Amateur lighting question

brandonbpm · 09-07-2011, 02:27 PM

Hey, long time no post, I am looking into a humble studio setup in my home and I wanted suggestions for starting out. I am using the Pentax K-x (I have the 18-55mm kit, the 50-200mm telephoto, the M50mm f1.7 and a Tamron 28-75mm f2.8 will be here in the mail tomorrow) and I currently have no external flashes. I was considering getting a kit with a couple umbrellas and some reflectors using continuous tungsten because it seemed cheaper, but upon doing research, I think strobe lighting would suit my needs better. I don't want to spend more than $250 total, so like I said, my setup will be pretty humble, but I came across this kit on bhphotoandvideo.com:

Impact One Monolight Kit (120VAC) EX100A-KI B&H Photo Video

It comes with a 100 W monolight (not very bright, I know) a 24 x 24 soft box, and a 32 inch CONVERTIBLE umbrella (and stands for both). My question is, do you think this is a good kit for a beginner? Also, since I am using off-camera flash, are there any huge advantages/disadvantages to using the monolight's strobe vs an external hotshoe flash mounted on a stand? I know for syncing issues, I would have to purchase the hotshoe adapter, but I wanted to know if this bhphoto kit is a waste of money, and if so, what other suggestions do you have?

enoeske · 09-07-2011, 03:18 PM

MPEX Strobist Kits

I don't know anything about the kit you linked to, but here's another option...probably just as bright but smaller and more portable if you want to lug your gear around or shoot outside (no outlets there)

adpo · 09-07-2011, 03:40 PM

yn560 - $65 or so off amazon
heavy duty lightstand - $40 off BH
impact 60" umbrella - $30 off BH
your choice of radio triggers - $0-$300. Free if you set yn560 to S2 and use your popup flash to trigger it optically

cheap, portable and can pretty much do anything

if you wanna be extra fancy, you can pick up a backdrop kit off amazon or BH for 100-200

adpo · 09-07-2011, 03:45 PM

as for what i think about the BH monolight setup, its not portable (power socket neccessary unless you have one of those expensive on-location power packs/generators), tungsten is pretty warm and will make your subject sweat after a while. On the upside, it has a bit more power and a modeling light

since you're starting out, i say go with the small lights first and then step up to a higher-quality monolight when you're ready, such as an alienbee

brandonbpm · 09-07-2011, 04:08 PM

thank both of you for your suggestions. I had no idea an external flash could be triggered as by a pop up flash as an optical slave. Can someone explain to me the uses for larger vs smaller umbrellas? i.e. 43'' vs 60''. Does it just spread light more? Do larger umbrellas become more troublesome in smaller rooms/rooms with lower ceilings?

adpo · 09-07-2011, 04:29 PM

the bigger the umbrella, the bigger the light source and the softer the light. unless you're in a 6 foot tall room or using a 7 foot parabolic umbrella, i doubt space will be too much of an issue.
as for triggering with popup flash, not flashes can do it. Yongnuo flashes have an S1 mode for triggering with another manual flash and an S2 mode for triggering with ttl-type flashes.

Wheatfield · 09-07-2011, 04:54 PM

I would recommend holding out for a real set of studio lights. Most everyone I know, with very few exceptions, and this includes me, has gone the same route.
They buy some hot lights, then they cobble together some flash units and some sort of support system for them, and then, when they get tired of dealing with junk, and making stuff do things that it really wasn't designed to do, they get studio lights.
I know a couple of exceptions to this, these are people who just bought studio lights right from the get go.

brandonbpm · 09-08-2011, 09:11 AM

well keep in mind I have no intention of becoming a professional. I am just a really enthusiastic amateur lol. I really only want to use it for small scale indoor and outdoor portraits for family and friends, and probably spontaneous photoshoots of my fiancé haha. So yeah, mostly head and shoulder/glamour shots, maybe more full body, but no more than like two or three people as subjects. Does this change any of the suggestions?

adpo · 09-08-2011, 03:06 PM

not really, i've found that two to three yongnuo YN560 flashes have been enough to light my entire extended family indoors. For headshots on up to small groups, you have more than enough power for studio style shots

Wheatfield · 09-09-2011, 07:31 AM

Originally posted by brandonbpm

well keep in mind I have no intention of becoming a professional. I am just a really enthusiastic amateur lol. I really only want to use it for small scale indoor and outdoor portraits for family and friends, and probably spontaneous photoshoots of my fiancé haha. So yeah, mostly head and shoulder/glamour shots, maybe more full body, but no more than like two or three people as subjects. Does this change any of the suggestions?

For me, no. I would still hold out for a set of lights. They don't have to cost a fortune, but you are getting equipment that is designed to do what you want it to do rather than making stuff do things that it wasn't designed to do.

mysticcowboy · 09-09-2011, 03:34 PM

A friend bought an inexpensive light set, a bit more light than your proposed setup. Then he read Strobist and followed David Hobby's suggestion from Lighting 101. I don't think he uses the plugin lights at all but YN-560s, umbrellas and regular light stands. Following his lead, I've gone the same route: 2 YN-560 flashes, an umbrella and a softbox. That's portable and reasonably priced.

DaveHolmes · 09-09-2011, 08:02 PM

While I agree that studio-flashes would be a great investment and do some jobs much better I do think that hotshoe-flashes give more options in terms of portability... I think it really depends on what you plan to do?

If you could get a good-and-cheap studio flash and a couple of YN560's/HV285's some stands and brollies you'd be pretty much set for anything...

**jford** · 09-09-2011, 08:23 PM

brandonbpm

I sympathize with your wish to keep the price down and get a lot of flexibility. But I second the advice from Wheatfield. Start with one decent, used monolight, a good stand, and an umbrella. Learn how to control the light.

I used continuous lamps for a while - and it was nice to see the effect, but it was ridiculously uncomfortable. And even then, the shutter speed was low enough to require, or at least really benefit from, a tripod. (That was back in the ASA100 film days-i.e., pre digital, pre-ISO film speed.)

If you buy a monolight, get one with a strong enough modeling lamp to allow you to see the effect. Less expensive lights tend to have very low wattage modeling lamps - and if you can't see the modeling, what good is it? I know a lot of excellent work is done sans modeling lamps - a la "Strobist", but I never shot so frequently as to build that skill.

Good luck to you, and have fun.

brandonbpm · 09-10-2011, 01:57 AM

can anyone recommend a decent monolight? Doesn't have to be overly powerful but I would like basic sync and optical slave capabilities along with adjusting the power level.

adpo · 09-10-2011, 08:06 AM

alienbees

a used b400/b800 off ebay, a heavy duty lightstand off amazon and a 60" impact umbrella off BH will be great for indoor work and stay around your budget

09-07-2011, 02:27 PM	#1
brandonbpm Forum Member Join Date: Apr 2011 Location: United States Posts: 86	Amateur lighting question Hey, long time no post, I am looking into a humble studio setup in my home and I wanted suggestions for starting out. I am using the Pentax K-x (I have the 18-55mm kit, the 50-200mm telephoto, the M50mm f1.7 and a Tamron 28-75mm f2.8 will be here in the mail tomorrow) and I currently have no external flashes. I was considering getting a kit with a couple umbrellas and some reflectors using continuous tungsten because it seemed cheaper, but upon doing research, I think strobe lighting would suit my needs better. I don't want to spend more than $250 total, so like I said, my setup will be pretty humble, but I came across this kit on bhphotoandvideo.com: Impact One Monolight Kit (120VAC) EX100A-KI B&H Photo Video It comes with a 100 W monolight (not very bright, I know) a 24 x 24 soft box, and a 32 inch CONVERTIBLE umbrella (and stands for both). My question is, do you think this is a good kit for a beginner? Also, since I am using off-camera flash, are there any huge advantages/disadvantages to using the monolight's strobe vs an external hotshoe flash mounted on a stand? I know for syncing issues, I would have to purchase the hotshoe adapter, but I wanted to know if this bhphoto kit is a waste of money, and if so, what other suggestions do you have?

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09-07-2011, 03:18 PM	#2
enoeske Veteran Member Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: Surprise, Az Photos: Gallery Posts: 2,136	MPEX Strobist Kits I don't know anything about the kit you linked to, but here's another option...probably just as bright but smaller and more portable if you want to lug your gear around or shoot outside (no outlets there)

09-07-2011, 03:40 PM	#3
adpo Veteran Member Join Date: Apr 2011 Location: Arizona Photos: Gallery Posts: 888	yn560 - $65 or so off amazon heavy duty lightstand - $40 off BH impact 60" umbrella - $30 off BH your choice of radio triggers - $0-$300. Free if you set yn560 to S2 and use your popup flash to trigger it optically cheap, portable and can pretty much do anything if you wanna be extra fancy, you can pick up a backdrop kit off amazon or BH for 100-200

09-07-2011, 03:45 PM	#4
adpo Veteran Member Join Date: Apr 2011 Location: Arizona Photos: Gallery Posts: 888	as for what i think about the BH monolight setup, its not portable (power socket neccessary unless you have one of those expensive on-location power packs/generators), tungsten is pretty warm and will make your subject sweat after a while. On the upside, it has a bit more power and a modeling light since you're starting out, i say go with the small lights first and then step up to a higher-quality monolight when you're ready, such as an alienbee

09-07-2011, 04:08 PM	#5
brandonbpm Forum Member Join Date: Apr 2011 Location: United States Posts: 86 Original Poster	thank both of you for your suggestions. I had no idea an external flash could be triggered as by a pop up flash as an optical slave. Can someone explain to me the uses for larger vs smaller umbrellas? i.e. 43'' vs 60''. Does it just spread light more? Do larger umbrellas become more troublesome in smaller rooms/rooms with lower ceilings?

09-07-2011, 04:29 PM	#6
adpo Veteran Member Join Date: Apr 2011 Location: Arizona Photos: Gallery Posts: 888	the bigger the umbrella, the bigger the light source and the softer the light. unless you're in a 6 foot tall room or using a 7 foot parabolic umbrella, i doubt space will be too much of an issue. as for triggering with popup flash, not flashes can do it. Yongnuo flashes have an S1 mode for triggering with another manual flash and an S2 mode for triggering with ttl-type flashes.

09-07-2011, 04:54 PM	#7
Wheatfield Moderator Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: The wheatfields of Canada Posts: 15,981	I would recommend holding out for a real set of studio lights. Most everyone I know, with very few exceptions, and this includes me, has gone the same route. They buy some hot lights, then they cobble together some flash units and some sort of support system for them, and then, when they get tired of dealing with junk, and making stuff do things that it really wasn't designed to do, they get studio lights. I know a couple of exceptions to this, these are people who just bought studio lights right from the get go.

09-08-2011, 09:11 AM	#8
brandonbpm Forum Member Join Date: Apr 2011 Location: United States Posts: 86 Original Poster	well keep in mind I have no intention of becoming a professional. I am just a really enthusiastic amateur lol. I really only want to use it for small scale indoor and outdoor portraits for family and friends, and probably spontaneous photoshoots of my fiancé haha. So yeah, mostly head and shoulder/glamour shots, maybe more full body, but no more than like two or three people as subjects. Does this change any of the suggestions?

09-08-2011, 03:06 PM	#9
adpo Veteran Member Join Date: Apr 2011 Location: Arizona Photos: Gallery Posts: 888	not really, i've found that two to three yongnuo YN560 flashes have been enough to light my entire extended family indoors. For headshots on up to small groups, you have more than enough power for studio style shots

09-09-2011, 07:31 AM	#10
Wheatfield Moderator Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: The wheatfields of Canada Posts: 15,981	Originally posted by brandonbpm well keep in mind I have no intention of becoming a professional. I am just a really enthusiastic amateur lol. I really only want to use it for small scale indoor and outdoor portraits for family and friends, and probably spontaneous photoshoots of my fiancé haha. So yeah, mostly head and shoulder/glamour shots, maybe more full body, but no more than like two or three people as subjects. Does this change any of the suggestions? For me, no. I would still hold out for a set of lights. They don't have to cost a fortune, but you are getting equipment that is designed to do what you want it to do rather than making stuff do things that it wasn't designed to do.

09-09-2011, 03:34 PM	#11
mysticcowboy Veteran Member Join Date: Apr 2009 Location: port townsend, wa Photos: Albums Posts: 968	A friend bought an inexpensive light set, a bit more light than your proposed setup. Then he read Strobist and followed David Hobby's suggestion from Lighting 101. I don't think he uses the plugin lights at all but YN-560s, umbrellas and regular light stands. Following his lead, I've gone the same route: 2 YN-560 flashes, an umbrella and a softbox. That's portable and reasonably priced.

09-09-2011, 08:02 PM	#12
DaveHolmes Veteran Member Join Date: Jul 2010 Location: Yorkshire Posts: 1,501	While I agree that studio-flashes would be a great investment and do some jobs much better I do think that hotshoe-flashes give more options in terms of portability... I think it really depends on what you plan to do? If you could get a good-and-cheap studio flash and a couple of YN560's/HV285's some stands and brollies you'd be pretty much set for anything...

09-09-2011, 08:23 PM	#13
jford Site Supporter Join Date: Jun 2009 Location: Indiana PA USA Posts: 1,396	brandonbpm I sympathize with your wish to keep the price down and get a lot of flexibility. But I second the advice from Wheatfield. Start with one decent, used monolight, a good stand, and an umbrella. Learn how to control the light. I used continuous lamps for a while - and it was nice to see the effect, but it was ridiculously uncomfortable. And even then, the shutter speed was low enough to require, or at least really benefit from, a tripod. (That was back in the ASA100 film days-i.e., pre digital, pre-ISO film speed.) If you buy a monolight, get one with a strong enough modeling lamp to allow you to see the effect. Less expensive lights tend to have very low wattage modeling lamps - and if you can't see the modeling, what good is it? I know a lot of excellent work is done sans modeling lamps - a la "Strobist", but I never shot so frequently as to build that skill. Good luck to you, and have fun.

09-10-2011, 01:57 AM	#14
brandonbpm Forum Member Join Date: Apr 2011 Location: United States Posts: 86 Original Poster	can anyone recommend a decent monolight? Doesn't have to be overly powerful but I would like basic sync and optical slave capabilities along with adjusting the power level.

09-10-2011, 08:06 AM	#15
adpo Veteran Member Join Date: Apr 2011 Location: Arizona Photos: Gallery Posts: 888	alienbees a used b400/b800 off ebay, a heavy duty lightstand off amazon and a 60" impact umbrella off BH will be great for indoor work and stay around your budget