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01-07-2011, 05:05 PM   #16
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I have a K-r and I am very happy with it. It focuses just fine in daylight, twilight and fluorescent light. In tungsten light it tends to FF by a small amount which is insignificant when using f4 0r smaller apertures but is more troublesome at wider apertures. If the light is low enough for the focus assist light to come on then focus is spot on.

It has been suggested that with the latest firmware update and setting the WB manually to Tungsten this will improve accuracy. I have not had a problem as most of my domestic lighting is with modern low energy high efficiency bulbs which behave like fluorescent rather than tungsten and do not present a problem.

In summary, users of kit lenses are unlikely to have any problems in tungsten light but users of wide aperture lenses may. In all other circumstanses the K-r seems to lock focus quickly and accurately. It is also possible to apply a Fine Focus correction using the custom menu but this is a global stting that applies to all lenses unlike the K-7 and K-5 which allow individual settings for up to twenty lenses to be applied.

01-10-2011, 06:55 PM   #17
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I'm one who has reported the FF problem on another thread but, to put it in perspective, I've taken over 4000 shots in just over a month and have issues with only a handful of them. I tend to use spot focus to be precise about where I want the focus and the vast majority of the time it works. I love the camera, and when I'm out shooting handheld in low available light, the only others I see doing so are also Pentax shooters.
01-10-2011, 07:33 PM   #18
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This K-R focusing problem has me a bit worried. It's taken me a long time to save-up for my first DSLR (I'm on disability pension) - which I thought was going to be a K-X, but will now be a K-R.

As new lenses are extremely expensive here, and you only get a 12-month Warranty with Pentax or Sigma lenses (you can buy years of Warranty Extension, "at a price") - I was just going to get one with the camera when it's "package-dealed" (it isn't yet, March-April, the shop tells me), a Sigma 17-70mm as walk-around....

Will the K-R be able to properly focus this off-brand lens - or would it be better to get the cheap Pentax 18-55mm kit lens?

Can the K-R be "re-set" or "re-calibrated" by a camera-repair place, so the focusing works reliably with most lenses? I realise that'd be outside Warranty, as the makers would say there's nothing wrong with a new camera.

I intend to use Film-SLR M42 and K-mount lenses (having been studying up on that) - and already have some of each. However - while these are manual focus, will the K-R problems mean that these will be more difficult to use - or can one "override" the camera problem with full manual focus?

If it's really a "grab-bag" on whether you get a properly focusing K-R - would it be better to get a used K20D with 90-days Shop Warranty - for less than the K-R with 18-55mm kit lens costs here, which is AUD$889.00 (same as USD at present)...?

Dave.
01-11-2011, 12:46 AM   #19
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QuoteOriginally posted by Mystic Quote
hi, I'm in the need to buy a camera, since I sold my kx a few months ago, I was going to buy kr, but hesitated.. for observing so much of the focusing issues..
now, I'll have work assignment on saturday...

so if I buy kr is there at least any posibility, that it will focus perfectly, or all of them are not consistent in various light conditions?

I will check one, in the shop, but i'm afraid, that all of them are not consistent in focusing...


so am I wrong? (i hope I am)..

Do you have a Kr that focuses flawlessly in any light situation?
You are very naive in two ways:

1) to take the K-r frontfocus issue seriously and

2) to plan a work assignment with a brandnew camera.

I was able to provoke the FF issue ONLY at extreme low levels of tungsten light and ONLY when WB was set to AWB. We are talking light levels so low that some people may rather say near darkness. When WB was set to tungsten FF was gone.

cheers,
d

01-11-2011, 01:01 AM   #20
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QuoteOriginally posted by exwintech Quote
This K-R focusing problem has me a bit worried. It's taken me a long time to save-up for my first DSLR (I'm on disability pension) - which I thought was going to be a K-X, but will now be a K-R.

Will the K-R be able to properly focus this [Sigma 17-70mm] off-brand lens - or would it be better to get the cheap Pentax 18-55mm kit lens?
Dave,
I would strongly suggest to take the 18-55 kitlens, because it's really good for what it is. Decent kit lens, optically probably the best out there. You can still buy other lenses later.

QuoteQuote:
Can the K-R be "re-set" or "re-calibrated" by a camera-repair place, so the focusing works reliably with most lenses? I realise that'd be outside Warranty, as the makers would say there's nothing wrong with a new camera.
K-r can be custom calibrated by the user at any time, the only drawback is that it remembers just one lens at a time. It can be "fine-tuned" or as you say "re-calibrated" by the service team free of charge during the warranty period, this can be done only by a certified Pentax service. Outside the warranty period you will have to pay for it.

QuoteQuote:
I intend to use Film-SLR M42 and K-mount lenses (having been studying up on that) - and already have some of each. However - while these are manual focus, will the K-R problems mean that these will be more difficult to use - or can one "override" the camera problem with full manual focus?
Using manual focus lenses you might need a different matte/focusing screen with some contrast aid. Also it is important how good your eye vision is. Crop-format dSLR viewfinders with pentamirror are quite a bit smaller and darker from old days film SLR.

If you use AF-confirm with old lenses it is prone to all the hits & misses that occur when doin AF. But you can override it if you can see the sharpness.

QuoteQuote:
If it's really a "grab-bag" on whether you get a properly focusing K-R - would it be better to get a used K20D with 90-days Shop Warranty - for less than the K-R with 18-55mm kit lens costs here, which is AUD$889.00 (same as USD at present)...?
No way. K-r has a minor frontfocus issue ONLY at extremely low levels of tungsten light. We are talking light so low that you wouldn't expect a camera to work.

I have a K-20D and love it, but K-r beats it hands down at the focusing match. K-s is faster, more reliable and precise.

cheers,
d

Last edited by dragra; 01-11-2011 at 01:24 AM.
01-11-2011, 03:56 AM   #21
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Dragra - Thanks for taking the time to make those explanations - much appreciated.

I was a bit puzzled why a new Pentax would suddenly be "iffy", when the past ones have been so good....

The idea of getting the Sigma 17-70mm with the camera is that it would give me a "modern" fully-functioning lens as a multi-purpose walk-around. Yes, I know the Pentax one is f/4 constant and is a far better lens.... But the shop I deal with doesn't "package-offer" that one with entry-level cameras until after they've been out for a while... The 17-70 Sigma - already offered with the K-X here, will be later in the year.

The DA 17-70 is $725.00 over the counter, the Sigma is $339.00, which is probably why they bundle it. However, as now with the K-X, it's about $250.00.

On our local auction/sales site, you can get the kit Pentax 18-55mm for a lot less than $250.00, even. So saving $90.00 on the Sigma 17-70 seems to be the better deal. The reason for wanting it - I realise it's a "consumer" lens that the more advanced people wouldn't buy - is that it starts at f/2.8, and has a Macro function, which the Pentax 18-55mm doesn't, plus a little more reach.

I'm on disability pension (I'm 62) - which means that buying "anything" involves time and saving hard. So the idea of getting the Pentax 18-55mm with the camera - then just buying lots of other lenses later - isn't quite within budget.

(The only kit lenses bundled with the K-R here at present are the 18-55mm for $889.00 - and the 18-55mm + 50-200mm for $1,069.00.)

After getting the camera - my next saving-stint will be for an ED 55-300mm - said to be about the best quality-for-price to-300mm zoom around. We don't get the L-series 55-300mm here - in kit or over the counter - and the ED 55-300mm is $670.00. So I'll be looking on-Forum here for one not much over half that, though they're often restricted to "CONUS" only.

I have an as-new SMC Tak f/1.8 55mm, so that'll be my '55-prime', a couple of M42 Tamrons, a K-mount Sigma 28-80, unused (used to be a kit-lens, I think) - and a supposedly "dreadful" Sigma 100-300mm f/4.5-6.7 DL... It's also in unused condition (came with the 28-80, along with an MZ-50 body and an excellent bag I bought on Gumtree, all for $60.00) - and will have to be my "300mm" until I can afford the Pentax...

At least it IS a DSLR lens - so couldn't be much worse than my SX10 or HS10 at that equiv 450mm range... Or - could it....

Thanks again - I'm feeling happier and reasured, now...

Dave.
01-11-2011, 08:03 AM   #22
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Hi dave, welcome to the forums. It might be of help if you put your rough location in, as other may be able to help you a bit more regarding locating of the kit etc.

I don't own a pentax yet, like you I'm a Fuji superzoom owner (s100fs) looking to get a dslr. Having played with the K-r, and seen many shots from it, it really is impresive and especially in low light and for cropping, will knock the spots of the HS10. That said, the zoom reach of the HS10 is excellent and obviously you will need to carry at least 2 lenses around with you to equal that. (I dont know your disability, but dont forget the additional weight.)

I have a real bug about people slating the K-r for it's FF issue, because it worries people such as yourself looking to buy. Yes it does on some cameras exist in certain usually extreme conditions, but the top end Nikon has much the same problem, and other cams have their own issues. So I wouldn't worry your self about it, others on here have made it clear it's not normally a serious or even noticable issue in the greatest majority of cases. Have a look at some of the shots posted from the cam. They are stunning, especially from where you and I are coming from - and I consider my cam to be one of the finest bridge cams.

I cannot really comment on the lens except to say I not genuinely not heard a bad word about them they feel very solid and sturdy and again the proof is in the shots they take. (try the Sony a33/55, the kit lens is really cheap plastic that sort of grinds as you turn it...! urrgghh)

As someone who has struggled with work last year, then finds himself out of work on news years eve, (though I had a great interview this morning) i fully understand your worries about finances, but if I had the money (and when I get some), yep, I'd buy one tomorrow.

Woody
01-11-2011, 08:30 AM   #23
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QuoteOriginally posted by dragra Quote
If you use AF-confirm with old lenses it is prone to all the hits & misses that occur when doin AF. But you can override it if you can see the sharpness.
+1. A perfectly calibrated split screen will outperform the focus confirmation. I've learned to trust my split screen so that I don't even look at the focus confirmation dot because I know the split screen is more accurate.

01-11-2011, 12:36 PM   #24
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QuoteOriginally posted by exwintech Quote

On our local auction/sales site, you can get the kit Pentax 18-55mm for a lot less than $250.00 ... So the idea of getting the Pentax 18-55mm with the camera - then just buying lots of other lenses later - isn't quite within budget.
Dave,
when you get the DA L 18-55 in a set it comes really cheap, it's a steal! You cant't get it cheaper! Please compare prices of body only vs. body & DA L 18-55 kit.

QuoteQuote:
(The only kit lenses bundled with the K-R here at present are the 18-55mm for $889.00 - and the 18-55mm + 50-200mm for $1,069.00.)

After getting the camera - my next saving-stint will be for an ED 55-300mm - said to be about the best quality-for-price to-300mm zoom around. We don't get the L-series 55-300mm here - in kit or over the counter - and the ED 55-300mm is $670.00
50-200 is a fine lens and quite compact for that range. But the 55-300 is optically better. I know what I'm saying, because it's in my bag. I was surprised by the 55-300 because I did not expect such a excellent image quality at this price.

cheers,
d
01-11-2011, 02:43 PM   #25
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QuoteOriginally posted by exwintech Quote
Dragra - Thanks for taking the time to make those explanations - much appreciated.

I was a bit puzzled why a new Pentax would suddenly be "iffy", when the past ones have been so good....

The idea of getting the Sigma 17-70mm with the camera is that it would give me a "modern" fully-functioning lens as a multi-purpose walk-around. Yes, I know the Pentax one is f/4 constant and is a far better lens.... But the shop I deal with doesn't "package-offer" that one with entry-level cameras until after they've been out for a while... The 17-70 Sigma - already offered with the K-X here, will be later in the year.

The DA 17-70 is $725.00 over the counter, the Sigma is $339.00, which is probably why they bundle it. However, as now with the K-X, it's about $250.00.

On our local auction/sales site, you can get the kit Pentax 18-55mm for a lot less than $250.00, even. So saving $90.00 on the Sigma 17-70 seems to be the better deal. The reason for wanting it - I realise it's a "consumer" lens that the more advanced people wouldn't buy - is that it starts at f/2.8, and has a Macro function, which the Pentax 18-55mm doesn't, plus a little more reach.

I'm on disability pension (I'm 62) - which means that buying "anything" involves time and saving hard. So the idea of getting the Pentax 18-55mm with the camera - then just buying lots of other lenses later - isn't quite within budget.

(The only kit lenses bundled with the K-R here at present are the 18-55mm for $889.00 - and the 18-55mm + 50-200mm for $1,069.00.)

After getting the camera - my next saving-stint will be for an ED 55-300mm - said to be about the best quality-for-price to-300mm zoom around. We don't get the L-series 55-300mm here - in kit or over the counter - and the ED 55-300mm is $670.00. So I'll be looking on-Forum here for one not much over half that, though they're often restricted to "CONUS" only.

I have an as-new SMC Tak f/1.8 55mm, so that'll be my '55-prime', a couple of M42 Tamrons, a K-mount Sigma 28-80, unused (used to be a kit-lens, I think) - and a supposedly "dreadful" Sigma 100-300mm f/4.5-6.7 DL... It's also in unused condition (came with the 28-80, along with an MZ-50 body and an excellent bag I bought on Gumtree, all for $60.00) - and will have to be my "300mm" until I can afford the Pentax...

At least it IS a DSLR lens - so couldn't be much worse than my SX10 or HS10 at that equiv 450mm range... Or - could it....

Thanks again - I'm feeling happier and reasured, now...

Dave.
Have you considered our good friends eBay and Amazon?

Also, just to clarify, the DA L 18-55 is f3.5-5.6, not f4 constant.
01-11-2011, 07:09 PM   #26
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Bsamcash - I know the Pentax kit 18-55mm is f/3.5-5.6.... I said:

"The idea of getting the Sigma 17-70mm with the camera is that it would give me a "modern" fully-functioning lens as a multi-purpose walk-around. Yes, I know the Pentax one is f/4 constant and is a far better lens..." The reference is to the Pentax Lens DA 17-70mm f4AL(IF) SDM - which costs AUD$725.00 here.

The Sigma 17-70mm DC MAC is f/2.8-4.5, so has slightly better light ability, (than the kit 18-55mm) a bit more zoom, and 1:2 Macro - and as I can't afford a lot of new lenses, is more versatile than the 18-55 kit lens.

As for Ebay and Amazon - I don't have credit-cards - on a pension I have to save-up until I can afford things I want. Also - cameras and lenses from online like those places, don't have Australian Warranties. If they did, everyone here would buy at those extremely cheap US prices...


Dragra - I don't need to pay extra for the Pentax kit 50-200mm. I already have a Tamron 80-210mm M42, and a Sigma 100-300mm K-mount. Those cover the "50-200mm" range - and while they might be low-quality lenses, will "make-do" until the Pentax ED 55-300mm.

If those 2 lenses I have are "worse than" what the Fuji HS10 can do in JPEG / RAW at the same distance, I can use the Fuji in the meantime....


UKwoody - My location, including suburb, to within 1km, is in the left column beside all of my posts. To clarify, Croydon Park, Sydney, New South Wales, Australia.

My disabilities are diabetes, well in control, COPD, also well in control, and a limited left shoulder movement - can't raise left arm above head, for all other angles is okay.

I have a quite neat light rucksack with inner partitions and outer pockets. Quite comfy with 2 x P&S cameras, plenty of spare Eneloops, a Slik F740 tripod, wet-weather parka, lunch, and flask of cold drink... So can add a small K-R and a few lenses quite easily... I'm on public transport, but get around Sydney, and up and down the coast about 150km North and South, on a daily $2.50 all-modes pensioner ticket...

So long as I don't try to move too fast - I'm quite mobile and able to carry a pack.

As the K-R has about 15-times the sensor size - and 2Mpix more - and costs another $300.00 (plus lenses) over the Fuji HS10, I'd be somewhat peeved if its IQ didn't do more than just "knock the spots off" any darned Bridge-Zoom P&S....

The K-R doesn't have all the buttons and controls on the outside of the case like the HS10, but from the Reviews and K-R Manual - it seems that you can set it up for current conditions from the Menus, and have enough external controls to use.

The HS10 on Continuous does 13-7-5-3fps on JPEG only, 5-3fps on RAW, RAW+JPEG. The top Continuous is too fast to be usable for most things (13fps at 1/4000th - humming-bird wings, maybe...?) - so mostly use 7fps or 5fps - so the K-R's 6fps should feel 'familiar'.

While the HS10 sure has a steep learning-curve - and the usual odd "Fuji-foibles" - stick it on a tripod - use Manual and the quick-easy Manual Focus - don't use the "last 2x" of the zoom - that is, stop at about 28x - and it works rather better than one might expect from a 10Mpix 1/2.3" BSI-CMOS sensor.... I "luvvit" - certainly don't regret buying it!

Dave.
01-12-2011, 02:18 AM   #27
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QuoteOriginally posted by exwintech Quote
Bsamcash -
UKwoody - My location, including suburb, to within 1km, is in the left column beside all of my posts. To clarify, Croydon Park, Sydney, New South Wales, Australia.


Dave.
Hi Dave, yes sorry, when I looked yesterday your location wasn't showing, as I was trying to work out which Dollars you were referring too and why you couldn't get some of the deals. Obviously a glitch as it's there now
You're only a couple of hours (well I suppose more by bus) from my brother who lives in Kurri Kurri near Cessnock, towards newcastle. Never been there, hope to get there one day. Say Hi to him for me...
Didnt realise the frame rate of the hs10 was so fast. Must admit I do love my s100fs, and like you dont regret it, it's been a fab learning curve leading up to a dslr

woody
01-12-2011, 03:54 PM   #28
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UKwoody - Nice area, Kurri Kurri - farming, small-towns, laid-back, rural sort of region. The name is from local Aboriginal dialect - where repetition conveys more / bigger / plural, etc. Kurri means "first", so Kurri-Kurri is "first-first", "first-of-firsts", best, nicest, so on. It's a nice way of expressing concepts.

With the HS10, on first release, it had a lot of "Fuji-isms" - good ideas that don't quite make it in the production device.... At 1.00 firmware it had several faults - including slow "fast" Continuous, particularly in the claimed 5fps/3fps RAW, pretty awful Wide-end - between 24-28mm - distortion, and more.

Firmware 1.01 fixed the distortion and some of the other things, but didn't do much to the Continuous speeds... Also, the Auto-Focus at high zoom levels hunted like a Terrier on steroids...

So, as folk were returning HS10s for refunds at a "quite interesting" rate, according to a couple of Forums - Fuji must have severely-prodded their Firmware Dept... With Firmware 1.02 they went a bit berserk... The JPEG claimed 10fps-that-wasn't, went to - as Lab-Tested by some Review Sites - somewhere between 13.2 and 15.4 fps. Full-res - 10Mpix...

Which is just a wee-frac absurd... As it only Saves 7 images in JPEG (6 in RAW, 5 in RAW+JPEG) - anyway. Aim and shoot - ZZZZAP - the lot gone in about a half-second. Unless the target is moving VERY quickly - you have 7 frames just on identical.

Those DSLR folk who 'whinge' because their pride-and-joy "only" does 8-9-10fps - might try a device that does around 14fps. With the HS10 it does actually have a "use" - if not the intended one! If using AF handheld at high zoom - even with Shutter well above 1/125th (as the IS isn't too good at high zoom) - the AF still "gets the wanders" - if you fire 7 frames at that about 14fps - you stand a better chance of getting 1 or 2 in focus.

On a tripod use Manual Focus... Easy and accurate, much better. So teach yourself to use MF hand-held. To speed the (woeful) time between shots, use Manual Mode, hand-held. With the DSLR-style Command-Dial, that can work very well. And the allegedly DSLR-lens style Twist-Zoom is extremely fast - certainly doesn't need the "Re-Frame" button the Canon SX30 has.

There again - for Video - as the Canon has both MF and Exposure Adjust, and the HS10 has neither - but the Twist-Zoom is "Jerk-O-Matic" for Video - the HS10 is as woeful on hand-held Video as the SX30 is excellent.

All-in-all, the HS10 is capable of very good P&S images - but only after you learn the camera, avoid Auto and Program, and very firmly, "tell it what to do".

And - how many P&S cameras, while having a good Super-Macro, have a Std Macro that goes out to 5-metres / 16ft...? Why? Because the 30x lens doesn't like AF-ing under 4-metres or so. Close-in - use the Std Macro mode for "usual" shots.... Fuji-isms.....?

Dave.
01-12-2011, 11:42 PM   #29
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My K-r focuses accurately enough in non-Tungsten conditions. BUT, I only have done a semi-serious test in Tungsten light, using the 18-55 kit. I think it does FF, probably just a teeny-weeny bit.

For quite some time the Pentax Safox XIII has been criticized for the 'double-checking' focus (an urban legend as some claim, I don't know though). Safox IX does not seem to do that. Maybe it's absence causes the misfocus problem.

Maybe Pentax should bring that 'double-check' thingy, and apply it only if the detected aperture is 2.8 or wider, preferably in Tungsten light. Maybe it has been implemented in the latest firmware.
01-13-2011, 12:26 AM   #30
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QuoteOriginally posted by GrinMode Quote
My K-r focuses accurately enough in non-Tungsten conditions. BUT, I only have done a semi-serious test in Tungsten light, using the 18-55 kit. I think it does FF, probably just a teeny-weeny bit.

For quite some time the Pentax Safox XIII has been criticized for the 'double-checking' focus (an urban legend as some claim, I don't know though). Safox IX does not seem to do that. Maybe it's absence causes the misfocus problem.

Maybe Pentax should bring that 'double-check' thingy, and apply it only if the detected aperture is 2.8 or wider, preferably in Tungsten light. Maybe it has been implemented in the latest firmware.
Did you set WB to tungsten? I helps a lot.
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