K100D and TTL Flash, is possible?

Aneopa · 02-06-2007, 11:19 AM

Hi everyone, i´m thinking in buy a flash to my K100d, but I use basically M lens (especially KM 50 1.7 and KM 75-150 4), so I don't see the point in spend a good money in a P-TTL. I believe the AF220T(*) is good enough for me at this moment. I wonder if the k100d will work with this flash, and how the flash will work with the M lens.

Can anyone advice me? Any thoughts are wellcome.

(*)

Pentax Imaging: AF-220T - Film SLR - Film - Accessories - Cameras by Pentax

Adam · 02-06-2007, 12:21 PM

The TTL flash will only work in auto or manual mode, but not in TTL mode.

None of the K series DSLRs actually support TTL, so if you're a frequent M and K lens user, you should consider getting the *ist D.

Ed in GA · 02-06-2007, 12:47 PM

Originally posted by Aneopa

Hi everyone, i´m thinking in buy a flash to my K100d, but I use basically M lens (especially KM 50 1.7 and KM 75-150 4), so I don't see the point in spend a good money in a P-TTL. I believe the AF220T(*) is good enough for me at this moment. I wonder if the k100d will work with this flash, and how the flash will work with the M lens.

Can anyone advice me? Any thoughts are wellcome.

(*)

Pentax Imaging: AF-220T - Film SLR - Film - Accessories - Cameras by Pentax

Not real, real sure but..... I think it will work with your K100D in manual mode only as a slave flash.

But then, I could be wrong ..... again.

roy · 02-06-2007, 01:08 PM

Originally posted by Aneopa

but I use basically M lens (especially KM 50 1.7 and KM 75-150 4), so I don't see the point in spend a good money in a P-TTL. I believe the AF220T(*)

Cameras by Pentax[/url]

Aneopa,
sure you should.. P-TTL works great with manual lenses. i use it all the time. the onboard flash doesn't. but a p-ttl flash on the hot shoe works great. set the aperture on your lens, put the camera in M mode, and set the flash to p-ttl.
you can also set the time.

Aneopa · 02-06-2007, 01:41 PM

Originally posted by roy

Aneopa,
sure you should.. P-TTL works great with manual lenses. i use it all the time. the onboard flash doesn't. but a p-ttl flash on the hot shoe works great. set the aperture on your lens, put the camera in M mode, and set the flash to p-ttl.
you can also set the time.

Thanks all for the answers.

Roy, if I understood well, are you saying the P-TTL will work through M lenses?

Wow!!! Please, say yes

About the AF220T, I knew that was too good to be true (U$ 30,00 in a flash)

One more time, thanks

roy · 02-06-2007, 03:36 PM

yes!! i use it all the time.. the onboard doesn't but a hotshoe mounted or an off camera flash works great. well at least on my DS it does. i use flash for macros with manual lenses for one example. this is with a reverse 50mm. that's about as manual as you can get.

Mike Cash · 02-11-2007, 06:42 AM

Originally posted by roy

Aneopa,
sure you should.. P-TTL works great with manual lenses. i use it all the time. the onboard flash doesn't. but a p-ttl flash on the hot shoe works great. set the aperture on your lens, put the camera in M mode, and set the flash to p-ttl.
you can also set the time.

I have a K100d and the Sigma 500 (P-TTL) flash.

Could you elaborate just a bit, please? I tried it the way you mentioned here and I must have misunderstood.

With P-TTL functioning, shouldn't the flash automatically cut off at the point where proper exposure has been achieved? I was using an M lens, shutter at 1/180, flash on P-TTL, and tried various aperture settings. I got the impression that nothing was being done as far as regulation of output went.

JJJPhoto · 02-11-2007, 08:56 AM

Originally posted by Mike Cash

I have a K100d and the Sigma 500 (P-TTL) flash.

Could you elaborate just a bit, please? I tried it the way you mentioned here and I must have misunderstood.

With P-TTL functioning, shouldn't the flash automatically cut off at the point where proper exposure has been achieved? I was using an M lens, shutter at 1/180, flash on P-TTL, and tried various aperture settings. I got the impression that nothing was being done as far as regulation of output went.

Has your Sigma P-TTL flash been re-chipped by Sigma to work with the K-series DSLRs?

The Sigma P-TTL flash units only work in P-TTL mode with the *ist series of DSLRs. When the K-series came out Sigma issued a press release saying that you have to send the flash back to them to have a new chip put in that will make P-TTL work on the K100D, K110D and K10D.

If your Sigma flash hasn't been re-chipped then it probably isn't working right with your K100D.

Mike Cash · 02-11-2007, 09:09 AM

Originally posted by JJJPhoto

Has your Sigma P-TTL flash been re-chipped by Sigma to work with the K-series DSLRs?

The Sigma P-TTL flash units only work in P-TTL mode with the *ist series of DSLRs. When the K-series came out Sigma issued a press release saying that you have to send the flash back to them to have a new chip put in that will make P-TTL work on the K100D, K110D and K10D.

If your Sigma flash hasn't been re-chipped then it probably isn't working right with your K100D.

Dang it! I was hoping that since I bought it here in Japan I wouldn't have that problem. Now I have to hunt up where to send the thing....

Thanks for the help.

Ole · 02-11-2007, 09:59 AM

Originally posted by Aneopa

Hi everyone, i´m thinking in buy a flash to my K100d, but I use basically M lens (especially KM 50 1.7 and KM 75-150 4), so I don't see the point in spend a good money in a P-TTL. I believe the AF220T(*) is good enough for me at this moment. I wonder if the k100d will work with this flash, and how the flash will work with the M lens.

Can anyone advice me? Any thoughts are wellcome.

(*)

Pentax Imaging: AF-220T - Film SLR - Film - Accessories - Cameras by Pentax

It will NOT work. That flash has TTL mode only. You need a flash with Auto mode such as AF200T.

The K100D does not have TTL flash support, so this flash won't work on the K100D. None of the K cameras support TTL flash.

Ed in GA · 02-11-2007, 10:07 AM

Originally posted by Aneopa

Hi everyone, i´m thinking in buy a flash to my K100d, but I use basically M lens (especially KM 50 1.7 and KM 75-150 4), so I don't see the point in spend a good money in a P-TTL. I believe the AF220T(*) is good enough for me at this moment. I wonder if the k100d will work with this flash, and how the flash will work with the M lens.

Can anyone advice me? Any thoughts are wellcome.

(*)

Pentax Imaging: AF-220T - Film SLR - Film - Accessories - Cameras by Pentax

second post.....

After thinking about it for a bit,

If you've bought the K100D, why not equip it with the equipment designed for use with it. The AF360FGZ is not all that expensive and it is designed to work with the K100D.

My $ .02

nosnoop · 02-11-2007, 02:18 PM

Originally posted by roy

yes!! i use it all the time.. the onboard doesn't but a hotshoe mounted or an off camera flash works great. well at least on my DS it does.

Roy, your experience with DS does NOT apply to K100D, unfortunately. Once you were using manual lens, you camera and flash would switch to analog TTL mode and NOT P-TTL! All newer Pentax does not have analog TTL support.

So no, Aneopa, P-TTL does NOT work with manual lens. You need at least an "A" lens to work. The reason is that for analog TTL, it does not need to know the aperture set, as it meters the flash exposure in real time during the time when the shutter is open.

However, in P-TTL, the metering is done with a pre-flash and with the aperture wide open. So the camera must know before hand what aperture will be used for the actual exposure so that it can make a projected settings based on the wide open aperture metering.

roy · 02-12-2007, 08:14 AM

thanks for the correction nosnoop. after i got to thinking about it i got to wondering. decided i watch this thread for a correction and i got it. no TTL support is a peave with me. i think pentax made a big mistake dropping it.

Mike Cash · 02-12-2007, 08:06 PM

One of the good things about living in Japan is that Customer Service at the company headquarters in Kawasaki is a domestic call.....You could have knocked me over with a feather when a real live human answered on the first ring!

It turns out that my flash is K100D ready. I tried it last night with an "A" lens and setting the flash to TTL gave overall satisfactory results. With an "M" lens....forget it.

My guesswork on this is that regular TTL measures what light has entered the mirror box during the exposure (diaphragm closed down for shooting) and cuts off the flash automatically. On the other hand, P-TTL wants to know the aperture beforehand, prefers to get the distance info electronically from the lens, but will suffer along without it if it has to, and makes a calculation of how much flash to fire before the exposure based on the info at hand and possibly feedback from the preflash (though what would be sensing that, I have no idea, there being no physical TTL sensor in the camera body).

Hence one gets best results from modern lenses that communicate both aperture and subject distance, can kinda sorta acceptably wing it with "A" lenses, and is back to doing mental calisthenics or relying on a chart to calculate apertures for "M" lenses.

Did I hit it just about right? Corrections most heartily welcomed.

Alvin · 02-12-2007, 08:20 PM

Originally posted by Mo

The TTL flash will only work in auto or manual mode, but not in TTL mode.

None of the K series DSLRs actually support TTL, so if you're a frequent M and K lens user, you should consider getting the *ist D.

I'm enjoying my K lenses. Now I know what I'm going to be looking for as a second body

Oh will the DS/DL work with TTL too?

02-06-2007, 11:19 AM	#1
Aneopa Guest	K100D and TTL Flash, is possible? Hi everyone, i´m thinking in buy a flash to my K100d, but I use basically M lens (especially KM 50 1.7 and KM 75-150 4), so I don't see the point in spend a good money in a P-TTL. I believe the AF220T() is good enough for me at this moment. I wonder if the k100d will work with this flash, and how the flash will work with the M lens. Can anyone advice me? Any thoughts are wellcome. () Pentax Imaging: AF-220T - Film SLR - Film - Accessories - Cameras by Pentax

02-06-2007, 12:21 PM	#2
Adam Administrator Site Webmaster Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Arizona Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 51,594	The TTL flash will only work in auto or manual mode, but not in TTL mode. None of the K series DSLRs actually support TTL, so if you're a frequent M and K lens user, you should consider getting the ist D. Adam* PentaxForums.com Webmaster (Site Usage Guide \| Site Help \| My Photography) PentaxForums.com server and development costs are user-supported. You can help cover these costs by donating or purchasing one of our Pentax eBooks. Or, buy your photo gear from our affiliates, Adorama, B&H Photo, KEH, or Topaz Labs, and get FREE Marketplace access - click here to see how! Trusted Pentax retailers:

02-11-2007, 09:59 AM	#10
Ole Administrator Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Copenhagen, Denmark Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 4,408	AF220T is TTL only Originally posted by Aneopa Hi everyone, i´m thinking in buy a flash to my K100d, but I use basically M lens (especially KM 50 1.7 and KM 75-150 4), so I don't see the point in spend a good money in a P-TTL. I believe the AF220T() is good enough for me at this moment. I wonder if the k100d will work with this flash, and how the flash will work with the M lens. Can anyone advice me? Any thoughts are wellcome. () Pentax Imaging: AF-220T - Film SLR - Film - Accessories - Cameras by Pentax It will NOT work. That flash has TTL mode only. You need a flash with Auto mode such as AF200T. The K100D does not have TTL flash support, so this flash won't work on the K100D. None of the K cameras support TTL flash. Last edited by Ole; 02-11-2007 at 10:06 AM.

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02-06-2007, 12:47 PM	#3
Ed in GA Guest	Originally posted by Aneopa Hi everyone, i´m thinking in buy a flash to my K100d, but I use basically M lens (especially KM 50 1.7 and KM 75-150 4), so I don't see the point in spend a good money in a P-TTL. I believe the AF220T() is good enough for me at this moment. I wonder if the k100d will work with this flash, and how the flash will work with the M lens. Can anyone advice me? Any thoughts are wellcome. () Pentax Imaging: AF-220T - Film SLR - Film - Accessories - Cameras by Pentax Not real, real sure but..... I think it will work with your K100D in manual mode only as a slave flash. But then, I could be wrong ..... again.

02-06-2007, 01:08 PM	#4
roy Inactive Account Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: D/FW area, Tx. Photos: Gallery Posts: 1,710	Originally posted by Aneopa but I use basically M lens (especially KM 50 1.7 and KM 75-150 4), so I don't see the point in spend a good money in a P-TTL. I believe the AF220T(*) Cameras by Pentax[/url] Aneopa, sure you should.. P-TTL works great with manual lenses. i use it all the time. the onboard flash doesn't. but a p-ttl flash on the hot shoe works great. set the aperture on your lens, put the camera in M mode, and set the flash to p-ttl. you can also set the time.

02-06-2007, 01:41 PM	#5
Aneopa Guest	Originally posted by roy Aneopa, sure you should.. P-TTL works great with manual lenses. i use it all the time. the onboard flash doesn't. but a p-ttl flash on the hot shoe works great. set the aperture on your lens, put the camera in M mode, and set the flash to p-ttl. you can also set the time. Thanks all for the answers. Roy, if I understood well, are you saying the P-TTL will work through M lenses? Wow!!! Please, say yes About the AF220T, I knew that was too good to be true (U$ 30,00 in a flash) One more time, thanks

02-06-2007, 03:36 PM	#6
roy Inactive Account Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: D/FW area, Tx. Photos: Gallery Posts: 1,710	yes!! i use it all the time.. the onboard doesn't but a hotshoe mounted or an off camera flash works great. well at least on my DS it does. i use flash for macros with manual lenses for one example. this is with a reverse 50mm. that's about as manual as you can get.

02-11-2007, 06:42 AM	#7
Mike Cash Veteran Member Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Japan Photos: Gallery Posts: 6,950	Originally posted by roy Aneopa, sure you should.. P-TTL works great with manual lenses. i use it all the time. the onboard flash doesn't. but a p-ttl flash on the hot shoe works great. set the aperture on your lens, put the camera in M mode, and set the flash to p-ttl. you can also set the time. I have a K100d and the Sigma 500 (P-TTL) flash. Could you elaborate just a bit, please? I tried it the way you mentioned here and I must have misunderstood. With P-TTL functioning, shouldn't the flash automatically cut off at the point where proper exposure has been achieved? I was using an M lens, shutter at 1/180, flash on P-TTL, and tried various aperture settings. I got the impression that nothing was being done as far as regulation of output went.

02-11-2007, 08:56 AM	#8
JJJPhoto Veteran Member Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Cincinnati, OH Posts: 419	Originally posted by Mike Cash I have a K100d and the Sigma 500 (P-TTL) flash. Could you elaborate just a bit, please? I tried it the way you mentioned here and I must have misunderstood. With P-TTL functioning, shouldn't the flash automatically cut off at the point where proper exposure has been achieved? I was using an M lens, shutter at 1/180, flash on P-TTL, and tried various aperture settings. I got the impression that nothing was being done as far as regulation of output went. Has your Sigma P-TTL flash been re-chipped by Sigma to work with the K-series DSLRs? The Sigma P-TTL flash units only work in P-TTL mode with the *ist series of DSLRs. When the K-series came out Sigma issued a press release saying that you have to send the flash back to them to have a new chip put in that will make P-TTL work on the K100D, K110D and K10D. If your Sigma flash hasn't been re-chipped then it probably isn't working right with your K100D.

02-11-2007, 09:09 AM	#9
Mike Cash Veteran Member Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Japan Photos: Gallery Posts: 6,950	Originally posted by JJJPhoto Has your Sigma P-TTL flash been re-chipped by Sigma to work with the K-series DSLRs? The Sigma P-TTL flash units only work in P-TTL mode with the *ist series of DSLRs. When the K-series came out Sigma issued a press release saying that you have to send the flash back to them to have a new chip put in that will make P-TTL work on the K100D, K110D and K10D. If your Sigma flash hasn't been re-chipped then it probably isn't working right with your K100D. Dang it! I was hoping that since I bought it here in Japan I wouldn't have that problem. Now I have to hunt up where to send the thing.... Thanks for the help.

02-11-2007, 10:07 AM	#11
Ed in GA Guest	Originally posted by Aneopa Hi everyone, i´m thinking in buy a flash to my K100d, but I use basically M lens (especially KM 50 1.7 and KM 75-150 4), so I don't see the point in spend a good money in a P-TTL. I believe the AF220T() is good enough for me at this moment. I wonder if the k100d will work with this flash, and how the flash will work with the M lens. Can anyone advice me? Any thoughts are wellcome. () Pentax Imaging: AF-220T - Film SLR - Film - Accessories - Cameras by Pentax second post..... After thinking about it for a bit, If you've bought the K100D, why not equip it with the equipment designed for use with it. The AF360FGZ is not all that expensive and it is designed to work with the K100D. My $ .02

02-11-2007, 02:18 PM	#12
nosnoop Veteran Member Join Date: Feb 2007 Posts: 1,299	Originally posted by roy yes!! i use it all the time.. the onboard doesn't but a hotshoe mounted or an off camera flash works great. well at least on my DS it does. Roy, your experience with DS does NOT apply to K100D, unfortunately. Once you were using manual lens, you camera and flash would switch to analog TTL mode and NOT P-TTL! All newer Pentax does not have analog TTL support. So no, Aneopa, P-TTL does NOT work with manual lens. You need at least an "A" lens to work. The reason is that for analog TTL, it does not need to know the aperture set, as it meters the flash exposure in real time during the time when the shutter is open. However, in P-TTL, the metering is done with a pre-flash and with the aperture wide open. So the camera must know before hand what aperture will be used for the actual exposure so that it can make a projected settings based on the wide open aperture metering.

02-12-2007, 08:14 AM	#13
roy Inactive Account Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: D/FW area, Tx. Photos: Gallery Posts: 1,710	thanks for the correction nosnoop. after i got to thinking about it i got to wondering. decided i watch this thread for a correction and i got it. no TTL support is a peave with me. i think pentax made a big mistake dropping it.

02-12-2007, 08:06 PM	#14
Mike Cash Veteran Member Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Japan Photos: Gallery Posts: 6,950	One of the good things about living in Japan is that Customer Service at the company headquarters in Kawasaki is a domestic call.....You could have knocked me over with a feather when a real live human answered on the first ring! It turns out that my flash is K100D ready. I tried it last night with an "A" lens and setting the flash to TTL gave overall satisfactory results. With an "M" lens....forget it. My guesswork on this is that regular TTL measures what light has entered the mirror box during the exposure (diaphragm closed down for shooting) and cuts off the flash automatically. On the other hand, P-TTL wants to know the aperture beforehand, prefers to get the distance info electronically from the lens, but will suffer along without it if it has to, and makes a calculation of how much flash to fire before the exposure based on the info at hand and possibly feedback from the preflash (though what would be sensing that, I have no idea, there being no physical TTL sensor in the camera body). Hence one gets best results from modern lenses that communicate both aperture and subject distance, can kinda sorta acceptably wing it with "A" lenses, and is back to doing mental calisthenics or relying on a chart to calculate apertures for "M" lenses. Did I hit it just about right? Corrections most heartily welcomed.

02-12-2007, 08:20 PM	#15
Alvin Veteran Member Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: Mississauga, Ontario, Canada Photos: Gallery Posts: 2,517	Originally posted by Mo The TTL flash will only work in auto or manual mode, but not in TTL mode. None of the K series DSLRs actually support TTL, so if you're a frequent M and K lens user, you should consider getting the *ist D. I'm enjoying my K lenses. Now I know what I'm going to be looking for as a second body Oh will the DS/DL work with TTL too?