Macro by any means necessary club

Damian · 05-09-2011, 08:21 AM

Thanks for starting the thread Tanner, I must say your work is extraordinary. I did some very basic extension tube work Friday night when my 3rd P.O.S. teleconverter arrived and I converted it to an extension tube. Now I have 75mm of fully automatic extension (without AF, as that is useless for this anyway) and have begun seeing what it can do. I even added additional extension and magnification via a Vivitar Macro Focusing teleconverter. Thus far I can say the TC really takes a toll on IQ when used in conjunction with all that extension. I'll try to get some shots up later this week, but life is extremely hectic for me right now so it may take same time before I can get to the PP of what I shot Friday night. Anyway, I look forward to contributing to the new thread.

**dadipentak** · 05-09-2011, 09:39 AM

Originally posted by yeatzee

Believe me, i've been down that road...

jstevewhite · 05-09-2011, 04:18 PM

Originally posted by newarts

I hope it is appropriate to discuss technique/theory rather than posting photos here.

What you say about reversed stacked lenses being better than either lens by itself makes good sense in theory I think.

There is a trade-off with each piece of glass added, and it's one of the underlying conundrums of lens design. Each element allows us to create a more highly corrected image, but each element also reduces contrast - actually, each refractive transition does. it's a min-max in lens design. Of course, different glass formulations change the dispersion and diffraction that occurs, as do coatings, so the goal is to make a dispersion-less refractive element that allows increased correction without increasing dispersion

yeatzee · 05-09-2011, 04:28 PM

I forgot to add, I cut a hole in the middle of a lens cap to stop flair for all of my reversed setups

**crewl1** · 05-11-2011, 10:07 AM

Thanks for setting up this thread, looking forward to seeing what is possible and how to achieve it.
Here is what I have been playing around with most recently.
I am just starting out attempting macro so I'm sure this setup will see many changes in the future.
This is a K-x with a gutted 2x converter, full series of extension tubes, a Promaster/Cosina 100mm macro lens, with a nylon diffuser at the end.

aliasant · 05-11-2011, 02:47 PM

Today I took a 2xTC with PK/A mounts apart.
I took out all the glass so that I can use it as a 50mm tube with electrical contacts.
It works very well.

First I placed this new tube before ( closest to the camera mount) my Kiron 105mm f2.8 and the Tokina AT-X Macro Extender (TME) that I have been using.

That didnt quite work as well as I had hoped. I think that the TME is ment to be closest to the filmplane. Using a tube infront of it made the image soft and a bit strange.

I swapped the tube and the TME and voila. I got somewere around 3:1 with PK/A all the way.
Shooting with this was really hard. This shot is handheld with flash and not fully zoomed in but cropped and finally scaled down a lot. Also some PP to sharpen it up a bit.
Distance from tip of the lens to subject when fully zoomed in is about 6 cm.

Im not sure going 3:1 when shooting bugs like this is the best idea. When I zoom out fully I get slightly less then 1:1 at about 20cm distance but often I need even less.
I would prefer having a range from 1:2 to 3:1 but Im not sure thats possible

jstevewhite · 05-11-2011, 02:54 PM

Originally posted by crewl1

Thanks for setting up this thread, looking forward to seeing what is possible and how to achieve it.
Here is what I have been playing around with most recently.
I am just starting out attempting macro so I'm sure this setup will see many changes in the future.
This is a K-x with a gutted 2x converter, full series of extension tubes, a Promaster/Cosina 100mm macro lens, with a nylon diffuser at the end.

I love that diffuser. Where did you get it?

**crewl1** · 05-11-2011, 03:18 PM

Originally posted by jstevewhite

I love that diffuser. Where did you get it?

Cowboy Studio CowboyStudio Photography Lighting | Studio Equipment | Studio Accessories

(May be available on ebay as well.)

It's spring loaded like those larger diffuser screens so twists down into a small zipper pack.

Works pretty good since you can push it way out to the end of the lens and can be used with external flash also.

http://youtu.be/Vuqfs3MxiDU

jstevewhite · 05-11-2011, 03:31 PM

Originally posted by crewl1

Cowboy Studio CowboyStudio Photography Lighting | Studio Equipment | Studio Accessories

(May be available on ebay as well.)

It's spring loaded like those larger diffuser screens so twists down into a small zipper pack.

Works pretty good since you can push it way out to the end of the lens and can be used with external flash also.

YouTube - Flash diffusers (Part 3): Mini panel & flash cap for Canon, Nikon flash - CowboyStudio.com

Thanks! Found something just like it on Amazon; it'll be here Friday

**crewl1** · 05-11-2011, 03:33 PM

Cool. Looking forward to some shots with it, and the rest of your setup.

**crewl1** · 05-11-2011, 03:37 PM

Originally posted by aliasant

Im not sure going 3:1 when shooting bugs like this is the best idea. When I zoom out fully I get slightly less then 1:1 at about 20cm distance but often I need even less.
I would prefer having a range from 1:2 to 3:1 but Im not sure thats possible

Nice shot. Sounds like you are wishing for a macro superzoom

Show us your setup?

jstevewhite · 05-11-2011, 03:45 PM

Originally posted by crewl1

Cool. Looking forward to some shots with it, and the rest of your setup.

I think I'm going to try my 35 f2 reversed on the Schneider D-Xenon ( Samsung version of the non-WR 100mm f2.8 macro ) next. If anything cools comes out of it, I'll post.

Here's an example shot with a prior flash kit - I bought some fiber optic cable and made a light conduit that went from Metz to a diffuser near the lens. It was shot using an ancient 100mm f4 macro. The fiber optic worked, but was too bulky, and I went back to the big lumiquest diffuser on my Metz. I can't wait to try this rig out. Thinking about making a foil-lined cardboard tube to get the built-in flash closer to the diffuser.

**crewl1** · 05-11-2011, 03:49 PM

I would be interested to hear the distance from tip of lens to bug with everyone's setups.

On the shot of the grub above I had a working distance about 7 inches (lens is retracted.)

In the closest focus setting, full extension on the Promaster and this combination of tubes the working distance is 5.5 inches.

This is very comfortable distance for me, especially with spiders as I'd rather not get too close

**crewl1** · 05-11-2011, 03:55 PM

@jstevewhite: Nice depth of field on that fly shot with the 'ancient 100mm f4 macro.'

One of the reason's I don't use the 1:1 adapter on the Promaster is that it cuts depth of field dramatically.

Someday I will try stacking, just baby steps for me now.

jstevewhite · 05-11-2011, 04:00 PM

Originally posted by crewl1

@jstevewhite: Nice depth of field on that fly shot with the 'ancient 100mm f4 macro.'

One of the reason's I don't use the 1:1 adapter on the Promaster is that it cuts depth of field dramatically.

Someday I will try stacking, just baby steps for me now.

I was actually just looking at that and wondering how I got that much DOF. I'm sure it was just f11 and be there. LOL.

That was a Pentax-M 100mm f4 Macro that I paid something like $80 for on eek-bay, and was surprised when it sold on eek-bay for $245 two years later. I sometimes wish I hadn't sold it; the newer 100mm 2.8 is not noticeably sharper; it's a better "all purpose 100", but I think the old Pentax M might have been a better *macro* lens.

05-11-2011, 02:47 PM	#21
aliasant Veteran Member Join Date: Feb 2010 Location: Stockholm Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 634	Today I took a 2xTC with PK/A mounts apart. I took out all the glass so that I can use it as a 50mm tube with electrical contacts. It works very well. First I placed this new tube before ( closest to the camera mount) my Kiron 105mm f2.8 and the Tokina AT-X Macro Extender (TME) that I have been using. That didnt quite work as well as I had hoped. I think that the TME is ment to be closest to the filmplane. Using a tube infront of it made the image soft and a bit strange. I swapped the tube and the TME and voila. I got somewere around 3:1 with PK/A all the way. Shooting with this was really hard. This shot is handheld with flash and not fully zoomed in but cropped and finally scaled down a lot. Also some PP to sharpen it up a bit. Distance from tip of the lens to subject when fully zoomed in is about 6 cm. Im not sure going 3:1 when shooting bugs like this is the best idea. When I zoom out fully I get slightly less then 1:1 at about 20cm distance but often I need even less. I would prefer having a range from 1:2 to 3:1 but Im not sure thats possible Last edited by aliasant; 05-12-2011 at 02:23 AM. Reason: Changed the picture. First version was quite bad..... :)

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05-09-2011, 08:21 AM	#16
Damian Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2010 Location: United States Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 278	Thanks for starting the thread Tanner, I must say your work is extraordinary. I did some very basic extension tube work Friday night when my 3rd P.O.S. teleconverter arrived and I converted it to an extension tube. Now I have 75mm of fully automatic extension (without AF, as that is useless for this anyway) and have begun seeing what it can do. I even added additional extension and magnification via a Vivitar Macro Focusing teleconverter. Thus far I can say the TC really takes a toll on IQ when used in conjunction with all that extension. I'll try to get some shots up later this week, but life is extremely hectic for me right now so it may take same time before I can get to the PP of what I shot Friday night. Anyway, I look forward to contributing to the new thread.

05-09-2011, 09:39 AM	#17
dadipentak Site Supporter Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: Baltimore, Maryland Photos: Gallery Posts: 11,590	Originally posted by yeatzee Believe me, i've been down that road...

05-09-2011, 04:18 PM	#18
jstevewhite Veteran Member Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Midwest Photos: Gallery Posts: 1,407	Originally posted by newarts I hope it is appropriate to discuss technique/theory rather than posting photos here. What you say about reversed stacked lenses being better than either lens by itself makes good sense in theory I think. There is a trade-off with each piece of glass added, and it's one of the underlying conundrums of lens design. Each element allows us to create a more highly corrected image, but each element also reduces contrast - actually, each refractive transition does. it's a min-max in lens design. Of course, different glass formulations change the dispersion and diffraction that occurs, as do coatings, so the goal is to make a dispersion-less refractive element that allows increased correction without increasing dispersion

05-09-2011, 04:28 PM	#19
yeatzee Veteran Member Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Temecula Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 3,675 Original Poster	I forgot to add, I cut a hole in the middle of a lens cap to stop flair for all of my reversed setups

05-11-2011, 10:07 AM	#20
crewl1 Site Supporter Join Date: Jul 2010 Location: Los Angeles, CA Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 9,807	Thanks for setting up this thread, looking forward to seeing what is possible and how to achieve it. Here is what I have been playing around with most recently. I am just starting out attempting macro so I'm sure this setup will see many changes in the future. This is a K-x with a gutted 2x converter, full series of extension tubes, a Promaster/Cosina 100mm macro lens, with a nylon diffuser at the end.

05-11-2011, 02:54 PM	#22
jstevewhite Veteran Member Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Midwest Photos: Gallery Posts: 1,407	Originally posted by crewl1 Thanks for setting up this thread, looking forward to seeing what is possible and how to achieve it. Here is what I have been playing around with most recently. I am just starting out attempting macro so I'm sure this setup will see many changes in the future. This is a K-x with a gutted 2x converter, full series of extension tubes, a Promaster/Cosina 100mm macro lens, with a nylon diffuser at the end. I love that diffuser. Where did you get it?

05-11-2011, 03:18 PM	#23
crewl1 Site Supporter Join Date: Jul 2010 Location: Los Angeles, CA Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 9,807	Originally posted by jstevewhite I love that diffuser. Where did you get it? Cowboy Studio CowboyStudio Photography Lighting \| Studio Equipment \| Studio Accessories (May be available on ebay as well.) It's spring loaded like those larger diffuser screens so twists down into a small zipper pack. Works pretty good since you can push it way out to the end of the lens and can be used with external flash also. http://youtu.be/Vuqfs3MxiDU

05-11-2011, 03:31 PM	#24
jstevewhite Veteran Member Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Midwest Photos: Gallery Posts: 1,407	Originally posted by crewl1 Cowboy Studio CowboyStudio Photography Lighting \| Studio Equipment \| Studio Accessories (May be available on ebay as well.) It's spring loaded like those larger diffuser screens so twists down into a small zipper pack. Works pretty good since you can push it way out to the end of the lens and can be used with external flash also. YouTube - Flash diffusers (Part 3): Mini panel & flash cap for Canon, Nikon flash - CowboyStudio.com Thanks! Found something just like it on Amazon; it'll be here Friday

05-11-2011, 03:33 PM	#25
crewl1 Site Supporter Join Date: Jul 2010 Location: Los Angeles, CA Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 9,807	Cool. Looking forward to some shots with it, and the rest of your setup.

05-11-2011, 03:37 PM	#26
crewl1 Site Supporter Join Date: Jul 2010 Location: Los Angeles, CA Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 9,807	Originally posted by aliasant Im not sure going 3:1 when shooting bugs like this is the best idea. When I zoom out fully I get slightly less then 1:1 at about 20cm distance but often I need even less. I would prefer having a range from 1:2 to 3:1 but Im not sure thats possible Nice shot. Sounds like you are wishing for a macro superzoom Show us your setup?

05-11-2011, 03:45 PM	#27
jstevewhite Veteran Member Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Midwest Photos: Gallery Posts: 1,407	Originally posted by crewl1 Cool. Looking forward to some shots with it, and the rest of your setup. I think I'm going to try my 35 f2 reversed on the Schneider D-Xenon ( Samsung version of the non-WR 100mm f2.8 macro ) next. If anything cools comes out of it, I'll post. Here's an example shot with a prior flash kit - I bought some fiber optic cable and made a light conduit that went from Metz to a diffuser near the lens. It was shot using an ancient 100mm f4 macro. The fiber optic worked, but was too bulky, and I went back to the big lumiquest diffuser on my Metz. I can't wait to try this rig out. Thinking about making a foil-lined cardboard tube to get the built-in flash closer to the diffuser.

05-11-2011, 03:49 PM	#28
crewl1 Site Supporter Join Date: Jul 2010 Location: Los Angeles, CA Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 9,807	I would be interested to hear the distance from tip of lens to bug with everyone's setups. On the shot of the grub above I had a working distance about 7 inches (lens is retracted.) In the closest focus setting, full extension on the Promaster and this combination of tubes the working distance is 5.5 inches. This is very comfortable distance for me, especially with spiders as I'd rather not get too close

05-11-2011, 03:55 PM	#29
crewl1 Site Supporter Join Date: Jul 2010 Location: Los Angeles, CA Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 9,807	@jstevewhite: Nice depth of field on that fly shot with the 'ancient 100mm f4 macro.' One of the reason's I don't use the 1:1 adapter on the Promaster is that it cuts depth of field dramatically. Someday I will try stacking, just baby steps for me now.

05-11-2011, 04:00 PM	#30
jstevewhite Veteran Member Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Midwest Photos: Gallery Posts: 1,407	Originally posted by crewl1 @jstevewhite: Nice depth of field on that fly shot with the 'ancient 100mm f4 macro.' One of the reason's I don't use the 1:1 adapter on the Promaster is that it cuts depth of field dramatically. Someday I will try stacking, just baby steps for me now. I was actually just looking at that and wondering how I got that much DOF. I'm sure it was just f11 and be there. LOL. That was a Pentax-M 100mm f4 Macro that I paid something like $80 for on eek-bay, and was surprised when it sold on eek-bay for $245 two years later. I sometimes wish I hadn't sold it; the newer 100mm 2.8 is not noticeably sharper; it's a better "all purpose 100", but I think the old Pentax M might have been a better macro lens.