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02-01-2011, 08:01 PM   #1
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mea culpa

Well, I was wrong about the FF issues under artificial light.

I did yet another series of test shots, this time from two meters (app) @ f/8. I guess I was working too close before, or setting it up wrong, or some damn thing but, in any case, as this image shows obvious FF (marked on print).

I apologize, at least for asserting all K-rs could not have the problem because mine didn't. Mine does, so I retract my comments,
Brian

02-01-2011, 08:10 PM   #2
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We forgive you.

Well, I do at least. ursamajor seems kinda crotchety though.
02-01-2011, 11:53 PM   #3
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I'm not at all "crotchety". But I know to support my point of view, when it is corect. I allready answered here.

QuoteOriginally posted by FHPhotographer Quote
I apologize, at least for asserting all K-rs could not have the problem because mine didn't. Mine does, so I retract my comments,
Brian
Paradoxically, I think it's good that all have problems, because it would be easier for Pentax to solve the issue, perhaps through a firmware update.

Last edited by ursamajor; 02-02-2011 at 12:33 AM.
02-02-2011, 08:37 AM   #4
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At first, I didn't think my K-R had the FF issue until I checked. I thought that I had used the wrong focus point, or I must have moved or something like that. But when I did a test, I found it wasn't me, the camera does front focus. If I use my K200D, I don't see it.

02-02-2011, 09:22 AM   #5
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I don't think we really know whether all or just some K-r's can FF in specific lighting conditions. Even if we're all testing with tungsten light there are many other variables that differ across our tests. If you can't replicate the issue, maybe your camera is actually better, or maybe you're shooting in conditions that are a tiny bit different.

I have the FF issue but only notice it testing within a narrow set of conditions (moderately bright tungsten, very close focus range). If I take real photos under similar conditions I need to change WB from auto to tungsten and all is good.

I hope to see a firmware fix from Pentax but my K-r's FF isn't a show stopper for me. Tungsten lighting is becoming very rare, anyway. I do not regret my K-r purchase.
02-02-2011, 09:35 AM   #6
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QuoteOriginally posted by DeadJohn Quote
If I take real photos under similar conditions I need to change WB from auto to tungsten and all is good.
Allow me to doubt it. It's a placebo. Just do a test with AF diagram from 1 or 2 metres and you'll see. That's exactly in real life pictures the camera has FF.
Look here.

QuoteOriginally posted by DeadJohn Quote
I have the FF issue but only notice it testing within a narrow set of conditions (moderately bright tungsten, very close focus range).
You can use not moderately, but high tungsten light, camera will front focuses.
Maybe I repeat myself, but why I have a camera with high ISO capabilities, if I cannot use it in low light conditions, even tungsten light?

Last edited by ursamajor; 02-02-2011 at 10:17 AM.
02-02-2011, 11:03 AM   #7
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QuoteOriginally posted by ursamajor Quote
but why I have a camera with high ISO capabilities, if I cannot use it in low light conditions, even tungsten light?
Exactly - I like my K200D for daylight - I wanted a low light (artificial light) camera to compliment the K200D. I skipped the K-X for the extra features of the K-R. Sorry, but this FF issue kinda bothers me.
02-02-2011, 05:42 PM   #8
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QuoteOriginally posted by ursamajor Quote
Allow me to doubt it. It's a placebo. Just do a test with AF diagram from 1 or 2 metres and you'll see. That's exactly in real life pictures the camera has FF.
Look here.

You can use not moderately, but high tungsten light, camera will front focuses.
Maybe I repeat myself, but why I have a camera with high ISO capabilities, if I cannot use it in low light conditions, even tungsten light?
I'm using a dimmable chandelier that holds 6 candelabra bulbs. It's the only tungsten left in my house. At full brightness the light is very bright, doesn't have much of a yellowish cast to it, and doesn't cause much FF. As I dim the light it becomes an ugly yellowish brown and I get more FF. After the light is so dim that the AF assist light comes on, focus improves.

So, for me, in the only tungsten light I have easy access to, I get FF in medium brightness. Very bright and very dark cause an ignorable amount of FF in the conditions I have access to.

I do not dispute that FF exists. Look at my earlier post and other threads where I said that all K-r's might have this FF issue under certain circumstances. If we all share more information about the conditions that cause FF we may learn more about how to deal with it. Ideally, Pentax will issue a firmware fix, but until maybe we can come up with a workaround that makes the problem less objectionable.

It's not a major problem for *my* *real life* conditions. WB = Tungsten gives me much better focus based on the one tungsten fixture in my house. That may or may not work well for others depending on the exact light bulbs, room color, variances in different cameras, etc.

02-03-2011, 01:39 AM   #9
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QuoteOriginally posted by ursamajor Quote
Allow me to doubt it. It's a placebo. ...[/URL]

?
For my camera, it is NOT a placebo...
02-03-2011, 01:54 AM   #10
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OK, be happy...
02-03-2011, 02:04 AM   #11
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Guys, I just talked to the Pentax representative in Bulgaria. He told me that Pentax Germany are aware of the FF issue in tungsten light and Pentax is working on a new firmware for K-R!!! Hurray!!
02-03-2011, 02:44 AM   #12
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Indeed? On dpreview forum some users annouced Pentax about FF long time ago. They've been working since december, but 1.01 firmware didn't solve the issue, as was expected. Lets just hope they'll do it soon...
02-03-2011, 04:23 AM   #13
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QuoteOriginally posted by ursamajor Quote
Indeed? On dpreview forum some users annouced Pentax about FF long time ago. They've been working since december, but 1.01 firmware didn't solve the issue, as was expected. Lets just hope they'll do it soon...
Yes, I read those posts on dpreview, however, now I heard it myself ))
02-03-2011, 02:46 PM   #14
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QuoteOriginally posted by ursamajor Quote
Indeed? On dpreview forum some users annouced Pentax about FF long time ago. They've been working since december, but 1.01 firmware didn't solve the issue, as was expected. Lets just hope they'll do it soon...
Did 1.01 even try to fix it? There was no indication of an effort made in any offical docs about the update.

I'm not holding my breath for a solution to the Fr.F fault, I think the best we can hope for is a positive improvement toward lessening its glaring presence in all but worst-case lighting.

Something that could satisfy most people's basic needs might do. It isn't a wannabe-Pro market camera after all so pressures and obligations on Pentax for perfection wouldn't be great - esp when they can see there's a lot of fanboi/apologists (like on here) who buy on Brand only, don't have half a clue, and want to hide from or defend against every issue their pet toy camera might have.

.R.
02-04-2011, 06:07 AM   #15
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Hello, first time poster, so apologies if I break any unspoken rules around here.

I bought a K-r about a week ago, largely on the strength of Pentax primes and the high ISO capabilities (I had an SLR years ago, but have been happy with a Ricoh GX100 over the past few years).

I noticed a fair bit of softness on some of the indoor shots I took with the K-r over the first couple of days and, over the past two nights, I ran a few (basic) tests under tungsten conditions (various WB settings, focal lengths, distances, ISO, etc) to see whether there is FF on AF, which there undoubtedly is. The difference between AF and LV is so marked, it makes me wonder about the camera's AF abilities under any condition, to be honest (i'll play with it in other conditions this weekend).

I am debating as to whether to bring the camera back to the store to see if they'll replace it (and whether a different K-r has the same issues) or whether I need to contact Pentax directly? I am loathe to have to spend any money on shipping the camera to the UK repair centre though given I've had it for a week. Or do I just wait to see whether Pentax does anything with a firmware update?

Any thoughts/advice appreciated.
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