Studio Backdrops & lighting kits.

**Mallee Boy** · 12-23-2011, 03:56 PM

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I need some advice from the more learned in studio lighting amongst you.

I preface my request by acknowledging the "if its looks too good to be true....it probably is" analogy.

I am looking into buying a lighting set up to set up a studio in my workshop for portraits etc and I have come across a dizzying array of options. While much can be purchased in Australia, as usual it is price loaded to hell making it largely un-affordable ( a sad tale of this country in recent times).

So, have come across these (& many many more) sourced on ebay and located in Australia.....what do you think? has anyone any first hand experiences with this stuff ? are they rubbish or worth a go at the money....or any other suggestions ?

New Photography Photographic Props Soft Box Light Stand Backdrop Boom Arm Kit | eBay

Top Grade Photography Light Lighting Stand Backdrop Photographic Soft Box Kit | eBay

Cheers
Grant

tuco · 12-23-2011, 07:37 PM

No doubt you'll be able to take a portrait with these economical kits. And if this is all you are willing to spend on studio gear then I guess it's better than nothing. I suspect you'll have to get the lights really close to the subject or bump up your ISO to get f8 out of the key light with it at a comfortable distance from the subject.

Personally I prefer strobe lighting to these continuos lights when shooting people.

kenyee · 12-23-2011, 08:41 PM

Ditto strobes...unless you're doing video, get studio strobes w/ modeling lights.
Or do the strobist thing and use speedlights if money is a factor.

**Mallee Boy** · 12-23-2011, 08:47 PM

thanks fellas....can you point to something at either Adorama or B&H to give me a lead on the type of set up you are talking about.
Thanks.

tuco · 12-23-2011, 09:41 PM

I got all my stuff from Paul Buff, Inc. The AlienBee strobes are a good quality value for the money. His Einstein strobes are new and more digitally sophisticated but cost much more.

One AlienBee B400 strobe costs almost as much as one of those kits your looking at so you can see that it is going to be a more significant purchase to get outfitted with stands, boxes, light modifiers and the other needed strobes. The AlienBee strobes have a lot of features and can be outfitted with all kinds of accessories and light modifiers and ultimately that is important. That is what usually separates the cheap equipment from the more expensive.

These strobes have modeling lights and they shut off just before the flash. What that gives you if there is hardly any ambient room light is really fast effective shutter speeds for crisp, sharp shots regardless of what your camera flash sync speed is.

lamented bovine · 12-23-2011, 10:21 PM

For what it is worth, I started out with ebay cheap strobe kits. They work and will get you a small studio. Where they fall over is in quality and reliability ( you dont want your gear to fail during a critical shot. That said a extra expence could have went to something else. The type of lights you are looking at seem to me to be continuous ( might be alright for video not sure for stills). i still have my ebay strobes from 3 yr ago ( they were not put to much use, they are 110 w/s lighting taught me the basics). Have you thought about speedlight system? I then moved to 800 w/s system and soon found I needed to be more portable. I now use elinchrom rangers mixed with ebay yn560 speedlights. Just cant seem to commit myself to pocket wizards yet. Have a look here:
Gadget Infinity
Might give you an idea for lighting and get you on your way. I have purchaced triggers from that site, his postage cost seem quite high, no I do not promote or am an afillite.
At the end of the day you are looking at a rather large outlay to achevie a particular result if you get it right then there is less dissapointment.
I see that you are SEQ if you would like a play with some lighting systems before throwing money its ok to pm me.

**Mallee Boy** · 12-23-2011, 10:47 PM

Thanks Macca.......only an hour or so west of you.

Its not about just buying something cheap....its about spending what I need to spend to get something that works without getting gouged on price.

I will have a look at your link........ and thanks again everyone....good and helpful info.

Merry Christmas.
Grant

lamented bovine · 12-23-2011, 11:07 PM

No worries, happy hunting and Merry xmas.

kenyee · 12-24-2011, 12:00 PM

Since you're in Australia, look at the Einstein:
https://paulcbuff.com.au/cms/index.php?option=com_virtuemart&Itemid=18
With your higher taxes and the distributor markup, it doesn't make sense to buy AB. They do have great resale value, so you can probably resell them for close to what you bought them for. And the other thing is if you do studio work seriously, their foldable softboxes have the least expensive grids (other softbox brands' grids cost nearly as much as their softboxes)-:

Others in that price range might be Bowens and Elinchrom. You should have local dealers for them so you can check them out directly.

p.s., and speedlights work too if you can control the lighting in your studio. The main issue is smaller modifiers and no modeling lamps for aiming.

candgpics · 12-24-2011, 07:35 PM - **1 Like**

Hi:

I saw your post and thought about making some comments and observations. It seems it was not that long ago I was in your position. Though I am still learning, I think I finally have crossed over that step where I am finally starting "to get it." I generally do portrait work with models, martial arts and fitness themes, and some limited nightclub/band images. My posts on this forum when I first started posting a couple of years ago surely show my novice roots.

In our small home studio I initially thought I had to outfit myself with multiple lights and looked at similar sets that you mentioned, as well as more elaborate and expensive ones. Ultimately, I took the "strobist" route (Strobist). I started off with 2 hot shoe flashes (Metz 58--great flashes) and used the Paul C. Buff CyberCyncs. I later bought a third hot shoe flash (a Vivitar).

Did I use 3 lights? Rarely. I usually used one or two. Of course, I was still learning and I am not saying all of the shots were great, but even today, when I think I have much improved, I usually only use 2 and do not remember the last time I used 3 lights at the same time. Admittedly then, my lighting is not elaborate, but I think 2 lights for most of the work that I do is plenty.

Later, I decided that I wanted the power of an Alien Bee. Paul C Buff (the company that makes/sells them) makes high quality economical equipment. These are not Mercedes or BMW quality, but think Toyota or Honda. Well made, very good customer service, and an informative website. I bought two Alien Bee 800s. Recently, I bought an Einstein (sold my DA* 16-50 to buy it--nice lens, but rarely used it).

So, now I have lots of lights, and it is nice to have the variety for studio, location, and outdoors (where hot shoes are super convenient--not as powerful, but very portable and easily placed and set up). With all of these lights, though, at most I use 2 at a time.

I also purchased a Manfrotto boom arm. Nice, good quality, but rarely use it. Cheaply made boom arms are useless. The Manfrotto is a nice piece of equipment. It was not expensive so I am keeping it and hope to put it in to use at some point

I learned, somewhat expensively, that the more you buy and gather, the less you actually use. Of course, this is an age old lesson, and it applies to other professions/hobbies, as well.

If I can presume for a moment, that you are somewhat new to the more serious portrait side of photography, want to have enough equipment to take good and creative shots, but are concerned about spending too much--I would recommend getting a two light setup, based upon 1 or 2 hot shoe flashes, a couple of economical, but reliable, CyberCyncs, a couple of decent light stands and umbrellas, and perhaps a Westcott Apollo for a softbox (I have it and it is very nice; not perfect, but very nice and gives great results).

Doing things this way will cost a bit more than buying the sets you mentioned, but is a nice middle ground beyween these economy sets and much more expensive kits. I also am biased towards flash as opposed to continuous lighting. In the digital world of instant results you can learn flash technique quickly and I think the power and versatility of flash over continuous lighting far outweighs the WYSIWYG benefit of continuous lighting. My wife and I work full time and we have 3 boys and still I have been able to have sufficient time to learn to shoot.

I would recommend a Metz 58 if you can afford it. I like the Metz 58 as it adjusts in output from full power to 1/256, in 1/3 stop increments. I thought this was overkill when I bought them, but I now really appreciate this feature. I have used many umbrellas and they all seem to work the same and produce a similar light. A medium duty set of light stands (likely stronger than in the sets you mentioned) and a couple of Manfrotto umbrella holders are fine.

A list of links are below for reference. I know you are in Australia (I am in Maine, USA), but hopefully these will be helpful.

Amazon.com: Manfrotto 026 Swivel Lite-Tite Umbrella Adapter: Camera & Photo

http://www.amazon.com/Westcott-2331-28-Inch-Apollo-Flash/dp/B003BYRO60/ref=s...4779027&sr=1-1

Amazon.com: Metz mecablitz 58 AF-2 Digital Flash for Pentax Cameras: Electronics

Amazon.com: Westcott 750 Photo Basics 7.0-Foot Light Stand: Electronics

Amazon.com: Impact Air-Cushioned Heavy Duty Light Stand - Black, 9.5' (2.9m): Electronics

Paul C. Buff - CyberSync
these are the CyberCyncs. I have the CyberCync Receiver (battery) and CyberCync Trigger transmitter.

Paul C. Buff - AlienBees

Paul C. Buff - Einstein E640

Manfrotto 420B Combi Boom Stand (Black) 420B B&H Photo Video

I hope this is helpful. I think having a smaller, but higher quality--not super high end, but well made economical equipment--is better than a set that likely will fall short in terms of durability and quality of construction. That does not mean a cheap piece of equipment is always a bad move. As you get more experienced, I think you will see what you need to spend money on and what you can buy on the cheap. Having a good foundation is best and then over time you can see where you can spend less.

Good luck with your decision.

Azzy · 12-24-2011, 08:53 PM

OP how about this:
Photo Studio Lighting Kit Backdrop Stand Muslin (847263071862) | eBay

**Mallee Boy** · 12-25-2011, 03:51 PM

Kenyee: Thankyou. Very helpful link and appreciate your input. Interestingly in addition to the ebay stuff I have also come across a Elinchrome, Pioneer & Glanz set ups sold here, whilst they are more than the ebay packages they may turn out to be less in the long run. My main concern with the ebay stuff is that if you blow a globe or have a failure I am guessing spare bits are going to be in the same category as hens teeth.

Lawbjm:....Wow, your comments and assesment of my experience in studio lighting are spot on (

do we know each other ??

) and your comments are extremely valuable to one in my position, I thank you. Owe you a beer for that advice...so if your going past........

Thanks all.
Grant

kenyee · 12-27-2011, 09:30 AM

Originally posted by Mallee Boy

My main concern with the ebay stuff is that if you blow a globe or have a failure I am guessing spare bits are going to be in the same category as hens teeth.

That indeed is also the problem w/ the fleabay wireless triggers...possible incompatibility w/ newer versions, but in that case, they're cheap enough to throw away.

You should consider cost of ownership (blown tubes, repair costs from dropping strobes) and modifier costs. If you are willing to do it right, find out what modifiers you want, then choose the system that works with them.
One advantage of the AB/WL mount is you can get an adapter to put Elinchrom modifiers on them. Cost of flashtubes is also only $20...repairs from dropping a strobe in a puddle of water is $40+shipping. Note that this is for us in the US since they're a very customer-oriented direct sales company. Some of us in the US hate Bogen because their support/repair department sucks

candgpics · 12-28-2011, 05:03 PM

Hi:

Glad my comments were helpful.

I told my wife of your post. She visited Australia after grad school and spent 3 weeks there. She would love to go back one day. We have young children, but perhaps we will in the future and we'll have that beer (or coca-cola).

Hope you make a good choice. You really cannot go wrong with Alien Bee products or Metz flashes (a bit menu driven, but well made). The key is to find what works and meets your needs. The other comments about durability are right on. I am gentle with my gear, but pack and unpack a few times, especially on location outdoors, and inexpensively made gear can really take a hit.

Happy New year.

**Mallee Boy** · 12-29-2011, 02:20 PM

Decision made.

Ended up buying from a store in a nearby city. Yes, I paid about double what I would have paid on Ebay for a similar powered system.....but I have three years of replacement warranty and a back up range of products carried in stock.....a bit over an hours drive away.
I went for a brand called Fotobestway, 2 X 500w flashes, model lights, umbrellas, soft boxes and air cushioned stands. Salesman was very helpful, knowledgeable and teaches photography at a TAFE (Technical & Further Education) College in his 'spare' time, he was trying to steer me towards Bowen but the budget was exhausted....this was the next best option in his opinion.

So to work....studio is taking shape.

Thanks again to everyone who replied, it just goes to show what a great resource this site is. And should any of you get to Oz only too happy to show you around.
Cheers,
Grant

12-23-2011, 03:56 PM	#1
Mallee Boy Site Supporter Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: South Australia Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 3,904	Studio Backdrops & lighting kits. Staff note: This post may contain affiliate links, which means Pentax Forums may earn a small commission if a visitor clicks through and makes a purchase. If you would like to support the forum directly, you may also make a donation here. I need some advice from the more learned in studio lighting amongst you. I preface my request by acknowledging the "if its looks too good to be true....it probably is" analogy. I am looking into buying a lighting set up to set up a studio in my workshop for portraits etc and I have come across a dizzying array of options. While much can be purchased in Australia, as usual it is price loaded to hell making it largely un-affordable ( a sad tale of this country in recent times). So, have come across these (& many many more) sourced on ebay and located in Australia.....what do you think? has anyone any first hand experiences with this stuff ? are they rubbish or worth a go at the money....or any other suggestions ? New Photography Photographic Props Soft Box Light Stand Backdrop Boom Arm Kit \| eBay Top Grade Photography Light Lighting Stand Backdrop Photographic Soft Box Kit \| eBay Cheers Grant

12-23-2011, 09:41 PM	#5
tuco Pentaxian Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: Pugetopolis Posts: 11,023	I got all my stuff from Paul Buff, Inc. The AlienBee strobes are a good quality value for the money. His Einstein strobes are new and more digitally sophisticated but cost much more. One AlienBee B400 strobe costs almost as much as one of those kits your looking at so you can see that it is going to be a more significant purchase to get outfitted with stands, boxes, light modifiers and the other needed strobes. The AlienBee strobes have a lot of features and can be outfitted with all kinds of accessories and light modifiers and ultimately that is important. That is what usually separates the cheap equipment from the more expensive. These strobes have modeling lights and they shut off just before the flash. What that gives you if there is hardly any ambient room light is really fast effective shutter speeds for crisp, sharp shots regardless of what your camera flash sync speed is. Last edited by tuco; 12-23-2011 at 09:55 PM.

12-24-2011, 07:35 PM - 1 Like	#10
candgpics Veteran Member Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Maine, USA Posts: 394	Some thoughts from someone who thinks he knows more than he does Hi: I saw your post and thought about making some comments and observations. It seems it was not that long ago I was in your position. Though I am still learning, I think I finally have crossed over that step where I am finally starting "to get it." I generally do portrait work with models, martial arts and fitness themes, and some limited nightclub/band images. My posts on this forum when I first started posting a couple of years ago surely show my novice roots. In our small home studio I initially thought I had to outfit myself with multiple lights and looked at similar sets that you mentioned, as well as more elaborate and expensive ones. Ultimately, I took the "strobist" route (Strobist). I started off with 2 hot shoe flashes (Metz 58--great flashes) and used the Paul C. Buff CyberCyncs. I later bought a third hot shoe flash (a Vivitar). Did I use 3 lights? Rarely. I usually used one or two. Of course, I was still learning and I am not saying all of the shots were great, but even today, when I think I have much improved, I usually only use 2 and do not remember the last time I used 3 lights at the same time. Admittedly then, my lighting is not elaborate, but I think 2 lights for most of the work that I do is plenty. Later, I decided that I wanted the power of an Alien Bee. Paul C Buff (the company that makes/sells them) makes high quality economical equipment. These are not Mercedes or BMW quality, but think Toyota or Honda. Well made, very good customer service, and an informative website. I bought two Alien Bee 800s. Recently, I bought an Einstein (sold my DA* 16-50 to buy it--nice lens, but rarely used it). So, now I have lots of lights, and it is nice to have the variety for studio, location, and outdoors (where hot shoes are super convenient--not as powerful, but very portable and easily placed and set up). With all of these lights, though, at most I use 2 at a time. I also purchased a Manfrotto boom arm. Nice, good quality, but rarely use it. Cheaply made boom arms are useless. The Manfrotto is a nice piece of equipment. It was not expensive so I am keeping it and hope to put it in to use at some point I learned, somewhat expensively, that the more you buy and gather, the less you actually use. Of course, this is an age old lesson, and it applies to other professions/hobbies, as well. If I can presume for a moment, that you are somewhat new to the more serious portrait side of photography, want to have enough equipment to take good and creative shots, but are concerned about spending too much--I would recommend getting a two light setup, based upon 1 or 2 hot shoe flashes, a couple of economical, but reliable, CyberCyncs, a couple of decent light stands and umbrellas, and perhaps a Westcott Apollo for a softbox (I have it and it is very nice; not perfect, but very nice and gives great results). Doing things this way will cost a bit more than buying the sets you mentioned, but is a nice middle ground beyween these economy sets and much more expensive kits. I also am biased towards flash as opposed to continuous lighting. In the digital world of instant results you can learn flash technique quickly and I think the power and versatility of flash over continuous lighting far outweighs the WYSIWYG benefit of continuous lighting. My wife and I work full time and we have 3 boys and still I have been able to have sufficient time to learn to shoot. I would recommend a Metz 58 if you can afford it. I like the Metz 58 as it adjusts in output from full power to 1/256, in 1/3 stop increments. I thought this was overkill when I bought them, but I now really appreciate this feature. I have used many umbrellas and they all seem to work the same and produce a similar light. A medium duty set of light stands (likely stronger than in the sets you mentioned) and a couple of Manfrotto umbrella holders are fine. A list of links are below for reference. I know you are in Australia (I am in Maine, USA), but hopefully these will be helpful. Amazon.com: Manfrotto 026 Swivel Lite-Tite Umbrella Adapter: Camera & Photo http://www.amazon.com/Westcott-2331-28-Inch-Apollo-Flash/dp/B003BYRO60/ref=s...4779027&sr=1-1 Amazon.com: Metz mecablitz 58 AF-2 Digital Flash for Pentax Cameras: Electronics Amazon.com: Westcott 750 Photo Basics 7.0-Foot Light Stand: Electronics Amazon.com: Impact Air-Cushioned Heavy Duty Light Stand - Black, 9.5' (2.9m): Electronics Paul C. Buff - CyberSync these are the CyberCyncs. I have the CyberCync Receiver (battery) and CyberCync Trigger transmitter. Paul C. Buff - AlienBees Paul C. Buff - Einstein E640 Manfrotto 420B Combi Boom Stand (Black) 420B B&H Photo Video I hope this is helpful. I think having a smaller, but higher quality--not super high end, but well made economical equipment--is better than a set that likely will fall short in terms of durability and quality of construction. That does not mean a cheap piece of equipment is always a bad move. As you get more experienced, I think you will see what you need to spend money on and what you can buy on the cheap. Having a good foundation is best and then over time you can see where you can spend less. Good luck with your decision.

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12-23-2011, 07:37 PM	#2
tuco Pentaxian Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: Pugetopolis Posts: 11,023	No doubt you'll be able to take a portrait with these economical kits. And if this is all you are willing to spend on studio gear then I guess it's better than nothing. I suspect you'll have to get the lights really close to the subject or bump up your ISO to get f8 out of the key light with it at a comfortable distance from the subject. Personally I prefer strobe lighting to these continuos lights when shooting people.

12-23-2011, 08:41 PM	#3
kenyee Veteran Member Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Boston, PRofMA Photos: Albums Posts: 3,026	Ditto strobes...unless you're doing video, get studio strobes w/ modeling lights. Or do the strobist thing and use speedlights if money is a factor.

12-23-2011, 08:47 PM	#4
Mallee Boy Site Supporter Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: South Australia Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 3,904 Original Poster	thanks fellas....can you point to something at either Adorama or B&H to give me a lead on the type of set up you are talking about. Thanks.

12-23-2011, 10:21 PM	#6
lamented bovine Veteran Member Join Date: Nov 2010 Location: Brisbane Photos: Albums Posts: 480	For what it is worth, I started out with ebay cheap strobe kits. They work and will get you a small studio. Where they fall over is in quality and reliability ( you dont want your gear to fail during a critical shot. That said a extra expence could have went to something else. The type of lights you are looking at seem to me to be continuous ( might be alright for video not sure for stills). i still have my ebay strobes from 3 yr ago ( they were not put to much use, they are 110 w/s lighting taught me the basics). Have you thought about speedlight system? I then moved to 800 w/s system and soon found I needed to be more portable. I now use elinchrom rangers mixed with ebay yn560 speedlights. Just cant seem to commit myself to pocket wizards yet. Have a look here: Gadget Infinity Might give you an idea for lighting and get you on your way. I have purchaced triggers from that site, his postage cost seem quite high, no I do not promote or am an afillite. At the end of the day you are looking at a rather large outlay to achevie a particular result if you get it right then there is less dissapointment. I see that you are SEQ if you would like a play with some lighting systems before throwing money its ok to pm me.

12-23-2011, 10:47 PM	#7
Mallee Boy Site Supporter Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: South Australia Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 3,904 Original Poster	Thanks Macca.......only an hour or so west of you. Its not about just buying something cheap....its about spending what I need to spend to get something that works without getting gouged on price. I will have a look at your link........ and thanks again everyone....good and helpful info. Merry Christmas. Grant

12-23-2011, 11:07 PM	#8
lamented bovine Veteran Member Join Date: Nov 2010 Location: Brisbane Photos: Albums Posts: 480	No worries, happy hunting and Merry xmas.

12-24-2011, 12:00 PM	#9
kenyee Veteran Member Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Boston, PRofMA Photos: Albums Posts: 3,026	Since you're in Australia, look at the Einstein: https://paulcbuff.com.au/cms/index.php?option=com_virtuemart&Itemid=18 With your higher taxes and the distributor markup, it doesn't make sense to buy AB. They do have great resale value, so you can probably resell them for close to what you bought them for. And the other thing is if you do studio work seriously, their foldable softboxes have the least expensive grids (other softbox brands' grids cost nearly as much as their softboxes)-: Others in that price range might be Bowens and Elinchrom. You should have local dealers for them so you can check them out directly. p.s., and speedlights work too if you can control the lighting in your studio. The main issue is smaller modifiers and no modeling lamps for aiming.

12-24-2011, 08:53 PM	#11
Azzy Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2010 Photos: Albums Posts: 201	OP how about this: Photo Studio Lighting Kit Backdrop Stand Muslin (847263071862) \| eBay

12-25-2011, 03:51 PM	#12
Mallee Boy Site Supporter Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: South Australia Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 3,904 Original Poster	Kenyee: Thankyou. Very helpful link and appreciate your input. Interestingly in addition to the ebay stuff I have also come across a Elinchrome, Pioneer & Glanz set ups sold here, whilst they are more than the ebay packages they may turn out to be less in the long run. My main concern with the ebay stuff is that if you blow a globe or have a failure I am guessing spare bits are going to be in the same category as hens teeth. Lawbjm:....Wow, your comments and assesment of my experience in studio lighting are spot on ( do we know each other ?? ) and your comments are extremely valuable to one in my position, I thank you. Owe you a beer for that advice...so if your going past........ Thanks all. Grant

12-27-2011, 09:30 AM	#13
kenyee Veteran Member Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Boston, PRofMA Photos: Albums Posts: 3,026	Originally posted by Mallee Boy My main concern with the ebay stuff is that if you blow a globe or have a failure I am guessing spare bits are going to be in the same category as hens teeth. That indeed is also the problem w/ the fleabay wireless triggers...possible incompatibility w/ newer versions, but in that case, they're cheap enough to throw away. You should consider cost of ownership (blown tubes, repair costs from dropping strobes) and modifier costs. If you are willing to do it right, find out what modifiers you want, then choose the system that works with them. One advantage of the AB/WL mount is you can get an adapter to put Elinchrom modifiers on them. Cost of flashtubes is also only $20...repairs from dropping a strobe in a puddle of water is $40+shipping. Note that this is for us in the US since they're a very customer-oriented direct sales company. Some of us in the US hate Bogen because their support/repair department sucks

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12-28-2011, 05:03 PM	#14
candgpics Veteran Member Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Maine, USA Posts: 394	Hi: Glad my comments were helpful. I told my wife of your post. She visited Australia after grad school and spent 3 weeks there. She would love to go back one day. We have young children, but perhaps we will in the future and we'll have that beer (or coca-cola). Hope you make a good choice. You really cannot go wrong with Alien Bee products or Metz flashes (a bit menu driven, but well made). The key is to find what works and meets your needs. The other comments about durability are right on. I am gentle with my gear, but pack and unpack a few times, especially on location outdoors, and inexpensively made gear can really take a hit. Happy New year.

12-29-2011, 02:20 PM	#15
Mallee Boy Site Supporter Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: South Australia Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 3,904 Original Poster	Decision made. Ended up buying from a store in a nearby city. Yes, I paid about double what I would have paid on Ebay for a similar powered system.....but I have three years of replacement warranty and a back up range of products carried in stock.....a bit over an hours drive away. I went for a brand called Fotobestway, 2 X 500w flashes, model lights, umbrellas, soft boxes and air cushioned stands. Salesman was very helpful, knowledgeable and teaches photography at a TAFE (Technical & Further Education) College in his 'spare' time, he was trying to steer me towards Bowen but the budget was exhausted....this was the next best option in his opinion. So to work....studio is taking shape. Thanks again to everyone who replied, it just goes to show what a great resource this site is. And should any of you get to Oz only too happy to show you around. Cheers, Grant