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10-07-2011, 02:23 PM   #61
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QuoteQuote:
...the reponse the OP got from the CRIS supervisor "YES" he should have simply said "I am very sorry". He had no knowledge of the quality of the repair yet. It has been by experience with customers that when they get a bad repair they should get a simple apology and a promise to make things right vs excuses.
Yet customers go on and on about "how could this happen", "what kind of techs do you have", "don't you do any QC" etc. where a simple "we're sorry" answer will not appease them. Therefore you get the "I don't know, our tech has been here 18 years" answers...

10-07-2011, 02:52 PM   #62
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To: jcp5

Agree.
10-07-2011, 07:27 PM   #63
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QuoteOriginally posted by SpecialK Quote
Yet customers go on and on about "how could this happen", "what kind of techs do you have", "don't you do any QC" etc. where a simple "we're sorry" answer will not appease them. Therefore you get the "I don't know, our tech has been here 18 years" answers...
You just described the "Service Business". This is common for a "service person" taking the initial call from a upset customer. It goes with being in that business. More times then not the customer is right. Customers who get a bad repair feel obligated to do the "squeaky wheel" thing to get some attention. Nothing wrong with that. Since these techs fix these cameras all day/every day they should have got it right the first time and the QA person should have caught it.That's their job.They get paid to do that.That applies to anybody's service center.

Who wants to wait 4-6 weeks just to get their camera back then call CRIS and ask them if they can do it again? Not me!

It is not the customer that is supposed to be forgiving because what he paid for does not work or that a companies warranty repair went bad. If a company thinks that then by..by customers. Not so good for business.

Saying I'am sorry/I understand and will make this right is calming the customer and it will appease them-----saying it is not our fault it left here working is not what the customer wants to hear. Ever hear the expression "The customer is always right"? The rest of that is "If you want their future business". It is about satisfied customers who get what they paid for and getting more business. Pentax wants more business....right? There are other choices.

The CRIS supervisor sent the OP a label and promised to expedite the repair so all is good. I am just nitpicking at this one particular repair here to make a point however this repair was unusually poor and I know if it were me I would not hesitate to have an honest talk with the supervisor to get by camera fixed correctly and get it back to me ASAP. I should also say you do not have to yell or abuse the service person to get a good response as long as the end result is they send you a shipping label and promise to expedite the repair. CRIS is a good service center and I am sure the supervisor will investigate what happened with this repair.

Everything I just said was about "Taking the Customer Position" because that is what I am --A Pentax Customer - I paid to be one--it wasn't free.

SpecialK and jamesm007, I thought you guys were customers??

Last edited by jcp5; 10-09-2011 at 06:46 AM.
10-09-2011, 10:49 AM   #64
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QuoteOriginally posted by jcp5 Quote
Don't feel sorry for CRIS. They have an exclusive deal for warranty work (USA) with Pentax and we know they are doing good business these days. Unhappy customers are normal business for a service center and broken cameras is how they make their money. Since CRIS is Pentax USA authorized warranty repair center it is appropriate for a customer to see them as Pentax. Worked out nice for everybody that CRIS is also the exclusive authorized warranty USA repair center for RICOH. CRIS is doing fine.
This.

It doesn't matter one bit if the problems lay on the side of Pentax, on poor performance of CRIS, or both.
The end customer experience is the same - lousy turnaround times in many cases, and more than one person having to send a "fixed" camera back more than once, none of which is acceptable for a ~$1500 or more purchase. The experience for the most part remains "experience with my Pentax gear," and will play into how customers consider additional purchases, or not.
If CRIS needs to stock up on more parts, or do more training, or lay off some under-performing "techs," so be it. If CRIS management is pushing volume over ensuring all cameras going out the door are checked fully to factory specs, then they likely are in breach of contract with Pentax. If Pentax won't allow some repairs to be done by CRIS, requiring cameras to be sent to Japan, there's another problem resulting in poor turnaround times and customer experience. There are lots of places blame may lie, including in Pentax replacement components, training, CRIS technicians, etc. - with the same end result. Customers don't care if CRIS is making record profits, they care if their gear takes forever to be repaired and/or isn't repaired properly or the repairs result in other problems, and the same applies to Pentax. 5 years down the line when the newest Pentax/Ricoh super camera appears, few will remember their repair experience with a particular technician as much as "that was not fast nor pleasant, and I wasn't happy overall" and that does little to retain customers.

I hope all of the issues get sorted, regardless of where the problem(s?) actually lies.

10-09-2011, 12:57 PM   #65
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rtpguy - You must have got confused because the quote of mine you commented on above had nothing to do with what you just wrote. It was from a "small part" of one of my posts where I was responding to someone else that was defending CRIS and saying it was Pentax fault. If the only post of mine you actually read is the one above yours I think we generally agree.(only generally) You must not have read that one...right??

Here I will make it easy for you---I wrote this:
"Who wants to wait 4-6 weeks just to get their camera back then call CRIS and ask them if they can do it again? Not me!" ---There you go---easy--Your welcome!

I was more interested in what happened for the OP's repair and what the CRIS supervisor said and your post above was more "perfect world" kind of post mixed with misquoting me--allot.
That never happened on a form before...right!

Last edited by jcp5; 10-09-2011 at 04:39 PM.
10-09-2011, 02:00 PM   #66
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Wow, this is one repair that may have gone bad, or, knowing the K5 and the myriad of problems it is prone to, it's entirely possible that the camera was working when CRIS tested it upon completion and it broke during transit. Perhaps the box got handled roughly and the camera broke.
Even if it was a bad repair, stuff happens from time to time. Every now and again all of us drop the ball. It's not really a good reason to crucify the repair guys because every now and again something happens.
The reality is, the K5 appears to be a junk build, with enough problems on it's own to keep a decent sized repair facility employed. CRIS may have dropped the ball on this one repair, but you can bet that when they took on the contract from Pentax they were most likely led to believe that Pentax had decent quality control and they wouldn't get run over with K5 repairs.
10-09-2011, 04:49 PM   #67
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QuoteOriginally posted by jcp5 Quote
rtpguy - You must have got confused because the quote of mine you commented on above had nothing to do with what you just wrote. It was from a "small part" of one of my posts where I was responding to someone else that was defending CRIS and saying it was Pentax fault. If the only post of mine you actually read is the one above yours I think we generally agree.(only generally) You must not have read that one...right??

Here I will make it easy for you---I wrote this:
"Who wants to wait 4-6 weeks just to get their camera back then call CRIS and ask them if they can do it again? Not me!" ---There you go---easy--Your welcome!

I was more interested in what happened for the OP's repair and what the CRIS supervisor said and your post above was more "perfect world" kind of post mixed with misquoting me--allot.
That never happened on a form before...right!
jcp - I think you misunderstood - I was agreeing with the part of your statement that I quoted, fully - the rest is my own take on customer service, support, customer perception, etc.

If you're itching for a fight, no clue why - I certainly read the entire thread, and as should be obvious, I don't think the situation being described with the OPs camera nor responses from CRIS, does much to improve goodwill and feelings towards Pentax nor CRIS.

:shrug:
10-09-2011, 05:02 PM   #68
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I went back and re read this thread and found Psychdocs article on lba and also his wife's observation "why did you buy a Pentax when nobody we know did?"
Scary stuff. I began to think he was inside my head. Now I can believe Dr. Lecther really did talk Migs into swallowing his own tongue.
btw I am eagerly awaiting the conclusion of the cris saga.




10-10-2011, 04:07 AM   #69
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QuoteOriginally posted by rubbertoe Quote
I went back and re read this thread and found Psychdocs article on lba and also his wife's observation "why did you buy a Pentax when nobody we know did?"
K5 still at CRIS. However, I have been using my old K2000. I used it at an event yesterday. Great natural light all day. I had the 50-135 lens. Pics turned out superb. [Pics of my wife's friends kids so I cannot post them]. Wife IS happy. But now I am afraid she will say I really don't need a 'prosumer' camera. That will not be a good thing:ugh: Good thing I have kids that play plenty of sports...

In any case, if my K2000 would have been better at low light and sports also, I would happily just shoot with it alone. But I have not abandoned Pentax. If the K5 comes back a third time as a dud, I will be trying to be 2 system shooter first, probably with the Nikon.
10-10-2011, 04:38 AM   #70
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QuoteOriginally posted by psychdoc Quote
K5 still at CRIS. However, I have been using my old K2000. I used it at an event yesterday. Great natural light all day. I had the 50-135 lens. Pics turned out superb. [Pics of my wife's friends kids so I cannot post them]. Wife IS happy. But now I am afraid she will say I really don't need a 'prosumer' camera. That will not be a good thing:ugh: Good thing I have kids that play plenty of sports...

In any case, if my K2000 would have been better at low light and sports also, I would happily just shoot with it alone. But I have not abandoned Pentax. If the K5 comes back a third time as a dud, I will be trying to be 2 system shooter first, probably with the Nikon.
I still think this is a simple error on the part of CRIS. You said earlier that the Live View seemed to work fine but not regular viewfinder shooting. I think they replaced the CB, and either forgot to connect something or something came loose due to a poor connection. I think (hope) they will fix it, return it, and you'll be good to go. It's unfortunate what you've gone through with this camera but when you can do this, without a flash....



Wifey will be thrilled.

Camera Pentax K-5
Exposure 0.006 sec (1/160)
Aperture f/5.6
Focal Length 50 mm (Pentax A 35-105 f3.5)
ISO Speed 6400
Exposure Bias -1.3 EV

10-10-2011, 08:38 AM   #71
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Every time I see the amazing images the k5 produces, I really want to purchase one! Then I read a post like this and remember the amount of issues the K5 can potentially have and remember why I am at present a two system person.

I realize all the possible problems are covered under warranty, but I really don't feel a camera that costs $1,200+ should be this problematic and I don't want to wait the 4-6 weeks to get it back from the repair facility. Then I read a post like this where after the wait, it still isn't right and think possibly this isn't worth it until Pentax gets some of these issues under control.

My other system produces images just as good if not better than the K5, but I can not use any of my amazing Pentax glass on it and I find that frustrating to say the least.

Tom
10-10-2011, 10:06 AM   #72
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My sentiments exactly. I got cold feet and changed my mind on the k5. My D7000 and Sigma 17-50 shipped today from Adorama. My fingers are crossed.
10-10-2011, 02:58 PM   #73
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QuoteOriginally posted by rubbertoe Quote
My sentiments exactly. I got cold feet and changed my mind on the k5. My D7000 and Sigma 17-50 shipped today from Adorama. My fingers are crossed.

a used Nikon 17-55 might have been a better choice for the D7000 rather than the sigma 17-50...I found it very soft at the edges while at a wide FOV.

a used 17-55 Nikon would be a few more dollars..but a incredible lens for a DX body
10-10-2011, 03:14 PM   #74
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QuoteOriginally posted by rubbertoe Quote
My fingers are crossed.
Just be sure not to frequent any Nikon forums after you get your camera.
You'll be assailed with just as many groans and gripes as you hear in this place about the K-5 - about dead pixels, about dead pixels in video, about sensor stains, about crappy Nikon service in the USA and Canada, and so on.
10-10-2011, 06:33 PM   #75
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Thanks Rawr: I am very easily swayed by bad news indeed.
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