[derekkite]

I was out shooting with a friend last night. My Metz 50Af recycles in about 1-2 seconds at 1/8 power. He has Nikon gear, and his flash was recycling at the same speed that his D7100 could shoot on continuous.

His was also more powerful, my metz wouldn't fill the scene. Full power is too much, but I was wanting to freeze action. The duration was fine, but I'm running into a hard limit between depth of field and flash power.

Of course I now have a reason to shop for a new flash.

I use my Metz sometimes on manual, mostly on Pttl with a beamer.

Any suggestions? Quick recycle, fast durations, Pttl an option?

[OregonJim]

The batteries are the limiting factor, not the flash (unless your particular flash has a leaky capacitor). Try switching to a set of NiMH with lower internal resistance. Find out what your Nikon friend is using and start there...

[jake14mw]

I'm surprised that if you were at 1/8 power your flash would take 1-2 seconds to recycle. At 1/8, it should be almost instant. Definitely check your batteries.

[awaldram]

I was out shooting with a friend last night. My Metz 50Af recycles in about 1-2 seconds at 1/8 power. He has Nikon gear, and his flash was recycling at the same speed that his D7100 could shoot on continuous.

His was also more powerful, my metz wouldn't fill the scene. Full power is too much, but I was wanting to freeze action. The duration was fine, but I'm running into a hard limit between depth of field and flash power.

Of course I now have a reason to shop for a new flash.

I use my Metz sometimes on manual, mostly on Pttl with a beamer.

Any suggestions? Quick recycle, fast durations, Pttl an option?

As stated @1/8 power recycling should be instantaneous for all but burst shooting.

For all intents even 1/4 power will allow not waiting for the flash.

Check your batteries AA alkaline are not flash suitable batteries, Nimh or hybrids are good but........

If you want even faster recycle times then read on

Ni-Zn aa batteries will give you a lot faster recycle time but their 1.6v Vs 1.2 (nimh) can cause issues for some badly designed flashes

failing that external PSu's A tr3 on a 540fgz will reduce full power recycle from around 5 sec to <1


Just tested my Metz50 AF with Duracell pre-charged 2400's @1/8 power I can fire a burst of 6 shots before the ready light extinguishes.

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Last edited by awaldram; 07-22-2014 at 05:57 AM.

[SOldBear]

Did the flashes use different kinds of batteries? I think you'd have better cycle time with fresh lithium batteries than with Ni-MH batteries.

What model is the Nikon flash? It may have 5 battery cells. It's amazing an extra cell can do.

[derekkite]

Did the flashes use different kinds of batteries? I think you'd have better cycle time with fresh lithium batteries than with Ni-MH batteries.

What model is the Nikon flash? It may have 5 battery cells. It's amazing an extra cell can do.

Yes, it has the fifth one on a little attachment on the side.

[maxfield_photo]

Why not bump the ISO up a stop or two, and take the flash down to 1/16th or 1/32nd? That should give you faster recycling, and better action-freezing power. If you're having issues with range, bump the ISO up two stops and the flash down only one.

[derekkite]

I suppose I should explain what I'm trying to do. There are bats that fly through a narrow opening in the trees onto the lake every night, and there are quite a few zipping by for about 10 minutes. The short flash duration is necessary to freeze action; 1/8 on the Metz 50 AF1 gives me about 1/4000 of a second. 1/4 was too slow and the shots were blurred. I discovered that with good batteries it will cycle as fast as the K-3 on low continuous, which eventually ends up being how fast the card gets written. I was sitting 15 feet from the camera, A50 1.4 lens set at f8, which gives me about 8 feet DOF when focused at 15 feet. A 6x6x8 box roughly. Remote trigger, hold the button down and hope. The last session I shot 690 frames. The new Duracell NiMh 2400 mah fed without problem for about 400-450 shots, then started slowing down. I would count to 4 and shoot after that. The flash just worked, didn't complain about heat or anything.

In this shot the bat is not sharp, probably on the far edge of the DOF. I suspect the real DOF is quite a bit narrower. I didn't process post, there is quite a bit to pull from the dark if I want, but the bat isn't sharp so it doesn't look good.

I need more light, so I can stop the lens down even more for a deeper depth of field.

I am considering either the Yongnuo YN560III or the Cactus RF60. My question is whether they are capable of shooting that many shots consecutively without shutting off on high temperature.

[derekkite]

Went out this evening, used a 35mm lens, which has a wider DOF. This is the clearest shot I've gotten yet, but I could use 2-3 stops more light. 35mm macro limited, Metz 50AF1 at 1/8, 70mm which gives a slight vignetting but a bit more light concentration. F8, 180 in X mode. The shot is cropped substantially.

[dane.dawg]

This seems to be a real challenge but also very rewarding. I would definitely get a couple of YN560II or YN560III. I bought mine from an ebay seller from the coast and the YN560II are about 65.00 and they where here within a few days. I am not sure if they would overheat but at only 1/8th power hopefully not.

[bdery]

As others pointed out, the batteries are probably the problem. The 50AF isn'tthat powerful so with good batteries it should be ready pretty fast.

The only way to get significantly faster recycle is to get a flash with Li-ion batteries, and that means the Godox V850, a great flash but fully manual.

[BrianR]

I would definitely get a couple of YN560II or YN560III.

I've no experience with those flashes, but I wanted to stress the 'couple'. Ganging up multiple lights will let you fire them at lower power which both increases motion stopping power and lets you fire continuous bursts for longer. You can also position them to get more interesting lighting on the bats. Radio triggers to fire the lights are then a good idea, some of the yongnuos have built in radio receivers but I've no experience with them.

This fellow used a pretty extreme setup, but maybe worth it for the inspiration if you haven't seen it before Stunning shots of thirsty bats swooping to lick water from garden pond | Mail Online

[Class A]

I am considering either the Yongnuo YN560III or the Cactus RF60. My question is whether they are capable of shooting that many shots consecutively without shutting off on high temperature.

I can't say anything about the YN560-III (except that the respective trigger, the YN560-TX, appears to have issues with misfires).

The Cactus RF60 (and Godox V850) will do 60 flashes in direct succession at 1/2 power without going into overheat protection. I extrapolate that to ~500 flashes in direct succession at 1/8 power. I haven't tried that personally yet, though. If you leave a bit of time between flash bursts, the flash tube will cool down, giving you more overall shots.

The only way to get significantly faster recycle is to get a flash with Li-ion batteries, and that means the Godox V850, a great flash but fully manual.

That's incorrect.

There are more options:

1. You can use a power pack with most flashes. The RF60, for instance, is compatible with Canon power packs. They take eight AA NiMH cells and about halve the recycling time and double the battery lifetime. At 1/8 power, recycling times should be fast enough without a power pack, though.
2. You can use multiple flash lights at lower power. That's what BrianR called "ganging up".

BTW, regarding the Godox V850: The Li-Ion battery is great when it works, but there is an increasing amount of reports of dying V850 batteries. Unless one has a working backup battery this actually means that one cannot use the flash at all if the battery dies (unlike with AA-powered flashes).

[SOldBear]

If you were in SF Bay Area, you could use my Quantum QFlash.

The camera would probably be overheated first....

[derekkite]

I suspect this is going to cost me a fortune, but Forward!

I have a couple of YN560II 's coming, which should give me adequate light. I should see them in a couple days. The next is to figure out some triggering process.

I'll post what I accomplish.