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06-04-2014, 01:04 AM   #1
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K5 Slowing Down or Impatient?

I'm not even sure how to ask this question without sounding dumb, but here goes...

As of recently my K5 has been taking a considerably long time to process the image. In the past it'll take a couple of seconds for the hourglass to process and I'm able to hit the play button to view the camera. Now a days after taking one shot it'll take me at least 10-15 seconds before I'm able to preview the photo, which does not seem like a long time but when shooting in continuous mood, it feels like a lifetime. This wasn't the case before and has only been happening within the last few months. I'm not sure if I'm just being impatient since I'm older now and it seems like it is taking longer or if I should update the firmware. I've never updated and have had this camera for several years now...

06-04-2014, 01:10 AM   #2
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QuoteOriginally posted by cindaaalynnn Quote
I'm not even sure how to ask this question without sounding dumb, but here goes...

As of recently my K5 has been taking a considerably long time to process the image. In the past it'll take a couple of seconds for the hourglass to process and I'm able to hit the play button to view the camera. Now a days after taking one shot it'll take me at least 10-15 seconds before I'm able to preview the photo, which does not seem like a long time but when shooting in continuous mood, it feels like a lifetime. This wasn't the case before and has only been happening within the last few months. I'm not sure if I'm just being impatient since I'm older now and it seems like it is taking longer or if I should update the firmware. I've never updated and have had this camera for several years now...
Do you have lens corrections enabled? Are you using a card slower than 20-30Mb/s? Both would slow down writing performance considerably. Shooting a burst of images with lens corrections enabled or with a slow card will take several seconds, close to a minute in some cases.

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06-04-2014, 01:14 AM   #3
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QuoteOriginally posted by Adam Quote
Do you have lens corrections enabled? Are you using a card slower than 20-30Mb/s? Both would slow down writing performance considerably. Shooting a burst of images with lens corrections enabled or with a slow card will take several seconds, close to a minute in some cases.
I don't shoot with the lens corrections enabled. As for the card, I tend to shoot with the Lexar 32gb 133x speed or 400x- from my knowledge both are faster than 20-30 Mb/s. Would this be an issue since the firmware has never been updated?
06-04-2014, 01:19 AM   #4
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QuoteOriginally posted by cindaaalynnn Quote
I don't shoot with the lens corrections enabled. As for the card, I tend to shoot with the Lexar 32gb 133x speed or 400x- from my knowledge both are faster than 20-30 Mb/s. Would this be an issue since the firmware has never been updated?
The firmware probably isn't an issue, but a 133x card would be (that corresponds to a 19.5Mb/s read speed, and the write speed is probably slower).


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06-04-2014, 02:05 AM   #5
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It could be time to format the SD card - if the file system has become overly fragmented it will slow down.
06-04-2014, 03:38 AM   #6
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+1 ^^^^^^^ If you have been using delete to erase your exposures then some bits of information can be left behind in the sectors of the card. Over a period of time the sectors start to fill and it takes longer for the cameras write capability to find sectors with space available for new information. The cameras formatting will not erase this left behind information. When this occurs you can do a full format ( aka Low Level) to completely erase all the information on the card. This software for your computer can do that for you safely...When using it make sure you use the Full Format. It will take a little time to reformat but your card should be back up to speed afterwards.

https://www.sdcard.org/downloads/formatter_4/

Last edited by Oldbayrunner; 06-04-2014 at 03:43 AM.
06-04-2014, 04:30 AM   #7
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Card write-speed bottle-neck, OR, your camera settings need checking, as it could be you've inadvertently enabled some sort of post-shot processing function, OR, you've been making long exposures and your camera is performing dark frame subtraction.
06-04-2014, 08:51 AM   #8
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Both Macs and PCs will write hidden files to your card that grow over time and can cause fragmentation.

It's a good habit to re-format your card(s) every time you put them back in the camera.

06-04-2014, 08:59 AM   #9
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(duplicate post removed)

Last edited by OregonJim; 06-04-2014 at 09:19 AM.
06-04-2014, 09:01 AM   #10
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QuoteOriginally posted by Oldbayrunner Quote
The cameras formatting will not erase this left behind information. When this occurs you can do a full format ( aka Low Level) to completely erase all the information on the card.
This is not true. "Low-level format" was only necessary in the 80's with old MFM, RLL, and SCSI drives. The camera does a standard format. It is the computer that offers a "quick" format (erasing only the directory structure). Neither is a low-level format.

If, instead, you are referring to a "secure" format - that is, writing zeros to all data sectors - this does nothing to "clean up" a card that a standard format doesn't. All it does it make it impossible to recover your pictures. The standard camera format is the only thing that will "clean up" a corrupted card properly.

Last edited by OregonJim; 06-04-2014 at 09:22 AM.
06-04-2014, 06:26 PM   #11
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QuoteOriginally posted by OregonJim Quote
The standard camera format is the only thing that will "clean up" a corrupted card properly.
Not according to the SD Association...... Maybe you should contact them and tell them their software wont "clean Up" properly.

SD Association

SD Formatter 4.0. User’s Manual Version 1.08

1. Introduction
The SD Formatter formats SD Memory Card, SDHC Memory Card and SDXC Memory Card
(collectively SD/SDHC/SDXC Cards) complying with the SD File System Specification created by SD
Association (SDA).

The SD Formatter formats SD/SDHC/SDXC Cards optimizing with these card’s performance etc.. It is
strongly recommended to use the SD Formatter to format SD/SDHC/SDXC Cards rather than using
formatting tools provided with operating systems. In general, formatting tools provided with operating
systems can format various storage media including SD/SDHC/SDXC Cards, but it may not be
optimized for SD/SDHC/SDXC Cards and it may result in lower performance than using the SD
Formatter.

SD/SDHC/SDXC Cards have “Protected Area” in the card for SD security function. The SD Formatter
will not format the “Protected Area”. Please use appropriate application software or SD host device
which provides SD security function to format the “Protected Area” in the card.

SD Formatter does not support the SD/SDHC/SDXC card encrypted by the “BitLocker To Go" function
of Windows. Please format the SD/SDHC/SDXC card after it is unlocked by the method specified by
Windows.

SD Formatter 4.0. User’s Manual Version 1.08


5.1.2 Format Option Window


When [Option] button is clicked, the following Format Option Window is displayed on the screen. The
following format options can be selected.

- Types of formatting operations
- Format Size Adjustment options




Figure 2: Format Option Window

(1) Types of formatting operations
The following types of formatting operations are shown on the list:
- QUICK
- FULL (Erase)
- FULL (OverWrite)


QUICK:
This option is a quick formatting and only initializes the file system parameters in the card, but not
initializes user data area in your card. If you need to initialize user data area, use the other types of
formatting operations shown below.

FULL (Erase):
This option initializes the file system parameter in the card, and initializes all the user data areas
(Initialize it by executing erase processing (data deletion) of the card to all the user data areas). This
option has the possibility that it takes the format time long according to the capacity of card.
There is something that doesn't support to the erase processing according to the SD interface
device. The erase processing is skipped when "FULL (erase)" format type is selected in the
unsupported environment. In this case it is same as selected QUICK option.

FULL (OverWrite):
This option initializes the file system parameter in the card, and initializes all the user data areas
(Initialize it by overwriting the meaningless data to all the user data areas). This option has the
possibility that it takes the format time long according to the capacity of the card.

Last edited by Oldbayrunner; 06-04-2014 at 06:33 PM.
06-04-2014, 07:48 PM   #12
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QuoteOriginally posted by Oldbayrunner Quote
Not according to the SD Association...... Maybe you should contact them and tell them their software wont "clean Up" properly.
Do you understand what you posted? It does not contradict a thing I said; in fact, it reinforces it.

The SD Formatter program is for using SD cards with desktop operating systems, not cameras.

The camera's own firmware is still the only reliable way to format. Using SD Formatter or your computer's built-in formatting program can generate formats that are subtly or blatanly incompatible with the camera. The camera will format the card in a way it is guaranteed to understand (FAT12, FAT16, exFAT...). By the way, you are speaking to a writer of operating systems and firmware, and one of the original team of creators of the CompactFlash standard (which itself is based on PCMCIA/IDE, and from which SD is derived).

P.S. - I'm not attempting to be pompous, but this IS my area of expertise.

Last edited by OregonJim; 06-04-2014 at 08:08 PM.
06-05-2014, 05:30 AM   #13
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Like I said tell that to the developers at the SD Association and check with them as to the reliability of their software for formatting media for camera use......... I already have.

As far as my credentials I am not a software analyst but I am degreed and have been working with computers both as technician and technical trainer From 1977 until I retired 3 years ago for little companies such as Apple, Honeywell, IBM, Dell (early years) Compaq and Hewlett Packard so I do know a little bit about computers, OS and formatting media. Plus just to throw a little of my own pompousness out there I am a 30 year member of Mensa so I do have a little bit of intelligence and do understand what I post.

PS.... you forgot Fat32 for SDHC cards and I haven't uttered a word to you.

Nor am I going to continue this further on my part...Have a nice day!

Last edited by Oldbayrunner; 06-05-2014 at 06:42 AM.
06-05-2014, 11:52 AM - 1 Like   #14
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QuoteOriginally posted by Oldbayrunner Quote
Like I said tell that to the developers at the SD Association and check with them as to the reliability of their software for formatting media for camera use......... I already have.
You are speaking (figuratively) to one of the developers! Did I not make that clear?

SD Formatter is the decendant of a little program code named FFD (Format For Dummies). It was developed at SunDisk (now SanDisk).

It is nothing more than a dumbed-down version of the formatting code built in to Windows.

All it does is format cards with hard-coded parameters like cluster size and file allocation table format - ones that make sense for a solid state emulated disk rather than rotating magnetic media.

It does this simply to prevent people who don't know what they're doing from choosing format parameters that lower performance or cause incompatibilities.

It does absolutely nothing that the built-in Windows formatting facility can't do.

I never claimed that SD Formatter would not work. You made an incorrect assumption.

I claimed that the only RELIABLE way to format a card for a camera was WITH THAT CAMERA. That is also true of any embedded device, be it a camera, phone, mp3 player, or toaster.

The embedded device's firmware is the only piece of code that KNOWS what the device expects to read and write. It should be obvious that the device itself is the most reliable judge of how to format that card for use with that device.

If you want to continue using your own solution, be my guest. It will probably work fine (most of the time). My purpose in posting this information was to provide the most reliable path for the avoidance of card corruption. You have a nice day as well.

Last edited by OregonJim; 06-05-2014 at 12:07 PM.
06-05-2014, 12:19 PM   #15
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QuoteOriginally posted by Oldbayrunner Quote
PS.... you forgot Fat32 for SDHC cards and I haven't uttered a word to you.
Apparently, you did not notice the ellipses in my post. It implies that there are more than were stated explicitly. If you want to be snide, then you forgot vFAT and a host of others as well. And, the term "speaking" is a well-understood metaphoric construct when using text media. There is no need to point that out.
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