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12-17-2012, 10:25 AM   #1
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Q + 02 zoom flash exposure indoors

I'd like to see if ya'll are getting the same results when using the 02 zoom with the built-in flash..
It would seem to me (and most programmed cameras will do this correctly), that the cam should adjust the flash output to deal with the variable aperture of a zoom lens (2.8 to 4.5 in this case). So with the Q on any auto setting, with the lens at 28mm / 2.8 I get a decent exposed flash image. Now zoom in to 85mm / 4.5 (as indicated on cam display), and the flash exposure is at least one stop underexposed! This makes no sense, and imho renders this cam+lens combo kinda useless for even average, everyday indoor shots.. what gives? have you had similar experiences?

Btw, the +- flash 'adjustment' seems to have no effect on this.

Thx!

12-17-2012, 10:57 AM   #2
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Maybe the flash isn't strong enough for the shot you are attempting? Have you updated the firmware of the lens and the camera? I haven't tried the combo of flash and the zoom so I'm just guessing.
12-17-2012, 11:11 AM   #3
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QuoteOriginally posted by digital029art Quote
I'd like to see if ya'll are getting the same results when using the 02 zoom with the built-in flash..
It would seem to me (and most programmed cameras will do this correctly), that the cam should adjust the flash output to deal with the variable aperture of a zoom lens (2.8 to 4.5 in this case). So with the Q on any auto setting, with the lens at 28mm / 2.8 I get a decent exposed flash image. Now zoom in to 85mm / 4.5 (as indicated on cam display), and the flash exposure is at least one stop underexposed! This makes no sense, and imho renders this cam+lens combo kinda useless for even average, everyday indoor shots.. what gives? have you had similar experiences?

Btw, the +- flash 'adjustment' seems to have no effect on this.

Thx!
The flash guide number is 5.6, so it's fairly weak. Anything more than about 15 feet away may end up being underexposed. Also, make sure you pop the flash up.

We'd love some sample pics, btw!

Adam
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12-17-2012, 11:58 AM   #4
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Most likely the flash does not have enough power to expose correctly at F4.5 for the distance and ISO used.

Try to take a picture at 28mm using F4.5 and compare it with the one at F2.8. If the F4.5 is underexposed then definitely you are running low on power. Your options are to increase ISO or to get closer to get a proper exposure.

12-17-2012, 12:11 PM   #5
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QuoteOriginally posted by demp10 Quote
Most likely the flash does not have enough power to expose correctly at F4.5 for the distance and ISO used.

Try to take a picture at 28mm using F4.5 and compare it with the one at F2.8. If the F4.5 is underexposed then definitely you are running low on power. Your options are to increase ISO or to get closer to get a proper exposure.
Or do the fun thing and attach a big flash on the Q, it looks "Qute".
12-17-2012, 01:00 PM   #6
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In addition to the suggestion to pop the flash up (it really does help, particularly on the zoom), you can also manually increase the power on the Q by going into the flash menu and pushing the down arrow key, then use the wheel to adjust the power output of the flash upwards up to +1.0 or downward up to -2.0.
12-17-2012, 03:16 PM   #7
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Thanks for the replies. I've pretty much tried all those mentioned (power adjustment, popped-up, etc).
I mean, the subject was a room wall about 12 feet away, typical for indoor family pics. So if I zoom in on a face, I'd expect a properly exposed image.
Shouldn't a cam of this type take care of this for me all by itself? For instance the k-01 with a similar type kit zoom exposes perfectly as expected!

What I'd like to know if others have experienced this for themselves?!

P.S. Absolutely I will NOT attach a flash larger than the cam .. that's just wrong!
12-17-2012, 04:10 PM   #8
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QuoteOriginally posted by digital029art Quote
I mean, the subject was a room wall about 12 feet away, typical for indoor family pics. So if I zoom in on a face, I'd expect a properly exposed image.
That may be just too long.

According to the manual (page 57) "the build-in flash is optimum for a subject at a distance from 0.7m to 3m" presumably at 125 ISO and with the 01 lens wide open.

What ISO are you using? Try one or two stops higher and see if it better exposed.

To expose correctly at 125 ISO with a F4.5 lens (the tele end), the subject must be at most 4 feet from the lens. At F2.8 (the wide end) the distance can be up to 6.7 feet.

If you increase the ISO to 200 then you get 5.2 and 8.3 feet.

You will need more than 800 ISO to cover the 12 foot distance at the tele (F4.5) setting.

12-18-2012, 08:54 AM   #9
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Thanks guyz! I guess I overestimated the Q flash output, so yeah bumping iso up to 200 makes for perfect exposures now!
12-18-2012, 12:16 PM - 1 Like   #10
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QuoteOriginally posted by digital029art Quote

P.S. Absolutely I will NOT attach a flash larger than the cam .. that's just wrong!
Hi digital029art,

For an external flash, take a look at the Metz 24 AF1 for P-TTL only and the Metz 20 C2 for a manual/auto thyristor alternative. They are essentially the same size (close in L and W to a pack of cigarettes), only use 2 AAs, so battery weight is low, have a tilting reflector for bouncing the flash, and have a GN of 24(m) at ISO 100, so have easily over 4x the power of the pop up Q flash (GN of 5.6 (m) at ISO 125). The 24 AF1 is usually $89.95, and the 20 C2 is normally $49.95. They are no more of a size mismatch with the Q as just about any external flash on a DSLR.

Metz mecablitz 24AF-1 Digital Flash for Pentax Camera MZ 24317PS

Metz mecablitz 20 C-2 Auto Flash MZ 20220 B&H Photo Video

Here's a quick snap to give you a size perspective

Scott
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12-18-2012, 03:48 PM   #11
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QuoteOriginally posted by snostorm Quote
Hi digital029art,

For an external flash, take a look at the Metz 24 AF1 for P-TTL only and the Metz 20 C2 for a manual/auto thyristor alternative. They are essentially the same size (close in L and W to a pack of cigarettes), only use 2 AAs, so battery weight is low, have a tilting reflector for bouncing the flash, and have a GN of 24(m) at ISO 100, so have easily over 4x the power of the pop up Q flash (GN of 5.6 (m) at ISO 125). The 24 AF1 is usually $89.95, and the 20 C2 is normally $49.95. They are no more of a size mismatch with the Q as just about any external flash on a DSLR.

Metz mecablitz 24AF-1 Digital Flash for Pentax Camera MZ 24317PS

Metz mecablitz 20 C-2 Auto Flash MZ 20220 B&H Photo Video

Here's a quick snap to give you a size perspective

Scott
This answers a lot of questions for me about getting a small flash for the Q. My 540FGZ is a bit much to try to balance on the Q and I was looking at some of the smaller flashes but wasnt sure how they would look. Judging from the pic above, that looks like it fits and balances well with the Q...
12-18-2012, 08:02 PM   #12
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I've used my B&H flas on the Q, but its rather large and comical.

Last edited by Docrwm; 12-18-2012 at 08:31 PM.
12-18-2012, 11:17 PM   #13
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An older Vivitar Auto Thyristor flash (powered by 2 AA's) should do you very well and not look too silly. You'll have to shoot in manual, but the flash takes care of exposure.

Only problem seems to be, I can't find a SMALL tilt/swivel flash! I almost never bounce off the ceiling -- makes shadows under the eyes. I try and bounce off of a wall for side lighting instead.

Charles.
12-19-2012, 08:41 AM   #14
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The Pentax AF200T may also be a good companion. It is very cheap, it is not that big, it has 2 auto modes, the guide number is 20 at 100 ISO and it has manual power control at Full, 1/2, 1/4 and 1/8. It uses 4 AA batteries, so it adds some weight, but it will last for a long time before recharging.
12-19-2012, 03:40 PM   #15
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QuoteOriginally posted by ChopperCharles Quote
An older Vivitar Auto Thyristor flash (powered by 2 AA's) should do you very well and not look too silly. You'll have to shoot in manual, but the flash takes care of exposure.

Only problem seems to be, I can't find a SMALL tilt/swivel flash! I almost never bounce off the ceiling -- makes shadows under the eyes. I try and bounce off of a wall for side lighting instead.

Charles.
Hi Charles,

Bounce off of the ceiling and add a small bounce card on the flash to direct some of the light forward to eliminate the raccoon eyes. Swivel is nice to have, but I don't require it on a gun. Tilt is another thing -- but even this can be worked around.

Scott
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