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03-27-2013, 04:16 PM   #1
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Moiré, gotcha!!

Finally I have succeeded to produce some true moiré with my K5IIs!
It was supposed to be a major issue due to the lack of the AA filter, and was supposed to ruin the occasional shot.
So I was quite underwhelmed to witness the halfhearted attempts of my new K5IIs at moiré, usually at near glance turning out to be nothing more than some unimpressive chroma noise at iso's like 800, and easily cleaned up during routine noise reduction.
It wasn't like I was not trying hard with my Zeiss prime lenses (not the least I would say sharpness and resolution wise). Still, somehow I could not succeed.
What a scam, this moiré king, pfffff!
But low and behold, today I took the K5IIs mounted with the Zeiss distagon 28mm f2, and I finally succeeded to shoot some vintage moiré. Not a worn down internet sample that has been used I don't know how many times to prove the destructive moiré producing capacities of this fruit of irresponsible Pentax engineers, no, my own home brewed moiré!

And here it is, first the full shot, secondly the 100% crop with the moiré (look at the stone foot of the statue), and third: the same 100% crop after, what, 20 seconds? work in Capture One 7, selective moire removal on a layer, so not affecting colors in the rest of the image (not even that!). Again, of course truly underwhelmed once more: moiré on the K5IIs was supposed to thoroughly ruin my shots! Bwaahhh, Pentax should be taking this K5IIs back to the drawing board, what a fraud this moiré king!
Well, at least I guess I can stop trying now?

p.s. don't mean to rattle on complaining, but also I'm not impressed at all with the detail at 100%, surely not since these are virtually totally unsharpened crops, tsss.. this K5IIs, luke warm K5 re-issue, just like the critics all said...mwŕh.. bring on the K3!!


Last edited by Chris Mak; 05-02-2013 at 12:28 PM.
03-27-2013, 04:49 PM   #2
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Good catch!

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03-27-2013, 05:23 PM   #3
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QuoteOriginally posted by Adam Quote
Good catch!
Thanks!
I guess I should just give it some time..
03-27-2013, 05:39 PM   #4
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Good job in recovering that awful moiré! You cleaned it nicely. Next, you really need to fix the colour balance - I detect a slight colour shift in the MacDonald's Arches in the background. Must be another serious K-5 IIs defect? (just fooling here).

I presume you worked with a RAW image, Would be interesting to see it developed - sharpen, microcontrast applied, etc.

- Craig

03-27-2013, 07:39 PM   #5
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FWIW, I just noticed a bit of moire from my old K100dS. It was on sport jacket with a somewhat finer check pattern on it. Had I not heard of this moire aspect, I would not have ever thought to look for it. I wonder what kind of a filter the K100dS has. Maybe moire is not confined to only filter-less sensors? Not a big worry for me, however. 4 years, 20K shots, and this was the only time I ever recall even seeing anything.
03-27-2013, 10:50 PM   #6
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Someone is going to have to point this out to me more because I am not seeing anything....

FYI I am considering getting a second body and am considering the K5 IIs....

I might get two of them in fact...so I can minimize lens swapping...and have back ups....
03-28-2013, 09:29 AM   #7
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QuoteQuote:
Someone is going to have to point this out to me more because I am not seeing anything....
Look at the raised border of the pedestal, in between the two lances: Magenta-green striped pattern on the grey. That's it.
03-28-2013, 10:10 AM   #8
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oh it looks kind of like a stain sort of... that's it? That's what all the fuss is about?? LOL!

03-28-2013, 12:26 PM   #9
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QuoteOriginally posted by alamo5000 Quote
oh it looks kind of like a stain sort of... that's it? That's what all the fuss is about?? LOL!
And to think that's the best(=worst) I've been able to come up with
On a serious note: as I mentioned, if you work from raw and have one of the better Raw converters, it's 20 sec. work to effectively remove it, without ány downsides (CO1 lets you remove moiré on a layer, so no harm to the rest of your image). Add that to the fact that it is going to show up seldomly, even with sharp primes (unless perhaps if you spend most of your photography time shooting textures with repeating patterns) and you can leave moiré out of consideration.
There is a lot that the K5IIs does right, especially if you have prime lenses like the Da ltd's or the Zeiss primes you can get wonderfully detailed images, and the superb noise control of the k5 series makes the K5IIs a great all-rounder.
03-28-2013, 01:35 PM   #10
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Just a note that on my little Toughbook screen at work the moire is invisible. But on my much larger home screen, it stands out nicely. Just proves that observing medium matters.
03-28-2013, 03:44 PM   #11
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QuoteQuote:
and you can leave moiré out of consideration
I was sort of suspecting that.

Thanks for your efforts, I'm in the process of switching to Pentax and was wondering whether taking the IIs over the II wasn't a risky proposition. This clinched it.
03-28-2013, 09:08 PM   #12
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QuoteOriginally posted by Chris Mak Quote
And to think that's the best(=worst) I've been able to come up with
On a serious note: as I mentioned, if you work from raw and have one of the better Raw converters, it's 20 sec. work to effectively remove it, without ány downsides (CO1 lets you remove moiré on a layer, so no harm to the rest of your image). Add that to the fact that it is going to show up seldomly, even with sharp primes (unless perhaps if you spend most of your photography time shooting textures with repeating patterns) and you can leave moiré out of consideration.
There is a lot that the K5IIs does right, especially if you have prime lenses like the Da ltd's or the Zeiss primes you can get wonderfully detailed images, and the superb noise control of the k5 series makes the K5IIs a great all-rounder.
I have several of the DA limited primes and a couple zooms. When I get back out and on the road so to speak (IE globe hopping) I will get myself two K5IIs bodies.
03-29-2013, 03:01 AM   #13
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QuoteOriginally posted by Chris Mak Quote
Finally I have succeeded to produce some true moiré with my K5IIs!
It was supposed to be a major issue due to the lack of the AA filter, and was supposed to ruin the occasional shot.
Sez who?
If you found that on the internyet, it must be true, right?
You could have asked almost any GXR or Leica user about the real life implications of the lack of the AA filter.
Just be careful before you start shooting fashion for some picky clothes designer professionally. Other than that, well, even an occasional ring of moire won't necessarily ruin your photo, will it? I think not. Quite often the noise on the internet is much ado about nothing.

QuoteOriginally posted by GlennG:
FWIW, I just noticed a bit of moire from my old K100dS. It was on sport jacket with a somewhat finer check pattern on it. Had I not heard of this moire aspect, I would not have ever thought to look for it. I wonder what kind of a filter the K100dS has. Maybe moire is not confined to only filter-less sensors? Not a big worry for me, however. 4 years, 20K shots, and this was the only time I ever recall even seeing anything.
All Bayer style sensors are prone to have moiré. The reshuffled Bayer sensor of the Fuji X series cameras may be anexception. But apart from the Fuji, the feature is built in the sensor design. Different manufacturers are using different strengths of low-pass filters in their cameras, though, and sometimes a camera with a weaker low-pass filter will produce moiré patterns more likely than a one with a stronger filter.
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