirt. The lines are vertical on this as I had it in portrait orientation. The rep from the company said he can see the banding very clearly and is contacting Pentax. So we'll see what happens from here I guess. I made the same assumption that Jeff did, that the gray and red patch was a part of the sweater. If possible always send in a written description of the problem area with the photo when talking to the mfr. Better more explanation than complaining afterwards But i agree, there seems to be something badly wrong with that sensor - good luck to you!

08-25-2011, 07:53 AM	#44
RonHendriks1966 Banned Join Date: Jan 2009 Photos: Gallery Posts: 9,675	Originally posted by NicoleAu This is mine at 12800 with the same treatment as Jeffs but in LR Do you also have this banding when you make a videoclip FullHD with cap on it and then extract one image out of it? Your banding looks not normal!

10 000 iso

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