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02-11-2011, 07:38 AM   #136
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QuoteOriginally posted by mp29k Quote
When I compare all the benefits this camera gives me over the point and shoot I used to use (G9), I am exstatic!
You must understand some of us who cannot be ecstatics, because we compare the Kr with other dSLR (we had)... Yes, if I compare it with my Fujifilm F40FD or any compact, it is a big step forward.

Matso, I just transmitted what the guy from Pentax RO told me. I'm not so sure that he said the truth. I'm waiting too.


Last edited by ursamajor; 02-11-2011 at 08:22 AM.
02-11-2011, 10:28 AM   #137
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@mp29k -
I guess my frustration comes from wanting to love this camera for all of the amazing things about it, but knowing that this flaw is pretty significant in the context of how I intend to use it (ie. frequently indoors and in low light - I live in the UK afterall!). I chose the K-r in large part for the high ISO capabilities, but that seems pointless if you're shooting outdoors anyway. I also don't really want to wait for a solution (and, given that Pentax in this country aren't even acknowledging a problem, my faith is not especially strong that one is imminent). Maybe I'd be better off with something else but that pains me as, bar this problem, the K-r is the camera for me. Sorry for the moaning - just a function of how disappointed I am, which in itself arises from how excited I was for this particular piece of kit!
02-11-2011, 10:32 AM   #138
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I totally agree with you. Outdoors, even my compact can take amazing photos. Same here. Or here.

Last edited by ursamajor; 02-11-2011 at 10:56 AM.
02-11-2011, 10:47 AM   #139
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Wow. I love that. Seriously awesome.

02-11-2011, 10:53 AM   #140
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Fujifilm F40FD, my friend. I'm honored that you like it. See more photos on my photoblog.
Not to mention that even my Nokia E71 can take good snaphots in daylight.

Last edited by ursamajor; 02-11-2011 at 10:58 AM.
02-11-2011, 11:52 AM   #141
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I've had my K-r for a few days now. It does have the FF problem in tungsten light. Setting the focus adjustment to -10 does correct it in my case. Since I usually do very little photography in this situation I will wait at least a couple of weeks before deciding whether to keep the camera to see if Pentax releases a fix. I really like it otherwise but I would like to be able to use it in whatever situation I need and I'm not sure if the adjustment would be enough for lenses I may get in the future. The serial number of my camera is 384xxxx.
02-11-2011, 12:23 PM   #142
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I want to "put some salt on the wound" (don't know if there is this expression in english, maybe the one with "beating the dead horse) and I will say that I believe they (Pentax) will not be able to correct the FF issue, because it is a hardware issue: more precisely, the lack of the second sensor for light colour. Maybe they'll can learn something from this situation and they will not produce anymore a camera without the second sensor.
02-11-2011, 01:30 PM   #143
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QuoteOriginally posted by ursamajor Quote
I want to "put some salt on the wound" (don't know if there is this expression in english, maybe the one with "beating the dead horse) and I will say that I believe they (Pentax) will not be able to correct the FF issue, because it is a hardware issue: more precisely, the lack of the second sensor for light colour. Maybe they'll can learn something from this situation and they will not produce anymore a camera without the second sensor.
How can this be the case when the K-x, K20d, K10d, K200, K100, and istd cameras didn't have a second sensor, and no FF problem?

I think the SAFOX XI is to blame, and it can be fixed in a firmware update by treating focus differently in low, and specifically artificial light. I think it is evident through the fact that selecting tungsten WB results in significant gains in focusing that this is a software problem, not a hardware one.

All cameras have their flaws... I have yet to notice this in my own shots, but then again, I can't deny that it seems to be a problem on the majority (if not all) bodies. I am encouraged Pentax will work out a viable solution soon.

Ask yourself this... have you seen a SINGLE camera (any brand) come out in the last 3-4 years and not need a firmware update within the first few months to address mistakes made by the manufacturer? I can't think of a single one!


Last edited by mp29k; 02-11-2011 at 01:31 PM. Reason: spelling
02-11-2011, 01:39 PM   #144
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In my experience most cameras don't focus perfectly in tungsten lighting. Of course, the K5 and Kr are beyond the norm in this regard to the point where they are flawed.

As far as the Kr not being able to focus correctly because it doesn't have a WB sensor... This is completely incorrect. The K5 has FF problems as well even with the extra sensor. Also, my older K10D and K20D cameras do fine in tungsten lighting. And they don't have the extra sensor, either.

QuoteOriginally posted by ursamajor Quote
I want to "put some salt on the wound" (don't know if there is this expression in english, maybe the one with "beating the dead horse) and I will say that I believe they (Pentax) will not be able to correct the FF issue, because it is a hardware issue: more precisely, the lack of the second sensor for light colour. Maybe they'll can learn something from this situation and they will not produce anymore a camera without the second sensor.
02-11-2011, 01:40 PM   #145
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I really hope you're right.
02-11-2011, 01:45 PM   #146
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The Kx doesn't have the sensor either. The + indication on the AF system means it includes the sensor.
02-11-2011, 01:51 PM   #147
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QuoteOriginally posted by mp29k Quote
How can this be the case when the K-x, K20d, K10d, K200, K100, and istd cameras didn't have a second sensor, and no FF problem?

I think the SAFOX XI is to blame, and it can be fixed in a firmware update by treating focus differently in low, and specifically artificial light.
I agree on this. Older models work without any problems. Hopefully Pentax can fix the issue, because this will otherwise ruin their reputation and cost a lot. I'll return my camera, if the problem isn't fixed. I believe many others will do the same.

This is quite frustrating. I could have bought Canon 550D (T2i) for about the same price (also with a camera bag). However, I selected K-r because it seemed a better better camera for me and also better in low light situations. Currently it's not usable indoors (in low light). I also already bought some extra lenses and stuff as well, so I'll certainly lose some money, if I have to return the camera.
02-11-2011, 09:46 PM   #148
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QuoteOriginally posted by mp29k Quote
How can this be the case when the K-x, K20d, K10d, K200, K100, and istd cameras didn't have a second sensor, and no FF problem?

I think the SAFOX XI is to blame...
Yes, K-x, 20D etc. didn't have Safox 9 with or without +.
Last two appeared Pentax's cameras have FF issues. What are we, beta testers? Didn't they tested that AF system? How to sell on the market a such of product, with so severe AF issues?
Concerning other brands, yes, I heard about INDIVIDUAL FF issues, but not about MASS issues, like at the Kr. And, certainly, not so important/big FF. Here, in my country, Canikon are much, much widespread than Pentax and I would noticed such of issues on the specialized photoforum, whose member I am.

Last edited by ursamajor; 02-11-2011 at 10:01 PM.
02-11-2011, 09:55 PM   #149
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I think the Nikon D70 had a mass back focus issue. I could be wrong as I haven't checked my sources as of this writing. My sources being my own memory, of course.
02-11-2011, 10:21 PM   #150
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Yes, kenrockwell describes the problem here. But, let's see: "a tenth of a milimeter" back focus on D70, can you compare with fifty centimeter or more on Kr? Oops!

There was a problem in the first two of seven D70s I've used. The focus calibration was off by about a tenth of a millimeter (that's why I say teeny). This means that your images will not be focused on your subject, but instead on something somewhat behind your subject. Don't confuse this with the common mistake of having selected the wrong AF area or otherwise pointing the AF sensor to the side of your subject. Nikon of course will adjust this under warranty if it's a problem. With common f/3.5 and slower lenses it's not much of a problem, and at regular shooting apertures of f/8 or so its completely invisible. Some people incorrectly call this the "backfocus" problem.

Last edited by ursamajor; 02-11-2011 at 10:38 PM.
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