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06-23-2011, 05:23 AM - 1 Like   #166
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Well, what a reaction! I didn't realise there were so many marketing experts on this forum.

I do wonder, though, how many who have displayed such a negative response to the Q have actually talked to people who aren't enthusiasts and who've bought cameras other than in the DSLR part of the market. Sensor size isn't a restriction for most non-DSLR buyers. Camera size, weight and appearance are probably the first considerations, with performance factors following, but not necessarily the ones we care most about.

Some people, though, want a small camera that's a cut above the run-of-the-mill popular cameras, and the Q looks like a step up from the less-capable point-and-shoots, just like the Samsung EX-1 and the higher-end small-sensor Panasonics. Those are attractive options for people who don't want the bulk and weight of a DSLR, even the smaller ones. Who's to say an interchangeable lens system like this won't be the next step up?

Call the Q a toy if you like, but by doing so you're dismissing the many people who like the more delicate looks of smaller products (the Pentax 110 series looked like plastic toys, too, let's not forget, and we have no shortage of people on this Forum who express their affection for this "small-sensor" camera of yesteryear).

If you don't like it, then it probably isn't for you. Maybe Nikons and Canons aren't either, but that doesn't seem to stop other people buying them.

06-23-2011, 05:32 AM   #167
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As a collector and this comes in under $2K total system it's in my closet of goodies that's for sure.
06-23-2011, 05:32 AM   #168
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QuoteOriginally posted by ogl Quote
The sales will drop very soon when users will see the dust at photos...
Unsubstantiated bullshit. If the Q receives the same DRII dust removal as the K-5 then it will be right there among the cameras with the best dust removal systems. I change lenses on my K-5 on a daily basis, but there's still no dust to be seen.
06-23-2011, 05:42 AM   #169
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QuoteOriginally posted by timh Quote
Hipstamatic is about $2 and Instagram is free. They are also infinitely smaller.

If you are a bloody stupid optics company you try to sell a $800 piece of hardware that does the same thing and the market goes 'WTF?'
You've got to remember those $2 apps are used on $3-500 phones. Personally, I use a virginmobile LG phone that runs android 2.2, works great, cost $150 for the phone and $25 a month (300 minutes calling, unlimited everything else)...and still think it is too much!

If there are people out there who are willing to shell out $400 for a new Iphone and pay $60-80 a month for the accompanying plan, then there are people who will buy this camera.

06-23-2011, 05:43 AM   #170
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Oh man...

In a couple of months there will be a photo of the Q on failblog.org.

EPIC fail.

Pentax, stop selling toys.
06-23-2011, 05:49 AM   #171
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Lenses too big... But a truly unique system

That's an intriguing system but I'm mostly disappointed by the size of the lenses. I thought that using a tiny sensor would solve this problem shared by all MILC currently on the market. A fast pancake lens on this small camera would be great. I like the controls and the overall DSLR feel of the UI. The zoom will probably have one great feature: a mechanical zoom.

Another great use could be using adapters and long lenses. Imagine a 300mm on this camera to get the equivalent of a 1500mm telephoto.

Macro could also be benefiting a lot.

There are many possible niches as the camera is truly unique.
06-23-2011, 05:54 AM   #172
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The black verison looks kind of nice., The other verison looks like an expensive toy. Now we don't really know much about image quality. So we can say that much about the camera. Now if the image quality is better than the Canon G-12, Nikon P7000, Panasonic LX5 and Olympus XZ-1 then it just might sell really good. Otherwise why bother. My guess is that it will be in the why bother class.

I am really glad I brought my wife a Olympus E-PL-2 for her birthday tomorow. She wanted a new camera with better image quality than her Canon A-620 and not as big as my K-5. I just can not see the new Pentax system has image quality that much better than a P&S style camera.

Dave

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06-23-2011, 05:56 AM   #173
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QuoteOriginally posted by RobA_Oz Quote
Well, what a reaction! I didn't realise there were so many marketing experts on this forum.

I do wonder, though, how many who have displayed such a negative response to the Q have actually talked to people who aren't enthusiasts and who've bought cameras other than in the DSLR part of the market. Sensor size isn't a restriction for most non-DSLR buyers. Camera size, weight and appearance are probably the first considerations, with performance factors following, but not necessarily the ones we care most about.

Some people, though, want a small camera that's a cut above the run-of-the-mill popular cameras, and the Q looks like a step up from the less-capable point-and-shoots, just like the Samsung EX-1 and the higher-end small-sensor Panasonics. Those are attractive options for people who don't want the bulk and weight of a DSLR, even the smaller ones. Who's to say an interchangeable lens system like this won't be the next step up?

Call the Q a toy if you like, but by doing so you're dismissing the many people who like the more delicate looks of smaller products (the Pentax 110 series looked like plastic toys, too, let's not forget, and we have no shortage of people on this Forum who express their affection for this "small-sensor" camera of yesteryear).

If you don't like it, then it probably isn't for you. Maybe Nikons and Canons aren't either, but that doesn't seem to stop other people buying them.
Nice post.

I think the Q is a well thought out system that fills a niche. It has 2 serious issues:

1) Price. Way too high. Even if the IQ is acceptable for what is the glorified, customizable P&S the main body and kit lens is 2-3 price points above where it needs to be. We'll have to see the street vs. MSRP, but Hoya's in silly land right now.

2) Sensor size. If you're going to make a mini-DSLR-like-mirrorless system, you need to go after the margins where the competitors are: G12, LX-5, S95, etc. The stated price and that too small sensor work against that sweet part of the market. They needed to at least match the G12 sensor size.

I strongly suspect that, looking at the Engadget video, the lens mount can accommodate a much larger sensor, but plain old economics forced them to something smaller. One can only hope.

It is a tiny system:



06-23-2011, 06:05 AM   #174
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Let me put this another way:

If the sensor was 20-25% bigger and the kit package came in at MSRP US$649, and all the other lenses and Pentax brand accessories came in combined with the camera kit at US$1,000, Pentax would have a runaway hit (so long as the IQ and low-light capacity was equal to or better than the S95, LX-5, etc. competition).
06-23-2011, 06:06 AM   #175
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QuoteOriginally posted by pxpaulx Quote
You've got to remember those $2 apps are used on $3-500 phones. Personally, I use a virginmobile LG phone that runs android 2.2, works great, cost $150 for the phone and $25 a month (300 minutes calling, unlimited everything else)...and still think it is too much!

If there are people out there who are willing to shell out $400 for a new Iphone and pay $60-80 a month for the accompanying plan, then there are people who will buy this camera.
Nobody is going to buy a camera instead of an iPhone, and I'm pretty sure nobody (and certainly not a large enough number of people to constitute a hardware market) buys an iPhone just so they can use one of those $2 apps. They are so popular because they cost only $2 on top of existing expenditure. The Q will cost $800+ on top of existing expenditure, that's a different proposition.

You're right that some people are willing to spend lots of money, but they're either idiots, professionals or enthusiasts. Idiots will be swayed by bigger marketing machines (Sony, Canon, Nikon), professionals stick with what they know, and enthusiasts will be generally disappointed by the sensor.

IMHO, of course.
06-23-2011, 06:11 AM - 1 Like   #176
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Way to go, Pentax! If the dynamic range & noise characteristics are "good enough", then the only issue with the small format is depth of field, which is a non-issue for a great number of photographs and photographers. People are going to find using this thing and investing in this system to be very very different from XZ-1, G12, etcetera. I think this system's going to generate some Pentax love!

Every one who is paying $800 on starting a camera kit from scratch eventually realizes, usually to their surprise, that this amount of money will not buy you anything that's going to cover all situations. This kit is no different. It covers situations such as "I can't seem to get the kids in focus indoors" situation, for instance, the "taking low-light landscapes without a tripod" situation, and the "can't wait for lens to unpack itself from inside the camera" situation. Anyone who's ever taken along multiple cameras on a trip just for recording memories is going to take a long look at this.

Highlights, for me, compared to digicams: focus and zoom control on the lens, where it should be. High quality OVF optional. Standard filter threads (I think). Lenses you'd want to keep for many years (assuming they are worthy of the Pentax name).

Weight is 235g including memory card, battery, and lens. That is indeed a small camera.

Due to the large depth of field, issues of keeping everybody in focus in videos will be virtually non-existant, unlike your typical entry-level DSLR. And look at the number of physical controls, and the hotshoe, compared to the GF3.

Nice to see Pentax still mixing it up and throwing punches!

Last edited by Michael Barker; 06-23-2011 at 06:26 AM.
06-23-2011, 06:12 AM   #177
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QuoteOriginally posted by UdonUdon Quote
Imaging Resource has a good preview, and some really interesting images.



Nice Pictures, gives a true sense of scale

I've been trying to think about where this would sell. I think with the TOY lenses the Lomography store is the outlet. IQ is not a concern to there clients generally, but fun and funky is. and it isn't all about cheap some of the pieces they sell are not cheap if you've ever been in the stores
i know lomo is all about film, but this could be there digital option

Joking aside i think it looks pretty nice in Black, but agree the white doesn't work (for me, i'll bet there are people who will like it though)
Seems pricey, but my guess is it won't hold at that price (MSRP is rarely what you will pay)
with the prime and the fisheye i think it could be a cool little toy with some serious control, and the toy lenses are likely to really end up at $100, so not a huge price for some fun
If you are thinking this would be your replacement system for DSLR then i see the complaints.
It's a niche (so is Lomography and look how big they have gotten)
06-23-2011, 06:12 AM   #178
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Pentax won't make APS-C camera system. Pentax Q is new niche - P&S camera with interchangeable lenses. It's ALL.
06-23-2011, 06:20 AM   #179
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I really don't see who this camera is built for. It's small but anyone technical is going to bash it for the small sensor size. Anyone non-technical will not pay out the $$$ for a small camera with a prime 47mm lens. Where they could get a superzoom for the same price range or less. If they were to make it weather resistant then I could see something special for it as a good carry around but it is not. I think it's going to be a flop and go down as a footnote in what not to build for other manufacturers.

However with that said I thought they said two camera systems were in the works rumor wise. Any chance the APS-C with a K mount mirrorless?

But I am willing to hold off in condemning the Q until the final production model. Perhaps there will be that wow factor in the pictures that could justify it.
06-23-2011, 06:20 AM   #180
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Cute camera in black, but image quality needs to match the G-12, LX-5 and XZ-1 and price like those cameras if image quality is equal to those cameras. Otehr wise it is over price.

Anyhow, my first thought is that: "is that what Pentax wasted ther R&D money on instead of comping out with a 1.4xTC, a super-telephoto (>300mm) , a super-wide (DA*8-16) or fast WR normal lens (DA*30/1.4)." Looks like the new lenses are mostly "toy lenses".

I really don't like the direction Pentax is heading. Looks like I will need to start saving money (not buy Pentax stuff) so I can jump ship to a camera maker that caters to the high-end user.

Dave
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