[Aleighn8]

Hello everyone! I am a novice photographer with a K-3. I have mainly shot outdoors and some indoors with decent/good lighting. I have been offered the opportunity to shoot a wedding and a reception, and am thinking it's time to invest in a decent flash. I thought I might need something with TTL, but after a bit of research don't think that is necessarily the case. I have no experience with anything other than a pop-up flash, so this is uncharted territory. I am willing to buy used and to learn, but have a budget of under $200. I do not anticipate utilizing the flash off the camera.


Thanks in advance!

[CarlJF]

First, a wedding isn't really the place nor time to learn how to use a flash. It really takes a lot of practice to consistenly get good and predictable results. If you're not sure about what you,re doing, more harm than good can be done.

That said, no matter the brand or model, be sure to get a TTL flash with a swivel head. After that, read everything you can about on camera bounce flash technique (NeilVN's Tangents blog is a really good start). Finally, practice until you feel comfortable with the technique and consistently get the results you want...

[Aleighn8]

First, a wedding isn't really the place nor time to learn how to use a flash. It really takes a lot of practice to consistenly get good and predictable results. If you're not sure about what you,re doing, more harm than good can be done.

That said, no matter the brand or model, be sure to get a TTL flash with a swivel head. After that, read everything you can about on camera bounce flash technique (NeilVN's Tangents blog is a really good start). Finally, practice until you feel comfortable with the technique and consistently get the results you want...

I absolutely recognize that I have a lot of learning to do. Fortunately, I have a good bit of time to practice and learn (and lots of motivation, as well). Do you have a specific flash you might recommend?

[enoeske]

As someone who has shot a fair number of weddings, I can tell you that the more power you have, the happier you will be. I had the Metz 48 af-1 and it wasn't enough. Picked up the Pentax 540ii and love it. Sometimes you have really high ceilings, for dark ceilings, and being able to nuke the room is super useful. A low powered flash (low guide number) will not be able to do its thing in a lot of situations. Additionally, even if you don't need all the power out of a big flash, using it at low powers means it will recycle faster than a small flash working at high power. Don't forget, you'll probably need a decently fast lens with good AF speed as well. The variable aperture consumer lenses with f/5.6 won't cut it, you'll want f/2.8.

[jatrax]

You have two general options:
1) Pentax or compatible PTTL flashes
2) Manual flashes

If you want / need PTTL then options are limited to Pentax brand (540 or 360) and a few compatible ones from Metz or Sigma. If you can work with manual then options are nearly unlimited.

Some good information here: Comprehensive Pentax P-TTL Flash Guide Updated - Articles and Tips | PentaxForums.com

I have a Metz brand PTTL that works fine but if I was going to do weddings and needed a PTTL flash I would get the newest Pentax 540. Not cheap though. In general I use all manual flashes for my work, but I do not do weddings or any other situation where things are changing rapidly. In the studio or in fixed lighting I think manual gives me more consistent results. At a wedding reception I would likely use PTTL if I could not set up strobes.

I did attend a wedding recently where the photographer used all manual flashes, he set a number of them on flash stands around the room pointed up at the ceiling and fired them using a wireless trigger. Took him a bit to get things adjusted at first, after that he just shot the rest of the night with no issues. No idea how they turned out though.

[CarlJF]

I absolutely recognize that I have a lot of learning to do. Fortunately, I have a good bit of time to practice and learn (and lots of motivation, as well). Do you have a specific flash you might recommend?

See Jatrax post above. For under 200$, there's also the Yongnuo 585EX. I have no personnal experience with it, thus can't really recommend it, but the feedback is good on PF from people having bought it. This might be your best bet outside a used Pentax 540 or Metz 5x or 6x series.

[Aleighn8]

You have two general options:
1) Pentax or compatible PTTL flashes
2) Manual flashes

If you want / need PTTL then options are limited to Pentax brand (540 or 360) and a few compatible ones from Metz or Sigma. If you can work with manual then options are nearly unlimited.

Some good information here: Comprehensive Pentax P-TTL Flash Guide Updated - Articles and Tips | PentaxForums.com

I have a Metz brand PTTL that works fine but if I was going to do weddings and needed a PTTL flash I would get the newest Pentax 540. Not cheap though. In general I use all manual flashes for my work, but I do not do weddings or any other situation where things are changing rapidly. In the studio or in fixed lighting I think manual gives me more consistent results. At a wedding reception I would likely use PTTL if I could not set up strobes.

I did attend a wedding recently where the photographer used all manual flashes, he set a number of them on flash stands around the room pointed up at the ceiling and fired them using a wireless trigger. Took him a bit to get things adjusted at first, after that he just shot the rest of the night with no issues. No idea how they turned out though.

That flash guide is awesome! I'm starting to narrow down my choices and learning quite a bit.

[mcgregni]

I most firmly suggest, and echo the others here, that you should take advantage of P-TTL automatic flash exposure control, at least for your on - camera Wedding work. Juggling exposure controls to balance ambient light with nice side-bounced flash in Manual mode is not going to be for the faint hearted, unless the situations are mostly static and you don't have to change bounce direction, distances or move into different lighting.

A second hand 1st or 2nd generation Pentax AF-540FGZ might be affordable. In any case you can use the Flash Guide (linked above or below my post here) for working practical guidance and the general principles apply to all P-TTL flashes.

The Neil van Niekerk site mentioned above and his book 'On Camera Flash' are required reading. Also I made a forum thread describing a simple pub lunch with Pentax equipment and full descriptions of the techniques which should prove relevant ......

https://www.pentaxuser.com/forum/topic/indoor-events--mixed-lighting-techniques-55493

[aleonx3]

if you are serious about becoming a pro or semi-pro photographer, I am going to suggest that you go with the best they can afford... for example, the 360 II or 540 II. Both have the front LED and tilt-swivel head. I can tell you how useful it is (basically a 'shadow' killer) that I don't use the older version any more, not once since I bought version II. As an event photographer, I have no interest in multi-flash setup or remote flash trigger stuff, since everything is real time and fast moving. Good luck..

[Angel Perez]

I have assisted a few wedding photographers that are in that sweet spot of $3500-$4500. They shoot Nikon and Canon and have the top flashes for both. One shoots with a mix of Yongnuos and canon flashes. One of them just decided to eventually buy only Youngnuos. You can't believe the consistentcy you get for the price. If one fails it still is 3 to 5 times cheaper to replace. They use them all in manual. I will not question that you may get a better build quality from the flagships, but the cost benefit is hard to overlook. I have 4 flashes and I shoot them in manual. For your price point you can get 2 yongnuo flashes and a wireless trigger. You should consider using off camera flash. Also consider using a light modifier just in case you have a room that has ceiling that is too high. Something like a Gary Fong or a Rougue Flash Bender. I prefer the flash bender because it has more options. There are a lot of greay tutorials on B&H and Adorama to give you ideas on how to use flash.

Good luck!

[rawr]

In terms of available Pentax P-TTL flashes, a list of the most powerful flashes looks a bit like this. It starts with the big Priolite studio flashes, then covers speedlights:

1. Priolite MBX 1000 HotSync 1000Ws
2. Priolite MBX 500 HotSync 500 Ws
3. Sigma EF 610 DG Super GN:61@105mm
4. Metz 64 AF-1 GN:60@105mm
5. Pentax AF 540 FGZII GN:54@85MM
6. Metz 58 AF-2 GN:58@105mm
7. Yongnuo YN585EX/PENTAX GN:58@105mm
8. Shanny SN600FGZ GN:60@200mm
9. Bolt VS-570P GN: 43@50mm [Bolt only available from B&H)
10. Metz 52 AF-1 GN:52@105mm
11. Pentax AF 360 FGZII GN: 36@85MM

All of the above do P-TTL and HSS, with the exception of the YN585 which lacks HSS support.

The best value 'power' P-TTL flash in the list above, if you don't need HSS support, is IMHO the Yongnuo YN585, which B&H has for about $76.

[Aleighn8]

In terms of available Pentax P-TTL flashes, a list of the most powerful flashes looks a bit like this. It starts with the big Priolite studio flashes, then covers speedlights:

1. Priolite MBX 1000 HotSync 1000Ws
2. Priolite MBX 500 HotSync 500 Ws
3. Sigma EF 610 DG Super GN:61@105mm
4. Metz 64 AF-1 GN:60@105mm
5. Pentax AF 540 FGZII GN:54@85MM
6. Metz 58 AF-2 GN:58@105mm
7. Yongnuo YN585EX/PENTAX GN:58@105mm
8. Shanny SN600FGZ GN:60@200mm
9. Bolt VS-570P GN: 43@50mm [Bolt only available from B&H)
10. Metz 52 AF-1 GN:52@105mm
11. Pentax AF 360 FGZII GN: 36@85MM

All of the above do P-TTL and HSS, with the exception of the YN585 which lacks HSS support.

The best value 'power' P-TTL flash in the list above, if you don't need HSS support, is IMHO the Yongnuo YN585, which B&H has for about $76.

Thank you so much for your guidance. It seems that the Shanny has a similar guide number, same swivel capabilities, P-TTL, HSS as some of the other modesl. I'm really torn between the Sigma, the Shanny, the Metz 64, and finally the Pentax. It seems the only benefit (for my on-camera use) is the LED light on the Pentax. I know folks tend to follow the Pentax brand, but are there any other reasons to choose Pentax or Metz over the Sigma or the Shanny?

[clackers]

I know folks tend to follow the Pentax brand, but are there any other reasons to choose Pentax or Metz over the Sigma or the Shanny?

There is one thing to think about what you just said ... compatibility.

A new Pentax body like the K-1 was designed virtually without thought for third-party products, as Sigma lens owners and IIRC some Metz flash owners found out. You might have to ship back to the manufacturer or download a firmware update - if fixes are made available at all.

Ultimately, the risk assessment, with all the factors that are relevant to you, is your call.

[rawr]

are there any other reasons to choose Pentax or Metz over the Sigma or the Shanny?

None of the other flashes offer the weather resistance of the new Pentaxes. For some shooting, that's certainly very useful. Helps get the shot, and also may extend the life of the flash.

Metz are good flash makers - I bought my first Metz over 25 years ago, and it still works fine. And they have decent support, inc firmware updates via USB for the more recent flashes. So they get a big plus for reliability and support.

Sigma flashes like the EF-610 work fine on most Pentaxes (I had a Sigma EF-530 for many years and it never missed a beat), and their flashes seem to be well supported by Sigma, but their Pentax models are becoming hard to find in stores. And the newest Sigma flashes like the EF-630 don't include Pentax support, so the 'writing is on the wall' for Sigma Pentax flash. But the EF-610, if you can find one, is a super powerful flash at a decent price.

According to user reviews, the Shanny seems a great flash overall (ditto the Yongnuo). The low cost also means you have literally little [$] to lose by choosing either.

[Aleighn8]

Sigma flashes like the EF-610 work fine on most Pentaxes (I had a Sigma EF-530 for many years and it never missed a beat), and their flashes seem to be well supported by Sigma, but their Pentax models are becoming hard to find in stores. And the newest Sigma flashes like the EF-630 don't include Pentax support, so the 'writing is on the wall' for Sigma Pentax flash. But the EF-610, if you can find one, is a super powerful flash at a decent price.

And that would be the Sigma 610 Super, correct?

---------- Post added 06-09-17 at 10:39 AM ----------

I have assisted a few wedding photographers that are in that sweet spot of $3500-$4500. They shoot Nikon and Canon and have the top flashes for both. One shoots with a mix of Yongnuos and canon flashes. One of them just decided to eventually buy only Youngnuos. You can't believe the consistentcy you get for the price. If one fails it still is 3 to 5 times cheaper to replace. They use them all in manual. I will not question that you may get a better build quality from the flagships, but the cost benefit is hard to overlook. I have 4 flashes and I shoot them in manual. For your price point you can get 2 yongnuo flashes and a wireless trigger. You should consider using off camera flash. Also consider using a light modifier just in case you have a room that has ceiling that is too high. Something like a Gary Fong or a Rougue Flash Bender. I prefer the flash bender because it has more options. There are a lot of greay tutorials on B&H and Adorama to give you ideas on how to use flash.

Good luck!

That Rogue Flash Bender is a great idea! I think it will be really handy and will add one to my cart. Thanks for the suggestions!