K30 trouble with wireless mode

muzicantini · 01-15-2014, 03:31 AM

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Hi there! I recently bought a Yongnuo 560 III and I am very happy with it. But there is a problem with the slave modes and I think the problems might be with the camera because I have experienced them with other flashes. The thing is that sometimes slave mode just doesn't work the way it should be. Sometimes the flash just stops lighting the frame even if I haven't changed any of the settings. Just I shoot, everything is ok, then the very next moment (I've waited for the flash to recharge), it flashes but the picture looks dark. I shoot in S2 mode, the settings in the camera are Wireless, pop up flash set to controller. Other problem is that I can't shoot with power 1/2 or more. I don't know why is that, the flash fires but it just doesn't light the frame. I have a Lumix Fz100 camera with a high speed video and I shot to see what the thing is. What I found is in wireless mode the pop up fires three flashes - preflash and two others (or two preflashes?). I have no idea why that is but that might be the problem because when i shoot in normal mode pop up everything works just fine, but i don't want the pop up in the frame. I can use some kind of card to hide the pop up (or bounce it towards the Yn) but I would be happy if I make the wireless mode work.

Cheers!

elliott · 01-15-2014, 03:55 AM

The wireless mode of the K-30's pop up flash is a complex and proprietary control system that the Yongnuo can't understand, it is actually transmitting data with the pulses of light. The Yongnuo is a simple flash with simple slave modes, S1 fires on the first flash it sees, S2 fires on the second.

The best option, especially since you have a YN-560 III with an internal receiver, is to get an actual radio trigger that is compatible with the flash like the RF-603.

muzicantini · 01-15-2014, 04:09 AM

I see. And since the trigger is not TTL is there any difference if it is for canon/nikon/pentax and could you recommend a particular offer from ebay. YONGNUO Single Transceiver of RF 603 II Flash Trigger Shutter Release for Nikon | eBay will this work on the K30?

elliott · 01-15-2014, 04:59 AM

I believe the Nikon version is recommended because the contacts align with Pentax the best, so that one should work fine.

ahw · 02-04-2014, 11:09 AM

Is there any way to disable the preflash on the camera so that it would be compatible with the Yongnuo in slave mode? Or otherwise mess around with the settings on the camera so it doesn't prematurely trigger the flash on the Yongnuo?

I have a Metz 58af-2 that seems to work fine with my K-30 in slave mode and was wondering if I could buy a Yongnuo to add a cheap strobe to the setup. I'll probably end up buying the Yonguo radio triggers if slave mode doesn't work, but it'd be nice not to have to buy the extra gear.

TastyCelery · 02-05-2014, 01:06 AM

Originally posted by ahw

Is there any way to disable the preflash on the camera so that it would be compatible with the Yongnuo in slave mode? Or otherwise mess around with the settings on the camera so it doesn't prematurely trigger the flash on the Yongnuo?

Preflashes shouldn't be problematic as long as you use the built-in flash as master, not as controller.
To use it as controller you must also use a P-TTL compatible external flash (your Metz unit is one of them, Yongnuo isn't).

P.S. just to be clear ... this applies only if you're triggering external flashes with your built-in flash. Yongnuo with a radio trigger works fine.

muzicantini · 02-05-2014, 05:47 AM

Well, the RF603II has just arrived, so problem solved!

ahw · 02-05-2014, 10:56 PM

Posting my observations, in case it's helpful to OP.

The Yongnuo will ONLY work in slave mode on my K-30 if the built-in pop-up flash is set the the standard flash mode--the left most option on the flash menu on the camera, NOT the right most option for Wireless Flash mode. In Wireless Flash mode, the Yongnuo will ALWAYS prematurely fire because it is firing simultaneously with the TTL pre-flash from the camera and therefore will not contribute to the exposure. It does not matter if Wireless Flash mode is set to Master or Controller--either mode will send out a pre-flash that will prematurely trigger the Yongnuo. Furthermore, the Yongnuo unit MUST be set on the "S2" setting, NOT the "S1" setting. (I'll have to read the manual someday to find out why.)

(Oddly, I don't know if this is common behavior for flash units, but the Yongnuo will actually contribute partially to the exposure if it's set to a lower power setting. At the max power setting of 1/1, it does not contribute at all, but at the lowest setting 1/128 it appears that the flash stays "on" long enough so that it contributes to the exposure though it activates prematurely. This might explain why OP sometimes got the flash to contribute to the exposure and sometimes it did not.)

As for my Metz, the Slave mode only works if the camera is in the Wireless Flash mode and gets the pre-flash TTL information. However, through random experimentation because the manual wasn't helpful, I found out that the "Servo" mode on the Metz appears to be identical to the Slave mode on the Yongnuo, in that it appears to be a "dumb" manual slave mode that activates upon and in sync with the main exposure flash from the built-in pop-up flash.

ahw · 02-05-2014, 11:05 PM

Having now read the Yongnuo manual, I'm not entirely sure why my Yongnuo unit behaves the way it does. S2 on the Yongnuo is supposed to be a "Pre-flash Cancel Mode" that ignores pre-flash information. One would think it would work when the camera is set to Wireless Flash mode? I'd also think that it should fire late when my camera is set to standard flash mode, since there is no preflash? Maybe it's a quirk with the Pentax system or maybe I have a setting on my camera that I need to adjust. If anyone knows the answer, I'd be interested in knowing.

elliott · 02-06-2014, 07:47 AM

Originally posted by ahw

Having now read the Yongnuo manual, I'm not entirely sure why my Yongnuo unit behaves the way it does. S2 on the Yongnuo is supposed to be a "Pre-flash Cancel Mode" that ignores pre-flash information. One would think it would work when the camera is set to Wireless Flash mode? I'd also think that it should fire late when my camera is set to standard flash mode, since there is no preflash? Maybe it's a quirk with the Pentax system or maybe I have a setting on my camera that I need to adjust. If anyone knows the answer, I'd be interested in knowing.

The Yongnuo in S2 mode ignores only the first flash and fires on the second. In wireless mode the camera is sending data with a series of very quick flashes. The Yongnuo will always fire on the second, so if the camera does the metering pre-flash, then transmits data, then does the final flash the Yongnuo will fire when it is transmitting data.

With the on camera flash in normal mode there is a pre-flash, that is a low power flash for metering purposes. The only time it won't fire a pre-flash is if you are using a pre-A series lens and it will only fire at full power.

Red-eye reduction must be off, this will also confuse the Yongnuo.

ahw · 02-06-2014, 11:26 AM

Originally posted by elliott

The Yongnuo in S2 mode ignores only the first flash and fires on the second. In wireless mode the camera is sending data with a series of very quick flashes. The Yongnuo will always fire on the second, so if the camera does the metering pre-flash, then transmits data, then does the final flash the Yongnuo will fire when it is transmitting data.

With the on camera flash in normal mode there is a pre-flash, that is a low power flash for metering purposes. The only time it won't fire a pre-flash is if you are using a pre-A series lens and it will only fire at full power.

Red-eye reduction must be off, this will also confuse the Yongnuo.

That makes sense--thanks! I assume the Yongnuo was designed to work with Canon/Nikon and Canon/Nikon pop-up must work differently than Pentax. I guess it's impossible to use Slave mode on the Yongnuo without the pop-up on the flash contributing to the exposure. Oh well, already ordered the radio triggers so it shouldn't matter either way.

photolady95 · 02-06-2014, 12:00 PM

I do not like hijacking threads but in this instance I think I'm ok. I just bought a Yongnuo YN560-ll (off the MarketPlace) and it says it has a wireless sensor. I also have a K-30. Should I buy a wireless trigger also? I've yet to use the flash because it was just delivered last night. I want to use it for macro and birding, but mostly for birding in my backyard that is quite shady where the feeders are located. I already have an extra tripod and gadget to put the flash on the tripod.

elliott · 02-06-2014, 12:31 PM

Originally posted by photolady95

I do not like hijacking threads but in this instance I think I'm ok. I just bought a Yongnuo YN560-ll (off the MarketPlace) and it says it has a wireless sensor. I also have a K-30. Should I buy a wireless trigger also? I've yet to use the flash because it was just delivered last night. I want to use it for macro and birding, but mostly for birding in my backyard that is quite shady where the feeders are located. I already have an extra tripod and gadget to put the flash on the tripod.

I prefer radio triggering for reliability and because I don't usually want the on board flash to fire. I've heard the Yongnuo RF-603N works well with Pentax and they are pretty cheap, they are also compatible with the internal radio receiver of the YN-560-III if you ever decide to get one of those.

I have the earlier RF-602 and they have a problem syncing faster than 1/125s without modification, they are great once modified though.

photolady95 · 02-06-2014, 12:36 PM

Originally posted by elliott

I prefer radio triggering for reliability

What is the difference in wireless triggering and radio tirggering and could you supply a link to what one you're using?

elliott · 02-06-2014, 01:13 PM

Originally posted by photolady95

What is the difference in wireless triggering and radio tirggering and could you supply a link to what one you're using?

The wireless triggering that the YN-560 I and II has is optical, meaning you trigger it with another flash. It works fine in a studio and indoors most of the time, but it can be unreliable outdoors. It is also not a good idea to use optically triggered flash where other people might also be shooting because it will fire when it sees their flashes too.

These are meant for Nikon and have been reported to work great with Pentax out of the box:
Amazon.com: Yongnuo RF-603 N3 2.4GHz Wireless Flash Trigger/Wireless Shutter Release Transceiver Kit for Nikon D90/D3100/D5000/D7000: Camera & Photo

You can also use these as a remote shutter release, but the Nikon cable won't work with Pentax. You can use this Canon cable and it will work fine:
LS 2 5 C1 Shutter Release Cord Cable for YONGNUO RF 603 C1 Canon 1000D 550D 500D | eBay

01-15-2014, 03:31 AM	#1
muzicantini New Member Join Date: Jan 2014 Posts: 23	K30 trouble with wireless mode Staff note: This post may contain affiliate links, which means Pentax Forums may earn a small commission if a visitor clicks through and makes a purchase. If you would like to support the forum directly, you may also make a donation here. Hi there! I recently bought a Yongnuo 560 III and I am very happy with it. But there is a problem with the slave modes and I think the problems might be with the camera because I have experienced them with other flashes. The thing is that sometimes slave mode just doesn't work the way it should be. Sometimes the flash just stops lighting the frame even if I haven't changed any of the settings. Just I shoot, everything is ok, then the very next moment (I've waited for the flash to recharge), it flashes but the picture looks dark. I shoot in S2 mode, the settings in the camera are Wireless, pop up flash set to controller. Other problem is that I can't shoot with power 1/2 or more. I don't know why is that, the flash fires but it just doesn't light the frame. I have a Lumix Fz100 camera with a high speed video and I shot to see what the thing is. What I found is in wireless mode the pop up fires three flashes - preflash and two others (or two preflashes?). I have no idea why that is but that might be the problem because when i shoot in normal mode pop up everything works just fine, but i don't want the pop up in the frame. I can use some kind of card to hide the pop up (or bounce it towards the Yn) but I would be happy if I make the wireless mode work. Cheers!

02-05-2014, 01:06 AM	#6
TastyCelery New Member Join Date: Apr 2013 Location: Ljubljana Posts: 8	Originally posted by ahw Is there any way to disable the preflash on the camera so that it would be compatible with the Yongnuo in slave mode? Or otherwise mess around with the settings on the camera so it doesn't prematurely trigger the flash on the Yongnuo? Preflashes shouldn't be problematic as long as you use the built-in flash as master, not as controller. To use it as controller you must also use a P-TTL compatible external flash (your Metz unit is one of them, Yongnuo isn't). P.S. just to be clear ... this applies only if you're triggering external flashes with your built-in flash. Yongnuo with a radio trigger works fine. Last edited by TastyCelery; 02-05-2014 at 01:15 AM.

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01-15-2014, 03:55 AM	#2
elliott Inactive Account Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: North Carolina Photos: Albums Posts: 1,720	The wireless mode of the K-30's pop up flash is a complex and proprietary control system that the Yongnuo can't understand, it is actually transmitting data with the pulses of light. The Yongnuo is a simple flash with simple slave modes, S1 fires on the first flash it sees, S2 fires on the second. The best option, especially since you have a YN-560 III with an internal receiver, is to get an actual radio trigger that is compatible with the flash like the RF-603.

01-15-2014, 04:09 AM	#3
muzicantini New Member Join Date: Jan 2014 Posts: 23 Original Poster	I see. And since the trigger is not TTL is there any difference if it is for canon/nikon/pentax and could you recommend a particular offer from ebay. YONGNUO Single Transceiver of RF 603 II Flash Trigger Shutter Release for Nikon \| eBay will this work on the K30?

01-15-2014, 04:59 AM	#4
elliott Inactive Account Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: North Carolina Photos: Albums Posts: 1,720	I believe the Nikon version is recommended because the contacts align with Pentax the best, so that one should work fine.

02-04-2014, 11:09 AM	#5
ahw Junior Member Join Date: Feb 2011 Location: Fresno, CA Photos: Gallery Posts: 33	Is there any way to disable the preflash on the camera so that it would be compatible with the Yongnuo in slave mode? Or otherwise mess around with the settings on the camera so it doesn't prematurely trigger the flash on the Yongnuo? I have a Metz 58af-2 that seems to work fine with my K-30 in slave mode and was wondering if I could buy a Yongnuo to add a cheap strobe to the setup. I'll probably end up buying the Yonguo radio triggers if slave mode doesn't work, but it'd be nice not to have to buy the extra gear.

02-05-2014, 05:47 AM	#7
muzicantini New Member Join Date: Jan 2014 Posts: 23 Original Poster	Well, the RF603II has just arrived, so problem solved!

02-05-2014, 10:56 PM	#8
ahw Junior Member Join Date: Feb 2011 Location: Fresno, CA Photos: Gallery Posts: 33	Posting my observations, in case it's helpful to OP. The Yongnuo will ONLY work in slave mode on my K-30 if the built-in pop-up flash is set the the standard flash mode--the left most option on the flash menu on the camera, NOT the right most option for Wireless Flash mode. In Wireless Flash mode, the Yongnuo will ALWAYS prematurely fire because it is firing simultaneously with the TTL pre-flash from the camera and therefore will not contribute to the exposure. It does not matter if Wireless Flash mode is set to Master or Controller--either mode will send out a pre-flash that will prematurely trigger the Yongnuo. Furthermore, the Yongnuo unit MUST be set on the "S2" setting, NOT the "S1" setting. (I'll have to read the manual someday to find out why.) (Oddly, I don't know if this is common behavior for flash units, but the Yongnuo will actually contribute partially to the exposure if it's set to a lower power setting. At the max power setting of 1/1, it does not contribute at all, but at the lowest setting 1/128 it appears that the flash stays "on" long enough so that it contributes to the exposure though it activates prematurely. This might explain why OP sometimes got the flash to contribute to the exposure and sometimes it did not.) As for my Metz, the Slave mode only works if the camera is in the Wireless Flash mode and gets the pre-flash TTL information. However, through random experimentation because the manual wasn't helpful, I found out that the "Servo" mode on the Metz appears to be identical to the Slave mode on the Yongnuo, in that it appears to be a "dumb" manual slave mode that activates upon and in sync with the main exposure flash from the built-in pop-up flash.

02-05-2014, 11:05 PM	#9
ahw Junior Member Join Date: Feb 2011 Location: Fresno, CA Photos: Gallery Posts: 33	Having now read the Yongnuo manual, I'm not entirely sure why my Yongnuo unit behaves the way it does. S2 on the Yongnuo is supposed to be a "Pre-flash Cancel Mode" that ignores pre-flash information. One would think it would work when the camera is set to Wireless Flash mode? I'd also think that it should fire late when my camera is set to standard flash mode, since there is no preflash? Maybe it's a quirk with the Pentax system or maybe I have a setting on my camera that I need to adjust. If anyone knows the answer, I'd be interested in knowing.

02-06-2014, 07:47 AM	#10
elliott Inactive Account Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: North Carolina Photos: Albums Posts: 1,720	Originally posted by ahw Having now read the Yongnuo manual, I'm not entirely sure why my Yongnuo unit behaves the way it does. S2 on the Yongnuo is supposed to be a "Pre-flash Cancel Mode" that ignores pre-flash information. One would think it would work when the camera is set to Wireless Flash mode? I'd also think that it should fire late when my camera is set to standard flash mode, since there is no preflash? Maybe it's a quirk with the Pentax system or maybe I have a setting on my camera that I need to adjust. If anyone knows the answer, I'd be interested in knowing. The Yongnuo in S2 mode ignores only the first flash and fires on the second. In wireless mode the camera is sending data with a series of very quick flashes. The Yongnuo will always fire on the second, so if the camera does the metering pre-flash, then transmits data, then does the final flash the Yongnuo will fire when it is transmitting data. With the on camera flash in normal mode there is a pre-flash, that is a low power flash for metering purposes. The only time it won't fire a pre-flash is if you are using a pre-A series lens and it will only fire at full power. Red-eye reduction must be off, this will also confuse the Yongnuo.

02-06-2014, 11:26 AM	#11
ahw Junior Member Join Date: Feb 2011 Location: Fresno, CA Photos: Gallery Posts: 33	Originally posted by elliott The Yongnuo in S2 mode ignores only the first flash and fires on the second. In wireless mode the camera is sending data with a series of very quick flashes. The Yongnuo will always fire on the second, so if the camera does the metering pre-flash, then transmits data, then does the final flash the Yongnuo will fire when it is transmitting data. With the on camera flash in normal mode there is a pre-flash, that is a low power flash for metering purposes. The only time it won't fire a pre-flash is if you are using a pre-A series lens and it will only fire at full power. Red-eye reduction must be off, this will also confuse the Yongnuo. That makes sense--thanks! I assume the Yongnuo was designed to work with Canon/Nikon and Canon/Nikon pop-up must work differently than Pentax. I guess it's impossible to use Slave mode on the Yongnuo without the pop-up on the flash contributing to the exposure. Oh well, already ordered the radio triggers so it shouldn't matter either way.

02-06-2014, 12:00 PM	#12
photolady95 Otis Memorial Pentaxian Join Date: May 2009 Location: Cruising the forum watching his back Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 12,712	I do not like hijacking threads but in this instance I think I'm ok. I just bought a Yongnuo YN560-ll (off the MarketPlace) and it says it has a wireless sensor. I also have a K-30. Should I buy a wireless trigger also? I've yet to use the flash because it was just delivered last night. I want to use it for macro and birding, but mostly for birding in my backyard that is quite shady where the feeders are located. I already have an extra tripod and gadget to put the flash on the tripod.

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02-06-2014, 12:31 PM	#13
elliott Inactive Account Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: North Carolina Photos: Albums Posts: 1,720	Originally posted by photolady95 I do not like hijacking threads but in this instance I think I'm ok. I just bought a Yongnuo YN560-ll (off the MarketPlace) and it says it has a wireless sensor. I also have a K-30. Should I buy a wireless trigger also? I've yet to use the flash because it was just delivered last night. I want to use it for macro and birding, but mostly for birding in my backyard that is quite shady where the feeders are located. I already have an extra tripod and gadget to put the flash on the tripod. I prefer radio triggering for reliability and because I don't usually want the on board flash to fire. I've heard the Yongnuo RF-603N works well with Pentax and they are pretty cheap, they are also compatible with the internal radio receiver of the YN-560-III if you ever decide to get one of those. I have the earlier RF-602 and they have a problem syncing faster than 1/125s without modification, they are great once modified though.

02-06-2014, 12:36 PM	#14
photolady95 Otis Memorial Pentaxian Join Date: May 2009 Location: Cruising the forum watching his back Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 12,712	Originally posted by elliott I prefer radio triggering for reliability What is the difference in wireless triggering and radio tirggering and could you supply a link to what one you're using?

02-06-2014, 01:13 PM	#15
elliott Inactive Account Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: North Carolina Photos: Albums Posts: 1,720	Originally posted by photolady95 What is the difference in wireless triggering and radio tirggering and could you supply a link to what one you're using? The wireless triggering that the YN-560 I and II has is optical, meaning you trigger it with another flash. It works fine in a studio and indoors most of the time, but it can be unreliable outdoors. It is also not a good idea to use optically triggered flash where other people might also be shooting because it will fire when it sees their flashes too. These are meant for Nikon and have been reported to work great with Pentax out of the box: Amazon.com: Yongnuo RF-603 N3 2.4GHz Wireless Flash Trigger/Wireless Shutter Release Transceiver Kit for Nikon D90/D3100/D5000/D7000: Camera & Photo You can also use these as a remote shutter release, but the Nikon cable won't work with Pentax. You can use this Canon cable and it will work fine: LS 2 5 C1 Shutter Release Cord Cable for YONGNUO RF 603 C1 Canon 1000D 550D 500D \| eBay