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01-25-2013, 01:26 AM   #106
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I'm curious has anyone given any thought to putting a diffuser lens filter on one of these cameras in situations (like fashion photography) where moire is likely to raise it's ugly head and just take the drop in sharpness?

mosaic engineering also claims to have a non blurring anti aliasing lens filter that you can just screw on to your lens. Though it doesn't show up anywhere on their products page or for sale anywhere online so I'm sceptical to say the least.

But if an on lens filter is an option wouldn't this be a far more flexible solution than an on sensor AA filter?

Best,

-Q

01-25-2013, 03:14 AM   #107
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I'd rather go without the AA altogether, sensor or lens based, and just avoid the situations or lighting that may provoke moire. If all else fails, there's still post-processing.
01-25-2013, 03:47 AM   #108
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QuoteOriginally posted by Alizarine Quote
'd rather go without the AA altogether, sensor or lens based, and just avoid the situations or lighting that may provoke moire
frequently us commercial photographers do not have much of a choice - with most of my cameras that have no Bayer AA Filter I stop the lens down to f/13~f/16 - and let Diffraction itself become the AA filter - because a shot with a camera without a filter at f/16 is still going to be sharper than a shot from a camera that already has a Bayer AA filter in it. Another trick I use is to simply take a few steps closer/further away from my subject and crop in afterwards, sometimes even holding the camera at a slight angle can reduce Moire - I learned that trick years ago from a television crew.
01-27-2013, 12:50 PM   #109
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QuoteOriginally posted by kpevav Quote
Interesting, what do you prefer about the K5II over the K-5IIs?
It just seems every camera gives a certain look or feel. I only go by the resultant image. There is something about the pics I just do not like from the 2s.
I can not even say what it is. It certainly holds a lot of detail but I just do not like the images. I love the images from the K5 though.
Everyone has different taste though.

01-29-2013, 05:11 AM   #110
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QuoteOriginally posted by Digitalis Quote
frequently us commercial photographers do not have much of a choice - with most of my cameras that have no Bayer AA Filter I stop the lens down to f/13~f/16 - and let Diffraction itself become the AA filter - because a shot with a camera without a filter at f/16 is still going to be sharper than a shot from a camera that already has a Bayer AA filter in it. Another trick I use is to simply take a few steps closer/further away from my subject and crop in afterwards, sometimes even holding the camera at a slight angle can reduce Moire - I learned that trick years ago from a television crew.
But in the studio that is not always an option and with clothing changing the angle or taking a step forward or backward only moves the problem to a different part 9/10 times.

As for not shooting in these conditions... well i can hardly give up shooting clothing if that's a living
01-29-2013, 05:40 AM   #111
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QuoteOriginally posted by Anvh Quote
But in the studio that is not always an option and with clothing changing the angle or taking a step forward or backward only moves the problem to a different part 9/10 times.
sometimes it does work sometimes it doesn't I. BTW how big is the studio you are working in?
01-29-2013, 06:15 AM   #112
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Big but with lookbook you can not move too much because you're changing perspective.
01-29-2013, 08:22 AM   #113
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QuoteOriginally posted by Alizarine Quote
Of course I look at them at the first stage - SOOC (raw not jpeg). Why is that? Because I'd like to see good results without more PP... if it can look real sharp at first glance, I'm a happy boy
Everyone has different needs.
My photos will always be processed and input sharpening is only a very small part of that, that is even dealt with automatically so it's not a major concern to sharpen my images more.
The question remains though, how much more detail is there really in the end image?

The posts that i see about that say there is very little between them but there is increase in moire for the S version.
If that is the case then removing moire is more time consuming because that needs to be done manually while sharpening is done automatically.


So i'm curious to hear from people that actually do some processing, if there is a real gain in detail between for example the normal K5 and the mkIIs.

01-29-2013, 07:47 PM   #114
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QuoteOriginally posted by Anvh Quote
if there is a real gain in detail between for example the normal K5 and the mkIIs.
Very few people would have probably upgraded from the K-5 to the K-5 IIs... Had I the K-5 Classic before, I doubt SAFOX X alone will make me consider the upgrade. But since i only had the K-x...
01-29-2013, 11:18 PM   #115
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Anvh - You can stop wondering. I received my IIs today. Comparison shots between my K-5 of the same subject with the same lens shows a noticeable increase in resolution with the s version when processed identically. Try one out yourself if you are able.

Jack
01-30-2013, 12:27 AM   #116
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QuoteOriginally posted by jbinpg Quote
Anvh - You can stop wondering. I received my IIs today. Comparison shots between my K-5 of the same subject with the same lens shows a noticeable increase in resolution with the s version when processed identically. Try one out yourself if you are able.
If you can do post a sample please do so sir. It will be much appreciated (since I don't have a K-5 classic)!
01-30-2013, 12:52 AM - 1 Like   #117
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Sure. Here are a couple of 100% crops of an (un)willing subject's eye. Of course, the differences would be easier to see at native image size but I think they will still be noticeable knocked down. Skin pores and eye structures are crisper on the IIs. My DA* 300/4 was set up on a tripod and left in place while I just attached the two cameras without moving anything. Shot at 1/125s, f6.7, ISO200, on-camera flash set to -1.0ev. Both images received the exact same post processing including boosting exposure +0.67ev. The IIs definitely has a cooler rendition here but since both cameras were set to use AWB with flash, a minute difference in lighting may be the culprit. I will know more as I use the IIs as far as rendering goes. K5 followed by K5IIs. - Jack
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01-30-2013, 04:42 AM   #118
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QuoteOriginally posted by jbinpg Quote
Anvh - You can stop wondering. I received my IIs today. Comparison shots between my K-5 of the same subject with the same lens shows a noticeable increase in resolution with the s version when processed identically. Try one out yourself if you are able.

Jack
Thank you Jack but you're making an error.

Since the S version does not have an AA filter so the processing must be different, so if you're processing them the same way it's actually a sign you didn't process your K5 photo's well.

That's what i meant with comparing the 2 with a propper processing rather then indentical processing
The input sharpening must be different.


As for the photos you're showing, can you point out the details the K5 did not capture?
Seems to me it captured all the hair, stripes in the iris and the skin.

Last edited by Anvh; 01-30-2013 at 04:47 AM.
01-30-2013, 06:55 AM   #119
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QuoteOriginally posted by Anvh Quote
As for the photos you're showing, can you point out the details the K5 did not capture?
you mean the differences aren't plain enough to see? sure the quality of light appears to be different between the two images - the degree of specularity on the K5IIs shot is different from the K5, not to mention the WB setting. But there are extremely fine details there that the K5IIs is capturing that are difficult to see in the K5 image.
01-30-2013, 07:32 AM   #120
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QuoteOriginally posted by Digitalis Quote
But there are extremely fine details there that the K5IIs is capturing that are difficult to see in the K5 image.
So the K5 did capture those details, that's what i meant with show me details the K5 didn't capture but it seems it didn't miss any.

Correctly aplying input sharpening should bring those fine details out more.


I would love to see a huge difference between the two in levels of details captured but that doesnt seem to be the case, sadly.
This only makes chosing harder....
Maybe i'll just get the 645D....
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