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12-26-2012, 11:05 PM   #1
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No Shot Preview !?

I try to use manual mode most of the time on my cameras. With the K7 I can pull the main switch to the preview position or in Liveview, my S95 gives an instant preview on the LCD in Manual. I see a preview of the image based on the aperture and shutter settings. Makes sense.
On the Q I do not, even when the shutter release is half pressed. The result is I can't tell how light or dark the shot will be until I take the photo.
What have I missed?

12-27-2012, 12:08 AM   #2
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It should on the Q as well, unless of course you're using flash.

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12-27-2012, 12:12 AM   #3
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Nope. No flash.
When I half depress the shutter release the screen does some sort of refresh, but it's not giving any feedback preview based on the current aperture.
12-27-2012, 12:47 AM   #4
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Hi sledger,

It looks like you're correct.

In Av, at least though, when you dial in Ev comp, the screen darkens or lightens and gives you a WYSIWYG preview.

The only explanation I can suggest is that the engineers designed the LCD to give an accurate view of what a well exposed image would look like. In Manual Mode, you get a superimposed meter line that shows fractional stops of over or underexposure. Center the meter, and you get what you see, otherwise, you need to guesstimate what you'd get taking into account the metering line. Though there actually is some logic to this, I think a preview switch would be a good idea. It's actually possible to go all the way from a black screen underexposure or a totally blown overexposure but on the LCD you still see a correctly exposed scene before you take the shot.

Personally, I can work around this. Press the green button to put you on the program line for a given aperture/shutter, then adjust the exposure parameters from there. Want to see exactly what you'd get on the LCD, switch to AV, dial in your choice of whatever amount of over or under you want and it will be on the screen, including a histogram if you want it.YMMV, of course.

Scott

12-27-2012, 12:57 AM   #5
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Thanks, Scott..

QuoteOriginally posted by snostorm Quote
Center the meter, and you get what you see
You would expect so, but it's not always the case, I find the Q over exposes by a couple of stops.

QuoteOriginally posted by snostorm Quote
It's actually possible to go all the way from a black screen underexposure or a totally blown overexposure but on the LCD you still see a correctly exposed scene before you take the shot.
Exactly. When I want to seriously underexpose the foreground to get a small opening of light which shows a scene through it, I don't get the preview I expect - I have to shoot and pray.
Maybe I'm expecting too much for what is essentially a fun novelty camera

I'm also finding the shutter lag very frustrating, especially when trying to catch a shot of the cat (who always turns his head away the instant I press the shutter release )

One thing I have found helpful is the MF 4x assist. I get much sharper images than using AF.

Cheers
12-27-2012, 02:04 AM   #6
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QuoteOriginally posted by sledger Quote
Thanks, Scott..


You would expect so, but it's not always the case, I find the Q over exposes by a couple of stops.
Have you tried the different metering modes? I find that Center weighted with a little negative Ev comp works pretty well for most, and maybe over a stop to keep blowing out bright whites in an otherwise darkish scene. Perhaps another of the three choices might expose more correctly for you, even if it seem counter-intuitive. A consistent over /under is relatively easy to work around. In M mode, you do have a metering line to go by, and can compensate for a consistent exposure error.

QuoteQuote:
Exactly. When I want to seriously underexpose the foreground to get a small opening of light which shows a scene through it, I don't get the preview I expect - I have to shoot and pray.
Maybe I'm expecting too much for what is essentially a fun novelty camera
You can get a preview of the exposure as I described by going into Av mode and using Ev comp to see what amount of underexposure you'll need. Ev comp does give you a preview. It might be worth while trying either Av or Tv modes instead of M -- Personally, I only use M to keep the exposure of a given object in the frame consistent for repeat shots, with the Q, to control shutter speed with flash, or to use some mildly advanced flash techniques with my DSLRs. Other than those, I haven't found much practical reason to use M mode in any of my cameras so I don't. If you're relying on the camera's metering system, and there's really no good reason not to, then using the semi-auto modes make sense since you're relying on the program line in the camera to make suggestions for how a scene should be exposed.

QuoteQuote:
I'm also finding the shutter lag very frustrating, especially when trying to catch a shot of the cat (who always turns his head away the instant I press the shutter release )
I think it's more that the LCD lags -- the main reason I previously refused to go mirrorless --with the Q, it's certainly not state of the are fast, but fast is probably not in the cards for the Q. Size considerations will probably always trump processing power for the designers. The shutter lag is actually not too bad. I find that I can time it reasonably well at this point, and am looking for ways to work around the LCD except for focusing with adapted lenses.

If you're shooting the zoom, you might take a look at the Yashica Electro 35 Wide -Tele optical viewfinder -- there have also been some 3rd party mfgs that have made wide and tele converter kits for this camera with similar VFs. You will probably have to adjust the frame lines mentally a bit, but it will give you a true real time VF. I shoot the prime with a Leica Brightline 50 OVF, and turn the LCD off. I use the ovf to frame the shot, half press and wait for the beep, then shoot when the moment comes. The shutter itself actuates very quickly.

Cats are always tough to shoot -- I have the same problem with my DSRLs an OVFs with no lag Mine are devils, have precognition and know now to pose innocently, then turn their heads precisely when I press the shutter

QuoteQuote:
One thing I have found helpful is the MF 4x assist. I get much sharper images than using AF.
I've not found this the case with the AF Q system lenses. They do occasionally lock on the wrong thing, but I leave Focus Peaking on. It's a little annoying, but it provides a backup focus confirmation for me with the AF lenses.

Scott
12-27-2012, 02:26 AM   #7
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I noticed this shooting the moon last night; my shot was a correctly exposed moon (maybe slightly underexposed) in manual mode but the preview showed it way overexposed. I guess the preview was "correctly" exposing the image based on the average brightness of the scene - which was dominated by the dark sky.

Last edited by NeilGratton; 12-27-2012 at 06:03 AM.
12-27-2012, 05:02 AM   #8
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@Scott
Thank you for taking the time to respond in so much detail.

QuoteQuote:
In M mode, you do have a metering line to go by, and can compensate for a consistent exposure error
Yes of course, and I use this - be silly not to But this doesn't solve the issue.

QuoteQuote:
It might be worth while trying either Av or Tv modes instead of M
Personally I'm not interested in modes other than 'M' and with respect, as my thread is about preview while using 'M', it still doesn't solve the issue.

QuoteQuote:
If you're shooting the zoom
No, I only have the 01 prime with no plans to buy another lens or converter kits at this time. I didn't buy the Q as a base system to collect accessories and lenses for it.
It was an impulse buy seeing at the prices dropped to AUD$299 in November/December from it's original rrp of AUD$849, I grabbed one
(Actually, the K-01 also dropped to AUD$299 for the body only, which was also tempting, but that rubber flap would p*ss me off in no time!)

QuoteQuote:
Mine are devils, have precognition and know now to pose innocently, then turn their heads precisely when I press the shutter
You're not wrong. Though the K-7 is perfect and I get great shots, so the lag between pressing the shutter and a photo actually being taken on the Q is a little annoying.

QuoteQuote:
I leave Focus Peaking on. It's a little annoying
I find it distracting and much more than a little annoying. I don't get better results using it, so I disabled it.

I guess we all have different opinions and preferences, no doubt I'll arrive at what I am most comfortable with when using the Q just as you seem to have

@Niel
Yes, I think I need to develop a new 'sense' with the Q.

Cheers
Steve

12-27-2012, 05:59 AM - 1 Like   #9
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"I'm also finding the shutter lag very frustrating, especially when trying to catch a shot of the cat (who always turns his head away the instant I press the shutter release )"

Either turn off SR or set it to be active all the time, either helps reduce the shutter lag a little. In its default state it only activates when you take the picture and it adds lag while the system kicks in. Would be nice if a future firmware activated SR on half shutter press.

Shawn
12-27-2012, 06:06 AM   #10
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QuoteOriginally posted by Shawn67 Quote
Would be nice if a future firmware activated SR on half shutter press.
According to the manual and my observations, it does just that already, Shawn.
You will see the SR 'hand' icon turn full green when the button is half pressed and active.

Last edited by Steve.Ledger; 03-21-2013 at 10:29 PM.
12-27-2012, 07:18 AM   #11
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"According to the manual and my observations, it does just that already, Shawn."

Nope, take the lens off when it says it is active and you will see the sensor does not move at all when half pressing the shutter release. Set it to mode 2 and you will see/hear the sensor moving. Likewise, use a large adapted lens and the difference in stability between mode 1 with shutter half pressed and Mode 2 is plainly obvious on the LCD. Lastly, shutter lag is much reduced between the two.

Shawn
12-27-2012, 10:38 AM   #12
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QuoteOriginally posted by Shawn67 Quote
use a large adapted lens and the difference in stability between mode 1 with shutter half pressed and Mode 2 is plainly obvious on the LCD. Shawn
You are correct it is a lot easier to focus with long lenses when you are looking at a stabilized LCD display, I have been using the other option to save batteries but I have 4 and they are easy to carry, I will leave the SR running from now on.

Hans
12-27-2012, 11:18 AM   #13
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Hans,

It does kill the battery much quicker but like you I have several spares so I just leave it on all the time. Would be nice if it actually activated on half shutter press and had an option to not cancel the MF zoom on half shutter press as well. That is how I use MF lenses on the OMD and it is very effective without the battery penalty.

Shawn
12-27-2012, 04:51 PM   #14
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@Shawn
So you are saying the manual is wrong?

I find that if I half depress the shutter button and deliberately shake the camera a little, the SR icon remains white (not activated), only when you hold steady and the SR kicks in does it go green and lock.
Setting SR to always on also resulted in the SR noise being heard all the time (as well as draining the battery) which was annoying.
I am satisfied that it works as described in the manual on half press.

I'm not going to be using large adapted lenses with the Q. I see little point in buying the worlds smallest mirrorless camera that fits in your pocket only to turn it into another system that needs a bag with accessories.

Anyway, we've gone off topic now..
Pity I can't get an accurate preview before firing

Cheers
Steve
12-27-2012, 05:42 PM   #15
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I've discovered what works well for me in Manual mode.

[1] Set to spot or centre weighted metering
[2] Point to the light source to expose for
[3] centre the exposure metering
[4] Lock the exposure (I have the green button assigned to this)
[5] Focus and shoot...

Preview on the LCD matches the shot perfectly.
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