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12-05-2018, 11:50 AM   #15961
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QuoteOriginally posted by paulh Quote
Nice work Dave - you did a great job processing to get the look you wanted!

Thanks Paul. It's a much more processed shot than I usually do, but in this case I had to shoot the raw file that way to get the B&W end result that I had in mind. Normally I just set white and black points and auto contrast then sharpen slightly. I'm starting to feel a bit nervous now that people might think my photos are all heavily processed when they usually aren't.


Last edited by Dartmoor Dave; 12-05-2018 at 11:57 AM.
12-05-2018, 10:31 PM   #15962
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QuoteOriginally posted by Dartmoor Dave Quote
I wouldn't normally show an unedited shot, but if it's any help here's the unprocessed original. I shot it with B&W and defishing in mind all along and defished as the first step in the editing process, so the completely unprocessed version is all I can show you without doing it all over again un-defished. I shot it this dark deliberately to get the sky how I wanted it, as a single handheld exposure because I hate faffing around with a tripod.


You did make a major transformation, and nicely. The reason I asked was because I wanted to see an image showing the projection effect because I have not seen that lens used for an image which would give a clear idea of the projection.


It had been in my mind for years what that lens would look like on APS-C when designed for FF.
12-05-2018, 10:33 PM - 1 Like   #15963
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QuoteOriginally posted by Dartmoor Dave Quote
Thanks Paul. It's a much more processed shot than I usually do, but in this case I had to shoot the raw file that way to get the B&W end result that I had in mind. Normally I just set white and black points and auto contrast then sharpen slightly. I'm starting to feel a bit nervous now that people might think my photos are all heavily processed when they usually aren't.


Sorry about that. I find most of your photos look to be lightly processed, they have a sense of natural to them.
12-06-2018, 01:56 AM   #15964
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Doing those church shots has definitely made me realise that my focusing screen has become tilted. I rarely take a photo with any strong verticals in it, or even a flat horizon, so I just hadn't noticed how far out of true my focusing screen was. Through the viewfinder the church looked exactly vertical against the markings on the focusing screen. I think a bit of careful tweaking might be in order.

12-06-2018, 05:36 AM   #15965
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I noticed that. Reminded me of my visit to the dentist on Saturday. He took an Xray and compared it to the Xray 18 months ago when I had more teeth. He drew attention to bone and tooth features. Straight away I saw a difference in angles between some features. Surprised the dentist, and I answered that I am an engineer, but more likely I saw it because I am a photographer.


How is the weather where you are? Where I am there is fairly thin cloud, leading to some quite wan sunlight shining through and vary slight air disturbance, too little to name breeze.
12-06-2018, 05:51 AM   #15966
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QuoteOriginally posted by tim60 Quote
How is the weather where you are? Where I am there is fairly thin cloud, leading to some quite wan sunlight shining through and vary slight air disturbance, too little to name breeze.

It's another day of December gloom here, one of those where it never really gets light. But the rain has stopped after some torrential outbursts over the past few days, and it's misty higher up on the moor, so perhaps I'll get outside later on for a walk and some moody snaps.
12-06-2018, 02:37 PM   #15967
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QuoteOriginally posted by Dartmoor Dave Quote
Doing those church shots has definitely made me realise that my focusing screen has become tilted. I rarely take a photo with any strong verticals in it, or even a flat horizon, so I just hadn't noticed how far out of true my focusing screen was. Through the viewfinder the church looked exactly vertical against the markings on the focusing screen. I think a bit of careful tweaking might be in order.
Dave, it might not be your focusing screen that is tilted. With my K10D I was having a problem with tilted horizons and after doing much testing with a spirit level and a known level subject (metal window sill) and a level camera on a tripod with a levelling base I found that the sensor in the camera is tilted. Further investigation revealed that it is a known problem with some K10Ds. As it was way out of warranty by the time I found the problem I just live with it and fix it in post.
So, my advice is to test first to determine just where the problem is.

Last edited by rayallen; 12-06-2018 at 04:52 PM. Reason: Typo.
12-06-2018, 02:48 PM   #15968
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QuoteOriginally posted by rayallen Quote
Further investigation revealed that it is a know problem with some K10Ds. As it was way out of warranty by the time I found the problem I just live with it and fix it in post.
Same here. Luckily it's a very quick fix in post.

12-07-2018, 02:38 AM   #15969
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QuoteOriginally posted by rayallen Quote
Dave, it might not be your focusing screen that is tilted. With my K10D I was having a problem with tilted horizons and after doing much testing with a spirit level and a known level subject (metal window sill) and a level camera on a tripod with a levelling base I found that the sensor in the camera is tilted. Further investigation revealed that it is a known problem with some K10Ds. As it was way out of warranty by the time I found the problem I just live with it and fix it in post.So, my advice is to test first to determine just where the problem is.
QuoteOriginally posted by paulh Quote
Same here. Luckily it's a very quick fix in post.

Thanks, Ray and Paul. Looks like you've saved me from the (probably futile) task of trying to straighten a focusing screen that actually might not be tilted after all. Since I hardly ever shoot anything with any obvious verticals or horizontals, it'll be easier to just correct it in post when needed as you both say.

Ironically, because almost every photo around here is taken on at least gently sloping ground (and sometimes far from gently), I often have to adjust shots to make the ground seem level when in reality it isn't. But if I leave it looking the way it actually is in real life, it just looks like a photo taken with the camera accidentally tilted. Ah the subtle joys of modern photography.
12-07-2018, 02:47 AM   #15970
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...maybe setting SR off could also influence this???
12-07-2018, 02:59 AM   #15971
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QuoteOriginally posted by Piotrek K Quote
...maybe setting SR off could also influence this???

Thanks, that sounds like a possibility. I'll give it a try.
12-07-2018, 04:49 PM   #15972
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12-07-2018, 08:39 PM   #15973
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QuoteOriginally posted by Dartmoor Dave Quote
Doing those church shots has definitely made me realise that my focusing screen has become tilted. I rarely take a photo with any strong verticals in it, or even a flat horizon, so I just hadn't noticed how far out of true my focusing screen was. Through the viewfinder the church looked exactly vertical against the markings on the focusing screen. I think a bit of careful tweaking might be in order.
I do like your edited version better. On the other hand, to me, the major attraction of ultra-wide lenses IS their power to make straight lines, or geometry in general, so mutable. As it turns out, in your original version, you shot the scene at an angle that kept the distant church and the horizon relatively straight. Perhaps had you shot more upward or downward, more delightful bending might have occurred. But the way you shot it, defishing did improve it. We might say it was meant to be defished.
12-08-2018, 09:55 AM - 3 Likes   #15974
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QuoteOriginally posted by goatsNdonkey Quote
I do like your edited version better. On the other hand, to me, the major attraction of ultra-wide lenses IS their power to make straight lines, or geometry in general, so mutable. As it turns out, in your original version, you shot the scene at an angle that kept the distant church and the horizon relatively straight. Perhaps had you shot more upward or downward, more delightful bending might have occurred. But the way you shot it, defishing did improve it. We might say it was meant to be defished.


Thanks, I think that's an excellent analysis. In the other angle that I did on the same visit (I think you've seen it in the K10D Club) some ultrawide distortion is still there even after defishing. Personally I much prefer it with converging verticals, but I know that others prefer the more "correct" version with the verticals straightened.

For those who don't visit the K10D Club, I'm talking about this shot here with the 17mm fisheye (defished):





12-08-2018, 10:03 AM   #15975
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QuoteOriginally posted by Dartmoor Dave Quote
Thanks, I think that's an excellent analysis. In the other angle that I did on the same visit (I think you've seen it in the K10D Club) some ultrawide distortion is still there even after defishing. Personally I much prefer it with converging verticals, but I know that others prefer the more "correct" version with the verticals straightened.
I fall into the corrected camp, but that is a VERY personal choice.
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