K-5 upgrade to K-5 II. Is to worth for P-TTL?

Chris74 · 08-18-2013, 04:23 PM

I was a happy user of K-5 for ca. two years until I recently bought a flash gun for my camera - Sigma EF-610 DG Super. When used in P-TTL mode, the exposures were a hit and miss, but usually miss, with majority of photos overexposed by 2-3 stops. Even for the same subject, the photos were differently exposed for different apertures. In auto mode on the flash, all exposures were spot on. I sent the flash back to where I bought it as I thought it was faulty, and replaced it with Metz 58 AF-2. The photos are still overexposed by 1.5-2 stops in most cases, but at least they are more consistent and predictable, but I still haven't tested it in all conditions yet. In auto mode again - spot on. After all these problems I found that it's known to some K-5 users problem with P-TTL.
And here's my question. Is the P-TTL any better with K-5 II? From what I read on this forum it seems it is, but is it good enough to be worth to upgrade?
Thanks for any help.

Adam · 08-18-2013, 04:26 PM

The K-5 II still has the problem AFAIK, but I'm not 100% sure. Remember that not much has been changed in the K-5 II except for the AF system and screen cover.

Allison · 08-19-2013, 11:23 AM

It is a nice upgrade to the AF, but I don't really feel that the flash system is working any differently between my two cameras. Personally, I have found more accuracy and reliability when bouncing the flash if I have the diffusion panel out and I have the flash zoom capabilities set to manual (on the Pentax 540 the flash automatically goes into manual zoom when the diffusion panel is out).

ChrisJ · 08-19-2013, 04:38 PM

I don't know if you can update the firmware in a Sigma flash, but I had to update my Metz flash before it would work as expected on my K5 and K-01. It was basically random before the update, works well now. Still OK on my older Pentax cameras.

Here's the update page for the Metz 58AF2, one tip that had me pulling my hair out, don't turn the flash on, it powers the firmware rom chip from the USB, turn the flash on and it won't update.

http://www.metz.de/en/flash-units/firmware-download-flash-units/mecablitz-58...al/pentax.html

Chris

Last edited by ChrisJ; 08-19-2013 at 04:45 PM.

Chris74 · 08-20-2013, 11:54 AM

I am likely to upgrade anyway. I did upgrade the firmware to v4.1. When I bought it, it was v3.0 (I think), and agree that it was much like Sigma then. Now it's more consistent and acceptable (still, could be better) and I'll stick to it.
BTW, you can't update the firmware in a Sigma.

I also upgraded the firmware in the K-5 to v1.14 (don't remember from which version), but didn't notice any difference.

I didn't mean to ask about the AF but since Allison mentioned it I'll ask, is there noticeable improvement?
I never had much problem with the AF in low light conditions. In good light it even worked fine with 10-stop ND filter on.
Occasionally however it was back focusing when doing portraits with low depth of field (f/2.8). Although it showed it locked focus on the face, it actually focused on the wall 5 feet behind which was very annoying.

Thanks for your help.

Allison · 08-20-2013, 06:06 PM

I have found the AF to be more decisive and faster. Using the k5 at weddings, I saw the most issues during dancing at the reception. By that time the lights in the room were usually off and it was all based off of the moving lights from the DJs set up. The IIs does much better in those conditions. I don't notice as big of a difference in normal conditions, but my IIs does not have any backfocus issues and my K5 does. I know that can be camera based issue, but my K5 does backfocus on every shot with a lens, but some of them. In my mind, the improved AF is the reason why the IIs doesn't have the same issues.

k5astro · 11-04-2013, 02:56 PM

Originally posted by Chris74

I was a happy user of K-5 for ca. two years until I recently bought a flash gun for my camera - Sigma EF-610 DG Super. When used in P-TTL mode, the exposures were a hit and miss, but usually miss, with majority of photos overexposed by 2-3 stops. Even for the same subject, the photos were differently exposed for different apertures. In auto mode on the flash, all exposures were spot on. I sent the flash back to where I bought it as I thought it was faulty, and replaced it with Metz 58 AF-2. The photos are still overexposed by 1.5-2 stops in most cases, but at least they are more consistent and predictable, but I still haven't tested it in all conditions yet. In auto mode again - spot on. After all these problems I found that it's known to some K-5 users problem with P-TTL.
And here's my question. Is the P-TTL any better with K-5 II? From what I read on this forum it seems it is, but is it good enough to be worth to upgrade?
Thanks for any help.

Bummer! I just discovered this problem on my K5II. I hadn't used the flash until now and I was getting frustrated with it yesterday, trying off camera stuff. Today I decided to just do straight-up P-TTL around the house and found it didn't work - WTF

The thing is, it doesn't work with my Sigma EF-530 DG Super or my AF-360FGZ! Both do what you describe.

I found that it seems to work well as long as you fix the ISO, regardless of using P, Av or Tv modes.

Deedee · 11-04-2013, 03:19 PM

Hi,

Issues related to Flash and TTL discussed here:

https://www.pentaxforums.com/forums/115-pentax-k-5/240445-has-k-5-ii-fixed-list-issues.html

&

https://www.pentaxforums.com/forums/115-pentax-k-5/201836-k-5-p-ttl-external...rexposure.html

&

https://www.pentaxforums.com/forums/115-pentax-k-5/239563-bounce-flash-issue...e-problem.html

and a possible work around / solution as I haven't tried here:

https://www.pentaxforums.com/forums/115-pentax-k-5/238961-indirect-flash-ove...k-5-k-5ii.html

or here:

https://www.pentaxforums.com/forums/115-pentax-k-5/201836-k-5-p-ttl-external...rexposure.html

Cheers!

k5astro · 11-04-2013, 04:46 PM

Originally posted by Deedee

Hi,

Issues related to Flash and TTL discussed here:

https://www.pentaxforums.com/forums/115-pentax-k-5/240445-has-k-5-ii-fixed-list-issues.html

&

https://www.pentaxforums.com/forums/115-pentax-k-5/201836-k-5-p-ttl-external...rexposure.html

&

https://www.pentaxforums.com/forums/115-pentax-k-5/239563-bounce-flash-issue...e-problem.html

and a possible work around / solution as I haven't tried here:

https://www.pentaxforums.com/forums/115-pentax-k-5/238961-indirect-flash-ove...k-5-k-5ii.html

or here:

https://www.pentaxforums.com/forums/115-pentax-k-5/201836-k-5-p-ttl-external...rexposure.html

Cheers!

Thanks Deedee! I'll catch up on my reading :-P

Using flashes is so fraught with problems, I'm almost sorry I bought them. With cameras working so well in low light. Flashes aren't so necessary anymore anyway.

Deedee · 11-04-2013, 04:51 PM

Originally posted by gbeaton

With cameras working so well in low light. Flashes aren't so necessary anymore anyway.

I second this! Last weekend I was at the oceanarium with my wife! I swear I took a picture at 8000 ISO thinking there will be so much noise I will not be able to use it. It was PITCH BLACK! The picture I took were of jelly fish.

Needless to say my mind WAS BLOWN!

I got a WYSIWYG picture! WB was a little off bu nevertheless.

Cheers!

k5astro · 11-06-2013, 10:24 AM

I take it back. Fixing the ISO helped but not consistently with all shots. But I think I do have a solution that maybe someone can verify.

I used the Pentax AF-360FGZ on top of my K5II as a wireless control flash and the Sigma EF-530 DG Super as a wireless slave. This seemed to work consistently in different lighting conditions. Camera was in P mode (which seemed to work a lot like slow shutter mode).

EDIT: Also, I can use the Pentax flash in Auto mode on top of my K5II. This works as well.

08-18-2013, 04:23 PM	#1
Chris74 New Member Join Date: Jun 2012 Location: Cavan Posts: 4	K-5 upgrade to K-5 II. Is to worth for P-TTL? I was a happy user of K-5 for ca. two years until I recently bought a flash gun for my camera - Sigma EF-610 DG Super. When used in P-TTL mode, the exposures were a hit and miss, but usually miss, with majority of photos overexposed by 2-3 stops. Even for the same subject, the photos were differently exposed for different apertures. In auto mode on the flash, all exposures were spot on. I sent the flash back to where I bought it as I thought it was faulty, and replaced it with Metz 58 AF-2. The photos are still overexposed by 1.5-2 stops in most cases, but at least they are more consistent and predictable, but I still haven't tested it in all conditions yet. In auto mode again - spot on. After all these problems I found that it's known to some K-5 users problem with P-TTL. And here's my question. Is the P-TTL any better with K-5 II? From what I read on this forum it seems it is, but is it good enough to be worth to upgrade? Thanks for any help.

08-18-2013, 04:26 PM	#2
Adam Administrator Site Webmaster Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Arizona Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 51,608	The K-5 II still has the problem AFAIK, but I'm not 100% sure. Remember that not much has been changed in the K-5 II except for the AF system and screen cover. Adam PentaxForums.com Webmaster (Site Usage Guide \| Site Help \| My Photography) PentaxForums.com server and development costs are user-supported. You can help cover these costs by donating or purchasing one of our Pentax eBooks. Or, buy your photo gear from our affiliates, Adorama, B&H Photo, KEH, or Topaz Labs, and get FREE Marketplace access - click here to see how! Trusted Pentax retailers:

11-06-2013, 10:24 AM	#11
k5astro Veteran Member Join Date: Apr 2012 Photos: Albums Posts: 387	I take it back. Fixing the ISO helped but not consistently with all shots. But I think I do have a solution that maybe someone can verify. I used the Pentax AF-360FGZ on top of my K5II as a wireless control flash and the Sigma EF-530 DG Super as a wireless slave. This seemed to work consistently in different lighting conditions. Camera was in P mode (which seemed to work a lot like slow shutter mode). EDIT: Also, I can use the Pentax flash in Auto mode on top of my K5II. This works as well. Last edited by k5astro; 11-06-2013 at 10:29 AM.

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08-19-2013, 11:23 AM	#3
Allison Veteran Member Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: Pittsburgh, PA Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 667	It is a nice upgrade to the AF, but I don't really feel that the flash system is working any differently between my two cameras. Personally, I have found more accuracy and reliability when bouncing the flash if I have the diffusion panel out and I have the flash zoom capabilities set to manual (on the Pentax 540 the flash automatically goes into manual zoom when the diffusion panel is out).

08-19-2013, 04:38 PM	#4
ChrisJ Veteran Member Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: Eckington, Derbyshire UK Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 316	I don't know if you can update the firmware in a Sigma flash, but I had to update my Metz flash before it would work as expected on my K5 and K-01. It was basically random before the update, works well now. Still OK on my older Pentax cameras. Here's the update page for the Metz 58AF2, one tip that had me pulling my hair out, don't turn the flash on, it powers the firmware rom chip from the USB, turn the flash on and it won't update. http://www.metz.de/en/flash-units/firmware-download-flash-units/mecablitz-58...al/pentax.html Chris Last edited by ChrisJ; 08-19-2013 at 04:45 PM.

08-20-2013, 11:54 AM	#5
Chris74 New Member Join Date: Jun 2012 Location: Cavan Posts: 4 Original Poster	I am likely to upgrade anyway. I did upgrade the firmware to v4.1. When I bought it, it was v3.0 (I think), and agree that it was much like Sigma then. Now it's more consistent and acceptable (still, could be better) and I'll stick to it. BTW, you can't update the firmware in a Sigma. I also upgraded the firmware in the K-5 to v1.14 (don't remember from which version), but didn't notice any difference. I didn't mean to ask about the AF but since Allison mentioned it I'll ask, is there noticeable improvement? I never had much problem with the AF in low light conditions. In good light it even worked fine with 10-stop ND filter on. Occasionally however it was back focusing when doing portraits with low depth of field (f/2.8). Although it showed it locked focus on the face, it actually focused on the wall 5 feet behind which was very annoying. Thanks for your help.

08-20-2013, 06:06 PM	#6
Allison Veteran Member Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: Pittsburgh, PA Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 667	I have found the AF to be more decisive and faster. Using the k5 at weddings, I saw the most issues during dancing at the reception. By that time the lights in the room were usually off and it was all based off of the moving lights from the DJs set up. The IIs does much better in those conditions. I don't notice as big of a difference in normal conditions, but my IIs does not have any backfocus issues and my K5 does. I know that can be camera based issue, but my K5 does backfocus on every shot with a lens, but some of them. In my mind, the improved AF is the reason why the IIs doesn't have the same issues.

11-04-2013, 02:56 PM	#7
k5astro Veteran Member Join Date: Apr 2012 Photos: Albums Posts: 387	Originally posted by Chris74 I was a happy user of K-5 for ca. two years until I recently bought a flash gun for my camera - Sigma EF-610 DG Super. When used in P-TTL mode, the exposures were a hit and miss, but usually miss, with majority of photos overexposed by 2-3 stops. Even for the same subject, the photos were differently exposed for different apertures. In auto mode on the flash, all exposures were spot on. I sent the flash back to where I bought it as I thought it was faulty, and replaced it with Metz 58 AF-2. The photos are still overexposed by 1.5-2 stops in most cases, but at least they are more consistent and predictable, but I still haven't tested it in all conditions yet. In auto mode again - spot on. After all these problems I found that it's known to some K-5 users problem with P-TTL. And here's my question. Is the P-TTL any better with K-5 II? From what I read on this forum it seems it is, but is it good enough to be worth to upgrade? Thanks for any help. Bummer! I just discovered this problem on my K5II. I hadn't used the flash until now and I was getting frustrated with it yesterday, trying off camera stuff. Today I decided to just do straight-up P-TTL around the house and found it didn't work - WTF The thing is, it doesn't work with my Sigma EF-530 DG Super or my AF-360FGZ! Both do what you describe. I found that it seems to work well as long as you fix the ISO, regardless of using P, Av or Tv modes.

11-04-2013, 03:19 PM	#8
Deedee Veteran Member Join Date: May 2013 Posts: 307	Hi, Issues related to Flash and TTL discussed here: https://www.pentaxforums.com/forums/115-pentax-k-5/240445-has-k-5-ii-fixed-list-issues.html & https://www.pentaxforums.com/forums/115-pentax-k-5/201836-k-5-p-ttl-external...rexposure.html & https://www.pentaxforums.com/forums/115-pentax-k-5/239563-bounce-flash-issue...e-problem.html and a possible work around / solution as I haven't tried here: https://www.pentaxforums.com/forums/115-pentax-k-5/238961-indirect-flash-ove...k-5-k-5ii.html or here: https://www.pentaxforums.com/forums/115-pentax-k-5/201836-k-5-p-ttl-external...rexposure.html Cheers!

11-04-2013, 04:46 PM	#9
k5astro Veteran Member Join Date: Apr 2012 Photos: Albums Posts: 387	Originally posted by Deedee Hi, Issues related to Flash and TTL discussed here: https://www.pentaxforums.com/forums/115-pentax-k-5/240445-has-k-5-ii-fixed-list-issues.html & https://www.pentaxforums.com/forums/115-pentax-k-5/201836-k-5-p-ttl-external...rexposure.html & https://www.pentaxforums.com/forums/115-pentax-k-5/239563-bounce-flash-issue...e-problem.html and a possible work around / solution as I haven't tried here: https://www.pentaxforums.com/forums/115-pentax-k-5/238961-indirect-flash-ove...k-5-k-5ii.html or here: https://www.pentaxforums.com/forums/115-pentax-k-5/201836-k-5-p-ttl-external...rexposure.html Cheers! Thanks Deedee! I'll catch up on my reading :-P Using flashes is so fraught with problems, I'm almost sorry I bought them. With cameras working so well in low light. Flashes aren't so necessary anymore anyway.

11-04-2013, 04:51 PM	#10
Deedee Veteran Member Join Date: May 2013 Posts: 307	Originally posted by gbeaton With cameras working so well in low light. Flashes aren't so necessary anymore anyway. I second this! Last weekend I was at the oceanarium with my wife! I swear I took a picture at 8000 ISO thinking there will be so much noise I will not be able to use it. It was PITCH BLACK! The picture I took were of jelly fish. Needless to say my mind WAS BLOWN! I got a WYSIWYG picture! WB was a little off bu nevertheless. Cheers!