[WMBP]

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NOTE: I put this post initially in the sticky in this forum but didn't get any responses and thought perhaps a sticky is the wrong place; so I've moved it here to a new thread.

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I've had pretty good success for a long time using non-radio wireless triggering but there are too many limitations to that system, so I'm about to buy my first radio triggers. The excellent info in this thread (and elsewhere) has persuaded me to buy the Flashwave system. I have 3 questions.

1. DO I need to buy the newer Flashwave 2 units or will the FW1 system suffice? I'd like NOT to spend money I don't need to spend and from what I can tell, the main difference between the FW1 and FW2 is that the 2 system has a greater range. Is that right? Or is the version 2 system really more reliable, as well? I got the impression that the v1 system was already very reliable. How much more reliable can you get? NOTE: I don't at the moment anticipate needing to trigger a flash from the other end of a football field! I expect to use these units to shoot wedding formals and portraits where all the units are within 30-40 ft of one another.

2. What exactly do I need to buy? I have 3 flash units right now - two Pentax 540FGZ's and a Meta 58 AF-1. If I was thinking of using all three of these units with my new radio system, would I buy 1 transmitter and 2 receivers? Or is the transmitter something that works on its own apart from one of the flash units - so that, to use 3 flashes, I'd need 1 transmitter and 3 receivers?

3. Am I correct in understanding that, once you move to radio triggers, you are no longer limited by the make of your camera when you buy new flash units? In addition to my three Pentax hot-shoe compatible units, I also have an older Nikon speedlite, and I could anticipate buying less expensive flash units in the future and triggering them remotely. I see second-hand Nikon and Canon units on sale all the time at tempting prices....

Thanks in advance.

Will

[SuperAkuma]

I can't say much about the Flashwave but honestly I would go with CyberSync by AlienBees.
AlienBees: Remote Controls, Wired and Wireless Remotes for your Flash Units

The flashware cost $189 for the transmitter and the receiver. The CyberSync cost $159.90 for the same kit. But if you want to add more receiver for each flash, the CyberSync cost $69.95 per receiver while the Flashware cost $139, about double the price of the CyberSync.

I bought the CyberSync kit from a member on this board as a part of a flash unit. So far its been working great. They are very reliable and anyone who owns them will say the same.
One of the thing that I like about it is that it uses AA battery, the same as your flash, they are made here in USA and most importantly they are %100 reliable.
I sound like a sales man for them but I really believe that the CyberSync is a better unit.

If you are really in a tight budget I would check out the RF-602 from Yongnuo. The RF-602 have gotten really good results online and is an improvement over their older model. I do not own them but thinking about buying a set for myself just to try out. I need to get another receiver for my Cybersync and it cost less for their kit then one CyberSync receiver!
For about $60 you get 1 transmitter and TWO receiver.
RF602 RF-602 for Canon 5D 5DII 50D 40D with 2 receivers - eBay (item 180393806234 end time Sep-05-09 10:52:00 PDT)

We have some users on this board that tried them out and gotten positive results from it.
https://www.pentaxforums.com/forums/camera-studio-accessories/69648-rf-602-wi...-triggers.html
I know its not much but many other on the strobist form said they did not have any problem with it.

Now to answer your question

1. After looking at flashwave's site it seem that FW2 has more range (about 260ft vs 65ft ), more channels (gives you less interferance), more ways of connecting your flash to it and a higher sync speed of 1/200 sec.

2. You need to buy ONE transmitter, this connects to your camera, it send the signal. You also need to buy a receiver for EACH flash you plan to power. You are looking at about $389 for one transmitter and 3 receiver from them.

3. Yes once you go with radio trigger you it does not matter what brand of flash you use because most likely you will be using them in manual.

[Peter Zack]

To answer your questions,
1) the version one set is just fine. I’ve used them in some very big reception halls and churches without any issues or misfired shots At least a 100 ft comfortably.
2) You’ll need 1 transmitter for the camera and a receiver for each flash. But if the flashes were close enough to connect by cable, you could fire a pair of flashes off one receiver. That one of the beauties of this system. It has extra plugs. So in a portrait studio I have fired one of the side umbrella and a snoot light for the background off the same receiver. Works great and this can allow extra lights in any setup.
3) correct, I use a number of different lights and strobes. Any flash will do. Here is another important aspect of the FW units. It has the PC sockets but also a hotshoe which many don’t have. So maybe the strobe has a no PC socket (AF540’s) so you use the hotshoe instead.

[WMBP]

I can't say much about the Flashwave but honestly I would go with CyberSync by AlienBees.
AlienBees: Remote Controls, Wired and Wireless Remotes for your Flash Units

Thanks. I've looked at the AlienBees, too, and also the Yong Nuo models from China. I think I'm going to go with the Flashwave for now because it seems to strike a good balance: pretty good price, pretty good reliability, and apparently pretty easy to set up. Looking at the web sites for some of the other products I get confused about what I will need. Sounds like the Flashwaves have been thoughtfully designed to provide everything. Worth a little to me to save myself some aggravation and keep my blood pressure down.

The flashware cost $189 for the transmitter and the receiver. The CyberSync cost $159.90 for the same kit. But if you want to add more receiver for each flash, the CyberSync cost $69.95 per receiver while the Flashware cost $139, about double the price of the CyberSync.

You were looking at prices for the Flashwave 2, but I'm looking at the Flashwave version 1 units, which are much less expensive. I anticipate buying 1 transmitter and TWO receivers - and it's only $150. 1 transmitter + 1 receiver = only $90!

1. After looking at flashwave's site it seem that FW2 has more range (about 260ft vs 65ft ), more channels (gives you less interferance), more ways of connecting your flash to it and a higher sync speed of 1/200 sec.

At this time, I don't think the distance is a problem for me at this time. As I said, I've been using only the Pentax wireless optical flash system for a good while and that forces me to keep things pretty close. I may start wanting range later, but if I do, the FW2 units are fully compatible with FW1, so I guess I could just buy a FW2 transmitter in the future and get more range.

As for the FW2 having more channels to avoid interferance, this does concern me. What kind of interference are you talking about?

Thanks,

Will

[Peter Zack]

Will it's not an issue really. The FW1's have 10 channels and that's more than enough to change frequencies if needed. I've used mine in big hotels (where the staff have radio headsets) and around video wireless mic systems both semi pro and news reporters. Twice even where there were wirelss units everywhere. Large university graduations with a band, full sound board, TV news crews etc. Not once have I had to change the fequency I've been using.

Heck consider that the cheapo V2 on Ebay that is 4 channels and people don't report channel interference. The problem with those units is poor receivers and limited range.

What sells me entirely on the FW's is the hot shoe. That feature alone makes them worth the price.

[WMBP]

Will it's not an issue really. The FW1's have 10 channels and that's more than enough to change frequencies if needed. I've used mine in big hotels (where the staff have radio headsets) and around video wireless mic systems both semi pro and news reporters. Twice even where there were wirelss units everywhere. Large university graduations with a band, full sound board, TV news crews etc. Not once have I had to change the fequency I've been using.

Heck consider that the cheapo V2 on Ebay that is 4 channels and people don't report channel interference. The problem with those units is poor receivers and limited range.

What sells me entirely on the FW's is the hot shoe. That feature alone makes them worth the price.

Thanks, again, Peter.

One other question - perhaps a bit off topic. I gather that, once I start to use radio triggers, I have to abandon P-TTL on the flash units and go full manual. Is that right? How hard is that? I've played around with manual flash settings in the past but I'm not confident about it. How does that work? Would this mean I'd also need to switch back to full manual mode on the camera?

Obviously, shooting portraits, this won't be a concern. But I have other uses in mind for the radio-power flashes. Last wedding I shot, the reception was in a hall that used to be a barn, and previous wedding to that was in an actual barn. Once I get confident with radio units I expect to set 'em up around the dance floor. What I've been doing is using just my Metz 58AF-1, on camera, full power, and (mostly) bouncing. Not 100% consistent but worked okay. But you know, as I moved around, and dancers moved around, and as there were windows in the background of some shots and not others (afternoon wedding), exposures changed. Shooting P-TTL on the Metz unit, the flash would try to adjust. But setting the flash to manual power, I would expect to get the same amount of light every time. That MIGHT be a blessing, actually. But I'm not sure. Any thoughts?

Thanks,

Will

[Peter Zack]

Will, that would be the case with any wireless system. I shoot this way all the time whether I have the flash on camera or on remote. Manual is just so much easier to control and operate. Yes the camera is in manual as well. So you use your 3 controls to adjust the settings. Shutter which is a secondary control, Aperture which is primary and controls the light coming to the sensor and ISO to assist the aperture control in some cases. It's really quite simple. Use the histogram and periodically chimp while shooting. You'll find that with a little practice, you can estimate the aperture settings needed for any given shot.

Once you adjust for a given room and shooting distance, having the camera/flash in manual is so much easier. Then as you move closer or further, you can just adjust the aperture to allow more/less light as needed. Far more consistant IMO.

In fact the only time I use PTTL now is direct on camera (bracket) for fill in outside daylight, that seems to work well automatically.

[WMBP]

Will, that would be the case with any wireless system. I shoot this way all the time whether I have the flash on camera or on remote. Manual is just so much easier to control and operate.

Heh, sez you. But then, perhaps my problem with manual in the past has been that I felt I needed to fiddle with the settings from shot to shot. I'll take your word for this.

Yes the camera is in manual as well. So you use your 3 controls to adjust the settings. Shutter which is a secondary control, Aperture which is primary and controls the light coming to the sensor and ISO to assist the aperture control in some cases. It's really quite simple. Use the histogram and periodically chimp while shooting. You'll find that with a little practice, you can estimate the aperture settings needed for any given shot.

I don't think this will be too much trouble. I grew up as a photographer shooting M and shot M with my Pentax dslrs until about a year ago, when I started to experiment with hyperprogram (P) and decided that it's brilliant. So I've mostly been using it, since I can switch to effective Av or effective Tv instantly with a single dial and without moving my eye from the viewfinder. But I think this should work even with the flash: I generally think in Av when shooting flash.

Once you adjust for a given room and shooting distance, having the camera/flash in manual is so much easier. Then as you move closer or further, you can just adjust the aperture to allow more/less light as needed. Far more consistant IMO.

OK, that's encouraging. Thanks,

Will

[WMBP]

Flashwave 1 package arrived today. I'm impressed with their shipping speed. I just placed the order on Friday and it's Monday morning in Dallas, Texas. I guess they can ship from within the USA.

Anyway, I have the packages open - and I'm stymied. It's pretty clear that I'm missing something. I figured out how to put the battery into the transmitter and mount it on the camera. I put 2 new AAA batteries into 1 receiver - and that's as far as I can get. I don't see any way to connect the receiver to a flash unit. I'm attaching a shot of the receiver and the cable. There is apparently no way to attach the male end of the cable in the picture to either my Pentax 540 FGZ OR my Metz 58 AF-1.

Perhaps I was mistaken about what they ship. I was under the impression that they would ship me everything I needed. What am I missing?

Thanks,

Will

[Peter Zack]

Oh my, I just went to the link on the site to see that they have changed the recievers for the FW1's to lower the price. These have no hot shoe. Both the flash units you have do not have PC sockets. The FW2 is the original version that I have and until only a week or so ago was the only reciever they sold. The FW1 is $20 cheaper by removing the hot shoe.

So the way you would need to connect these is with something like this and use a different cable that should have come with the receiver. it looks like a tube in one end and a 2.5mm pin to go to the reciever.

If it were me, I'd send the receivers you got back and get the FW2's. That gives you more connection ability and the hot shoe.

Sorry Will, I had no idea they had recently changed the recievers and made the FW1 a new model calling it FW2 and making a new cheaper reciever as the FW1.

They have given me good service in the past and I suspect they will have no issue exchanging these units.
The transmitter works with both and you don't need to change that out, but to be safe, ask them before you change the receivers.

Where these receivers make the most sense is with strobes and any type of fixed studio lighting system. All those strobes have a PC socket on them and many modern flashes don't have that plug any more. The Pentax has the dedicated 5P cord and I'm not sure what the Metz has.

[WMBP]

Oh my, I just went to the link on the site to see that they have changed the recievers for the FW1's to lower the price. These have no hot shoe. Both the flash units you have do not have PC sockets. The FW2 is the original version that I have and until only a week or so ago was the only reciever they sold. The FW1 is $20 cheaper by removing the hot shoe.

So the way you would need to connect these is with something like this and use a different cable that should have come with the receiver. it looks like a tube in one end and a 2.5mm pin to go to the reciever.

If it were me, I'd send the receivers you got back and get the FW2's. That gives you more connection ability and the hot shoe.

Sorry Will, I had no idea they had recently changed the recievers and made the FW1 a new model calling it FW2 and making a new cheaper reciever as the FW1.

They have given me good service in the past and I suspect they will have no issue exchanging these units.
The transmitter works with both and you don't need to change that out, but to be safe, ask them before you change the receivers.

Peter,

Thank you for your quick reply. You linked to a hot-shoe adapter on eBay. What about the adapters on G9Chon's web site? Would one of them do?

G9Chon - Hot Shoe Adapters

I am willing to send the stuff back and pay more for the other models - but it's a fair bit more, and the G9Chon's adapters aren't too expensive. What would be the disadvantage of keeping what I've got and just spending about $20 for two adapters?

Thanks,

Will

[Peter Zack]

Will, I was just thinking the cheapest solution but looking at the site, what you need is the SM601. so the price difference is about $5/each less than just having them exchange these FW1's to FW2's. That would eliminate cables between the 2 parts. Otherwise there would be no disadvantage.

[WMBP]

Will, I was just thinking the cheapest solution but looking at the site, what you need is the SM601. so the price difference is about $5/each less than just having them exchange these FW1's to FW2's. That would eliminate cables between the 2 parts. Otherwise there would be no disadvantage.

Peter,

Thanks again - but I'm not sure I understand what math you're doing.

I paid $148.95 for 1 transmitter + 2 receivers. That's the FW1B model of everything.

If I send that entire package back and get the FW2 package instead (1 tx + 2 rx) it's $289.95 = about $140 more.

If I just buy 2 of the adapters, that's simply $30 more (they're $15 a piece). Thanks for identifying the adapter model I'd need.

I would like the FW2 but I'm not sure whether I really NEED it. Obviously I can't use what I've got at the moment, so it seems I must either spend $30 for 2 adapters, or send it all back and spend $140 more to buy the version 2 package. Just trying to understand the pros and cons of each package aside from the cost.

Thanks,

Will

[Peter Zack]

Will sorry I was only looking at the cost difference between the receivers only. Unless I looked at that wrong the FW1's were $68 and the FW2's were $89. I didn't look at the packages. But regardless, with the added adapter you get exactly the same thing.

[WMBP]

Will sorry I was only looking at the cost difference between the receivers only. Unless I looked at that wrong the FW1's were $68 and the FW2's were $89. I didn't look at the packages. But regardless, with the added adapter you get exactly the same thing.

Thanks once more, Peter.

I've written to g9chon and am waiting to hear back from them. I guess I'll just buy the adapters - no problem, and if they get them back to me as quickly as they got the first delivery to me, then I won't have much to complain about!

Thanks,

Will