Forgot Password
Pentax Camera Forums Home
 

Reply
Show Printable Version Search this Thread
04-14-2012, 03:41 PM   #1
Junior Member




Join Date: Nov 2011
Posts: 41
Amateur question about shooting indoors

I've had my KR for about 6 months and have been learning alot from reading this forum and experimenting with the camera. I seem to take pretty decent shots outside at all ranges, indoors with a flash but I still have a problem with one arena. My daughter's auditorium at school. I can't seem to get a sharp shot of anything up on the stage with the 55-300. It all comes out fuzzy. I tried different white balance modes (the lights are tungsten) and still no dice. Is it maybe that zooms just aren't that good indoors without a tripod? Any advice would be appreciated...



04-14-2012, 04:23 PM - 1 Like   #2
Senior Member
Tom Woj's Avatar

Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: Stafford, UK
Photos: Gallery | Albums
Posts: 163
It's all because of your shutter speed.

The shutter speed is how fast the shutter opens and closes, the slower it is, the more blur you will get. This is even more apparant when the focal length increases. The reason you have no problems with flash or outdoor shooting is because theres enough light getting to the camera - so your shutter speed will be higher.

That picture was shot at 800 iso, 55 mm, 1/15 second shutter speed. Theres your problem, 1/15 is too slow. You want at least 1/(focal length) to get rid of shake from your hands, and then maybe even further still if your subject is moving faster. So for example at 55mm you want 1/60 odd, and at 300mm you'll be wanting closer to 1/300. The built in shake-reduction will let you go a bit slower than this rule, by how much depends on how steady you are with your hands.

Either grab a faster lens, or up the ISO untill you get a fast enough shutter speed to get rid of the blur. Try Tv (shutter priority) mode with a fast shutter speed next time, but just be aware the higher the ISO, the more noise you will get.

A tripod could help, but not that much. The 55-300 isn't all that heavy, so you should be fine hand holding it. If you are having issues, just try and brace your arms and have the camera right up against your face to minimize any shake, or brace yourself against a wall/whatever is around.

Last edited by Tom Woj; 04-14-2012 at 04:31 PM.
04-14-2012, 04:50 PM   #3
Site Supporter
jatrax's Avatar

Join Date: May 2010
Location: Oregon
Photos: Gallery | Albums
Posts: 10,288
As noted 1/15th is just too slow. In the image above you have two different types of blur. First and most general is camera shake caused by the shutter speed being too low, you can fix this with a tripod and remote release. The second type is subject motion, notice in particular the third face from the right. She turned while the shutter was open. You cannot fix this with a tripod, the tripod only makes the camera steady not your subject. The only way to fix subject blur is with a faster shutter speed. In some situations you can pan with the shot (horses, cars) but that does not pertain here.

And the only way to increase the shutter speed, (after the lens is wide open) is to increase the ISO or increase the amount of light available. So, either high ISO and post process with noise reduction software or use a flash.
04-14-2012, 05:11 PM   #4
Senior Member
jase036's Avatar

Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Calgary, Alberta
Photos: Gallery
Posts: 170
Indeed as Tom pointed out your shutter speed is too slow for your focal length and also taking into account the kids are moving around. Your speed of 1/15 even with shake reduction won't be able to neutralize camera movement and no matter how good shake reduction is, it will never compensate for subject movement.

I also notice the aperture for this image was f/4 meaning that you were pretty much at max aperture for that lens.
Your only option would be to raise the ISO; so from 1/15 to 1/60 (which would be a good speed for the 55mm focal length as long as the subject isn't moving much) is 2 stops less worth of light, which means you would have to raise the ISO by 2 stops which means going from ISO 800 to 3200. The good thing is that the K-r is a pretty solid high ISO performer, so with a little noise reduction you should get perfectly useable images at 3200 ISO.

However, if you plan to use the lens at longer focal lengths or if the kids are moving much you will need even faster shutter speeds and therefore higher ISO settings, and also the 55-300 is a variable aperture lens which means changing the focal distance also means the max aperture changes (you are effectively getting smaller apertures as you zoom) meaning even higher ISO to compensate the smaller aperture.

Your options in those cases would be to use a flash gun with a high guide number or get a lens with a larger max aperture like 2.8 or faster.

04-14-2012, 05:41 PM   #5
Pentaxian




Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Southern California
Photos: Gallery | Albums
Posts: 3,181
As others have mentioned, noise can be largely fixed, but not blur (there's software that helps fix blur, such as Focus Magic, but it only works well sometimes).

Therefore you're better off trying even ISO 5000 or 6400, it that's what it takes to eliminate most of the blur.

And if you're not already shooting near wide-open, keep the aperture within about 1/3 or 2/3 stops from the (numerically) smallest aperture, according to which gives you the best image quality.



If after this you're still not getting the results you want, then you know one of the reasons why people spend so much money on an f/2.8 zoom (such as the DA*50-135) or will even forgo zoom for an f/1.8 prime (such as the FA77 Ltd).

The good news for you is that the K-r is almost as good as the K-5 here, so changing cameras will not help you, whereas a monopod or a new lens will.
04-14-2012, 08:55 PM   #6
Junior Member




Join Date: Nov 2011
Posts: 41
Original Poster
Thank you all...I will use this advice!

BTW...how did you get the info off this picture? I didn't know you can do that with a web photo.
04-14-2012, 09:12 PM - 1 Like   #7
Senior Member
Tom Woj's Avatar

Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: Stafford, UK
Photos: Gallery | Albums
Posts: 163
QuoteOriginally posted by emulsify Quote
BTW...how did you get the info off this picture?
Theres a few ways, most image editing apps can show exif data. You can also save the .jpg somewhere and, (for windows at least) right click -> properties -> details tab.

Recently I've been using a chrome plugin to do it though. You can just right click on the image in chrome -> show EXIF, and it'll open up a tab on the right with all the info, PLUS a histogram!

https://chrome.google.com/webstore/detail/lplmljfembbkocngnlkkdgabpnfokmnl
04-14-2012, 09:49 PM   #8
Senior Member
cscurrier's Avatar

Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: Bellingham, WA
Photos: Gallery
Posts: 278
QuoteOriginally posted by Tom Woj Quote
Recently I've been using a chrome plugin to do it though. You can just right click on the image in chrome -> show EXIF, and it'll open up a tab on the right with all the info, PLUS a histogram!
Whoa!!! This is awesome! Thanks for the tip about the plugin.

04-15-2012, 04:50 AM   #9
Veteran Member
Philoslothical's Avatar

Join Date: May 2011
Posts: 1,723
There are equivalent addons for Firefox, too. This is the one I use: EXIF Viewer
04-15-2012, 08:42 AM   #10
New Member




Join Date: Apr 2012
Posts: 8
wow that's a lot of good information, had similar situation earlier this thread really helped what to do next time and Tom Woj the chrome plugin rocks I just tried simple and effective.

Thanks guys have a wonderful day!!
LL
04-15-2012, 09:36 AM   #11
Junior Member




Join Date: Nov 2011
Posts: 41
Original Poster
I knew I got the right camera and the right forum!
04-15-2012, 06:15 PM - 1 Like   #12
New Member




Join Date: Apr 2012
Posts: 21
just remember that k-r actually is 1.5 crop.

So, the rule of thumb that your shutter speed should be 1/(focal_length) is a bit different as your focal length as marked on the lens is really 1.5 times that. Your 300mm is really 450mm, thus your shutter speed should be 1/450 or quicker.

edit: some people have got hands made out of stone, so it does vary. i think the more you will shoot, the more you'll see what shutter speed you're comfortable with to get sharp pics. for me it's usually 1/2 the shutter speed everyone else needs as i'm constantly high on coffee (handshakkkkkes).

Another thing to consider is the movement of the subject. The quicker they move, the quicker the shutter.
04-15-2012, 07:55 PM   #13
Junior Member




Join Date: Nov 2011
Posts: 41
Original Poster
Thanks again!
04-16-2012, 09:18 AM   #14
Senior Member
Tom Woj's Avatar

Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: Stafford, UK
Photos: Gallery | Albums
Posts: 163
QuoteOriginally posted by lonoise Quote
So, the rule of thumb that your shutter speed should be 1/(focal_length) is a bit different as your focal length as marked on the lens is really 1.5 times that. Your 300mm is really 450mm, thus your shutter speed should be 1/450 or quicker.
Mmmmm, hate to say it but that aint exactly true.

Yes the K-r is crop, but the focal length between 35mm -> crop will not change. It's just the way camera manufacturers have decided to explain it. It's the same focal length, all that's happened is you've chopped off a bit of the edge from a 35mm film, which gives the impression that you've zoomed in, but you really haven't. But anywho theres lot of threads about it, and people tend to get really confused about.

Heres a quick image I nabbed from google to show it. The image in the red (crop) is the same image and same focal length as the green one, the border has just been...cropped...

04-17-2012, 12:04 AM   #15
New Member




Join Date: Apr 2012
Posts: 21
QuoteOriginally posted by Tom Woj Quote
Mmmmm, hate to say it but that aint exactly true.

Yes the K-r is crop, but the focal length between 35mm -> crop will not change. It's just the way camera manufacturers have decided to explain it. It's the same focal length, all that's happened is you've chopped off a bit of the edge from a 35mm film, which gives the impression that you've zoomed in, but you really haven't. But anywho theres lot of threads about it, and people tend to get really confused about.

Heres a quick image I nabbed from google to show it. The image in the red (crop) is the same image and same focal length as the green one, the border has just been...cropped...
Ahh... you learn something new every day =) thank you

So, for the sake of example... 50mm gives you FOV of a 75mm lens on a FF camera but the focal length is still 50?
Reply

Bookmarks
  • Submit Thread to Facebook Facebook
  • Submit Thread to Twitter Twitter
  • Submit Thread to Digg Digg
Tags - Make this thread easier to find by adding keywords to it!
camera, indoors, k-r, kr, pentax k-r
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Interval Shooting question(s) Trig Pentax K-5 13 02-24-2012 09:23 AM
Shooting Basketball indoors dndcdr Photographic Industry and Professionals 10 11-13-2011 04:30 PM
Amateur lighting question brandonbpm Flashes, Lighting, and Studio 14 09-10-2011 08:06 AM
shooting indoors TONITE! HELP! dcmsox2004 Photographic Technique 2 01-23-2010 12:25 PM
Shooting Indoors Yesterday R.Miller Post Your Photos! 6 02-20-2007 03:09 PM



All times are GMT -7. The time now is 12:04 AM. | See also: NikonForums.com, part of our network of photo forums!
  • Red (Default)
  • Green
  • Gray
  • Dark
  • Dark Yellow
  • Dark Blue
  • Old Red
  • Old Green
  • Old Gray
  • Dial-Up Style
Hello! It's great to see you back on the forum! Have you considered joining the community?
register
Creating a FREE ACCOUNT takes under a minute, removes ads, and lets you post! [Dismiss]
Top