questions about off camera flash

graphicgr8s · 01-21-2010, 10:07 AM

I use a couple of older flashes I use. A Pentax AF400T a Vivitar 285HV.
I've been triggering them with this:

A22 Flashpoint 4 Channel, Radio Remote Control Set, with Transmitter & Receiver with Shoes, Range of 65'

So far all seems to be working well.

indytax · 01-21-2010, 11:45 AM

You don't need a Pentax-compatible flash at all, and if you're going to use it off camera there's absolutely no need for one. The P-TTL wireless capability of the 360 and 540 aren't what they're cracked up to be reliability wise. Additionally, they require a line of sight between the sensor on the flash and your camera, which if you're planning on using an umbrella probably won't work out too well.

I second the recommendation of the older Nikon flashes like the SB-24, -25, -26, or even -28. I use the SB-25 both on and off camera with excellent results--I bought it used for around $80, IIRC. They are common in the used market, especially at local camera shops. The advantage of these models is that they have tilt and swivel heads and adjustable power settings from full power to 1/64th power (very important for off-camera use). You should also consider the LumoPro model sold by MPEX.com, which is a fully adjustible manual flash very popular with the Strobist set.

They work in auto and manual mode, but they don't "talk" to your camera like P-TTL flashes do on camera (or with the P-TTL cord Russell mentioned). That only means that the camera doesn't control both the exposure and flash settings and do all the thinking for you. If you are interested in off-camera flash, you want to be able to do your own thinking so you have full creative control.

I use the Cactus V4 triggers at MPEX and have found them to be very useful. They are more reliable that the older V2 models and trigger the flash though radiowaves rather than the optical systems used for TTL wireless setups.

jboyde · 01-22-2010, 07:49 AM

Originally posted by indytax

You don't need a Pentax-compatible flash at all, and if you're going to use it off camera there's absolutely no need for one. The P-TTL wireless capability of the 360 and 540 aren't what they're cracked up to be reliability wise. Additionally, they require a line of sight between the sensor on the flash and your camera, which if you're planning on using an umbrella probably won't work out too well.

I second the recommendation of the older Nikon flashes like the SB-24, -25, -26, or even -28. I use the SB-25 both on and off camera with excellent results--I bought it used for around $80, IIRC. They are common in the used market, especially at local camera shops. The advantage of these models is that they have tilt and swivel heads and adjustable power settings from full power to 1/64th power (very important for off-camera use). You should also consider the LumoPro model sold by MPEX.com, which is a fully adjustible manual flash very popular with the Strobist set.

They work in auto and manual mode, but they don't "talk" to your camera like P-TTL flashes do on camera (or with the P-TTL cord Russell mentioned). That only means that the camera doesn't control both the exposure and flash settings and do all the thinking for you. If you are interested in off-camera flash, you want to be able to do your own thinking so you have full creative control.

I use the Cactus V4 triggers at MPEX and have found them to be very useful. They are more reliable that the older V2 models and trigger the flash though radiowaves rather than the optical systems used for TTL wireless setups.

Actually, I've been pretty impressed with the wireless PTTL reach. I don't use it that often because it does somewhat restrict creative control, like you mentioned. For example, you can only go +1 stop past the initial meter reading. I need +2 to turn my gray background white, so I'm forced to go manual with it.

For the reach ,I've been able to use it outside in sunlight (just to test, wouldnt do that in real-life). The only problem I had was when I had the Lumiquest Softbox 3 on one of them as it blocked the sensor. Lumiquest does warn about this happening.

Until every camera system has something like N*kon CLS then manual is the way to go. Even then, there's nothing like the consistency of manual power and learning lighting ratios to get the look you want.

BethC · 02-01-2010, 04:31 PM

Some of you have mentioned picking up a used Metz flash, but I'm having a hard time finding one. Besides the obvious...here and ebay, is there another place online that you can find used flashes and/or other equipment?

GeneV · 02-01-2010, 05:11 PM

Originally posted by jboyde

Actually, I've been pretty impressed with the wireless PTTL reach. I don't use it that often because it does somewhat restrict creative control, like you mentioned. For example, you can only go +1 stop past the initial meter reading. I need +2 to turn my gray background white, so I'm forced to go manual with it.

I've been impressed as well, especially if used in a reasonably sized room. For larger rooms, I also prefer multiple manual flashes with wireless triggers. One of the great things about the digital SLR is that it makes a great flash meter.

Arpe · 02-02-2010, 04:50 PM

Originally posted by jboyde

Actually, I've been pretty impressed with the wireless PTTL reach. I don't use it that often because it does somewhat restrict creative control, like you mentioned. For example, you can only go +1 stop past the initial meter reading. I need +2 to turn my gray background white, so I'm forced to go manual with it.

Try dialling +1 on the flash, and +1 on your flash comp on the camera. I believe they add together. Then use +/- comp for more variation, again, additive.

jboyde · 02-03-2010, 12:17 PM

Originally posted by Arpe

Try dialling +1 on the flash, and +1 on your flash comp on the camera. I believe they add together. Then use +/- comp for more variation, again, additive.

Siiiigh, I wish it would work that way. I'm using 4 flashes on 3 different power settings (1/key, 1/fill, 2/background). If I use flash comp on the camera it would affect all of the flashes. Then I'd have to dial power down on the others. I have a gray muslin. I'm going to by white paper soon so I'll only need +1 to keep it white.

Actually, I dont mind using manual. That way I can use my M lenses in studio without now having to turn my triggers on or off. Some of my good primes are pre-A.

ARSLONGA VITABREV · 03-23-2010, 12:44 AM

Originally posted by BethC

I have a K 10 D and a Promaster 7200EDF flash. I am ready to try my hand at some off camera flash and I have a ton of questions.

I'd like to get a wireless trigger. But not exactly sure what I would look for. Do I need to get one designated for Pentax cameras? Or more dedicated to the flash? or a combination of both? Anyone have any recommendations? Is the Promaster flash I mentioned an okay one to start with for OCF and a shoot through umbrella? Or should I start saving for a different flash? I read a lot about Cactus triggers on another site, but most people on that site shoot Cannon or Nikon, so I'm not sure if that's something just for those brands.

Any suggestions, comments, ideas are very much appreciated. I want to get started, but really don't know what to look for.

Thanks in advance for any help!

hi there, could you please help me with the choice of flashes? how is your7400EDF? does it support hss?

BethC · 03-23-2010, 07:30 AM

Hi! I'm not sure what Hss is, but...the flash is totally automatic. There are no controls on it at all. So it works just fine mounted on the camera. I usually use the flash compensation buttons in camera and then end up dragging the shutter indoors and can get a half decent result. However, from everything I've been told, I can use it off camera only if I have a sync chord to attach it to as opposed to wireless triggers, so I'm looking to get a new, better flash with more manual controls. Hope that helps some!

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01-21-2010, 10:07 AM	#16
graphicgr8s Guest	I use a couple of older flashes I use. A Pentax AF400T a Vivitar 285HV. I've been triggering them with this: A22 Flashpoint 4 Channel, Radio Remote Control Set, with Transmitter & Receiver with Shoes, Range of 65' So far all seems to be working well.

01-21-2010, 11:45 AM	#17
indytax Veteran Member Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: Indianapolis, Indiana, USA Photos: Gallery Posts: 312	You don't need a Pentax-compatible flash at all, and if you're going to use it off camera there's absolutely no need for one. The P-TTL wireless capability of the 360 and 540 aren't what they're cracked up to be reliability wise. Additionally, they require a line of sight between the sensor on the flash and your camera, which if you're planning on using an umbrella probably won't work out too well. I second the recommendation of the older Nikon flashes like the SB-24, -25, -26, or even -28. I use the SB-25 both on and off camera with excellent results--I bought it used for around $80, IIRC. They are common in the used market, especially at local camera shops. The advantage of these models is that they have tilt and swivel heads and adjustable power settings from full power to 1/64th power (very important for off-camera use). You should also consider the LumoPro model sold by MPEX.com, which is a fully adjustible manual flash very popular with the Strobist set. They work in auto and manual mode, but they don't "talk" to your camera like P-TTL flashes do on camera (or with the P-TTL cord Russell mentioned). That only means that the camera doesn't control both the exposure and flash settings and do all the thinking for you. If you are interested in off-camera flash, you want to be able to do your own thinking so you have full creative control. I use the Cactus V4 triggers at MPEX and have found them to be very useful. They are more reliable that the older V2 models and trigger the flash though radiowaves rather than the optical systems used for TTL wireless setups.

01-22-2010, 07:49 AM	#18
jboyde Veteran Member Join Date: Apr 2009 Location: New York Posts: 328	Originally posted by indytax You don't need a Pentax-compatible flash at all, and if you're going to use it off camera there's absolutely no need for one. The P-TTL wireless capability of the 360 and 540 aren't what they're cracked up to be reliability wise. Additionally, they require a line of sight between the sensor on the flash and your camera, which if you're planning on using an umbrella probably won't work out too well. I second the recommendation of the older Nikon flashes like the SB-24, -25, -26, or even -28. I use the SB-25 both on and off camera with excellent results--I bought it used for around $80, IIRC. They are common in the used market, especially at local camera shops. The advantage of these models is that they have tilt and swivel heads and adjustable power settings from full power to 1/64th power (very important for off-camera use). You should also consider the LumoPro model sold by MPEX.com, which is a fully adjustible manual flash very popular with the Strobist set. They work in auto and manual mode, but they don't "talk" to your camera like P-TTL flashes do on camera (or with the P-TTL cord Russell mentioned). That only means that the camera doesn't control both the exposure and flash settings and do all the thinking for you. If you are interested in off-camera flash, you want to be able to do your own thinking so you have full creative control. I use the Cactus V4 triggers at MPEX and have found them to be very useful. They are more reliable that the older V2 models and trigger the flash though radiowaves rather than the optical systems used for TTL wireless setups. Actually, I've been pretty impressed with the wireless PTTL reach. I don't use it that often because it does somewhat restrict creative control, like you mentioned. For example, you can only go +1 stop past the initial meter reading. I need +2 to turn my gray background white, so I'm forced to go manual with it. For the reach ,I've been able to use it outside in sunlight (just to test, wouldnt do that in real-life). The only problem I had was when I had the Lumiquest Softbox 3 on one of them as it blocked the sensor. Lumiquest does warn about this happening. Until every camera system has something like N*kon CLS then manual is the way to go. Even then, there's nothing like the consistency of manual power and learning lighting ratios to get the look you want.

02-01-2010, 04:31 PM	#19
BethC Veteran Member Join Date: Feb 2008 Location: Pennsylvannia Photos: Albums Posts: 377 Original Poster	Some of you have mentioned picking up a used Metz flash, but I'm having a hard time finding one. Besides the obvious...here and ebay, is there another place online that you can find used flashes and/or other equipment?

02-01-2010, 05:11 PM	#20
GeneV Veteran Member Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: Albuquerque NM Photos: Albums Posts: 9,830	Originally posted by jboyde Actually, I've been pretty impressed with the wireless PTTL reach. I don't use it that often because it does somewhat restrict creative control, like you mentioned. For example, you can only go +1 stop past the initial meter reading. I need +2 to turn my gray background white, so I'm forced to go manual with it. I've been impressed as well, especially if used in a reasonably sized room. For larger rooms, I also prefer multiple manual flashes with wireless triggers. One of the great things about the digital SLR is that it makes a great flash meter.

02-02-2010, 04:50 PM	#21
Arpe Pentaxian Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: New Zealand Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 4,452	Originally posted by jboyde Actually, I've been pretty impressed with the wireless PTTL reach. I don't use it that often because it does somewhat restrict creative control, like you mentioned. For example, you can only go +1 stop past the initial meter reading. I need +2 to turn my gray background white, so I'm forced to go manual with it. Try dialling +1 on the flash, and +1 on your flash comp on the camera. I believe they add together. Then use +/- comp for more variation, again, additive.

02-03-2010, 12:17 PM	#22
jboyde Veteran Member Join Date: Apr 2009 Location: New York Posts: 328	Originally posted by Arpe Try dialling +1 on the flash, and +1 on your flash comp on the camera. I believe they add together. Then use +/- comp for more variation, again, additive. Siiiigh, I wish it would work that way. I'm using 4 flashes on 3 different power settings (1/key, 1/fill, 2/background). If I use flash comp on the camera it would affect all of the flashes. Then I'd have to dial power down on the others. I have a gray muslin. I'm going to by white paper soon so I'll only need +1 to keep it white. Actually, I dont mind using manual. That way I can use my M lenses in studio without now having to turn my triggers on or off. Some of my good primes are pre-A.

03-23-2010, 12:44 AM	#23
ARSLONGA VITABREV New Member Join Date: Mar 2010 Location: new orleans Photos: Albums Posts: 9	Originally posted by BethC I have a K 10 D and a Promaster 7200EDF flash. I am ready to try my hand at some off camera flash and I have a ton of questions. I'd like to get a wireless trigger. But not exactly sure what I would look for. Do I need to get one designated for Pentax cameras? Or more dedicated to the flash? or a combination of both? Anyone have any recommendations? Is the Promaster flash I mentioned an okay one to start with for OCF and a shoot through umbrella? Or should I start saving for a different flash? I read a lot about Cactus triggers on another site, but most people on that site shoot Cannon or Nikon, so I'm not sure if that's something just for those brands. Any suggestions, comments, ideas are very much appreciated. I want to get started, but really don't know what to look for. Thanks in advance for any help! hi there, could you please help me with the choice of flashes? how is your7400EDF? does it support hss?

03-23-2010, 07:30 AM	#24
BethC Veteran Member Join Date: Feb 2008 Location: Pennsylvannia Photos: Albums Posts: 377 Original Poster	Hi! I'm not sure what Hss is, but...the flash is totally automatic. There are no controls on it at all. So it works just fine mounted on the camera. I usually use the flash compensation buttons in camera and then end up dragging the shutter indoors and can get a half decent result. However, from everything I've been told, I can use it off camera only if I have a sync chord to attach it to as opposed to wireless triggers, so I'm looking to get a new, better flash with more manual controls. Hope that helps some!