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05-16-2021, 11:28 PM   #16
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QuoteOriginally posted by kwb Quote
There are many examples on flickr.
iPhone (and other cellphones) with 13mm FF-equivalent FOV: Search: 1.54mm | Flickr
Q 08 (~18mm FF-equivalent FOV at the wide end on Q7): Flickr: The 08 WIDE ZOOM Pool
Q 03 (~15mm FF-equivalent FOV on Q7): Flickr: The Pentax Q 03 Fisheye Pool

As far as IQ goes, Q shots look much more pleasing than cellphone ultrawides to me though there are over-processed Q shots too. Sensor for ultra-wide iPhone cameras is tinier, at least for now, than already tiny Q series sensors. Crop factor of these is 13/1.54~8.4(!!) VS ~4.7 for Q7/Q-S1 and ~5.5 for Q.

However, if IQ were everything I won't be using Q7.

Wider FOV might be genuinely useful for some situations. If I have one of these phones (which I don't) I won't hesitate to use its ultra-wide thing whenever it's convenient. Convenience matters to me.
Didn't realize the phone's sensor was that much smaller than the Q.

Thanks,
barondla

05-17-2021, 08:28 AM   #17
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QuoteOriginally posted by kwb Quote
There are many examples on flickr.
iPhone (and other cellphones) with 13mm FF-equivalent FOV: Search: 1.54mm | Flickr
Q 08 (~18mm FF-equivalent FOV at the wide end on Q7): Flickr: The 08 WIDE ZOOM Pool
Q 03 (~15mm FF-equivalent FOV on Q7): Flickr: The Pentax Q 03 Fisheye Pool

As far as IQ goes, Q shots look much more pleasing than cellphone ultrawides to me though there are over-processed Q shots too. Sensor for ultra-wide iPhone cameras is tinier, at least for now, than already tiny Q series sensors. Crop factor of these is 13/1.54~8.4(!!) VS ~4.7 for Q7/Q-S1 and ~5.5 for Q.

However, if IQ were everything I won't be using Q7.

Wider FOV might be genuinely useful for some situations. If I have one of these phones (which I don't) I won't hesitate to use its ultra-wide thing whenever it's convenient. Convenience matters to me.
I'd say that the better comparison is stuff like the Xiaomi Mi 10 (Reflection | My all time high is also from this location: ww? | Flickr, for example). It has a bigger UWA sensor than the iPhone.
05-17-2021, 08:24 PM   #18
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Interesting discussion, I don't have a Q but I do have the iphone11. I admit I don't take lots of pictures with it but did have the occasion last week to shoot a pano with it. It turned out ok and I didn't have to process and stitch several frames together. Of course family thought it was fantastic, all viewing on their phones. Not so great when viewed on a full size monitor but worked in a pinch. I guess you need to know your audience.
05-17-2021, 08:33 PM   #19
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QuoteOriginally posted by fuzzyphotos Quote
Interesting discussion, I don't have a Q but I do have the iphone11. I admit I don't take lots of pictures with it but did have the occasion last week to shoot a pano with it. It turned out ok and I didn't have to process and stitch several frames together. Of course family thought it was fantastic, all viewing on their phones. Not so great when viewed on a full size monitor but worked in a pinch. I guess you need to know your audience.
Absolutely correct. The unrealistic expectations we have for detail are not shared by many of our families.

05-18-2021, 01:44 AM   #20
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How about adapting one of these for the Q? Supposedly an ultra wide linear CS mount lens. THEIA SL183M CS Lens 1.8-3MM F1.8 Pro 4K Manual Iris HD 1080p ultra wide

Theia SL183M CS Lens 1.8-3mm F1.8 Pro 4k Manual Iris HD 1080p Ultra Wide for sale online | eBay
05-18-2021, 03:43 AM - 1 Like   #21
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QuoteOriginally posted by fuzzyphotos Quote
Interesting discussion, I don't have a Q but I do have the iphone11. I admit I don't take lots of pictures with it but did have the occasion last week to shoot a pano with it. It turned out ok and I didn't have to process and stitch several frames together. Of course family thought it was fantastic, all viewing on their phones. Not so great when viewed on a full size monitor but worked in a pinch. I guess you need to know your audience.
Yeap... the "phoneness" of the images is still noticeable on a phone screen, but they look good enough.

I have to say that my family knows straight away that I sent a phone snapshot* even through whatsapp's compression... so I wanna believe that my sending them lots of K-1 photos has created some standard for them

*Typical comments are "the sky is nowhere near as spectacular as with the camera" but my Nokia has nonexistent DR so it tends to flatten the images a lot. I also blame my lack of technique and care while composing with the phone .
05-18-2021, 07:11 PM - 2 Likes   #22
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I have a Huawei Mate 20 X which has quite a good camera and ultra wide.
I also have the Q7, fisheye and 08 wide.

The phone straight out beats the Q7 when it comes to convenient results.
The AI seamlessly does up the HDR in tricky lighting (and it uses the average exposure based on the focus area the finger sets it to )
A Q7 shot will potentially need RAW, filter, tripod, etc to get 2-3 exposures in tricky lighting.


The phone IQ looks great when viewed on phones. (small screen, pumped up contrast/colors )
With ppl mainly using phones as their only viewing medium, its the right thing for the viewership, which is why they have been so successful.
For better IQ that can stand up to larger/better screens/resolutions, the Q7 is better.


Sometimes I feel frustrated with the Q7 IQ.
The DR is not there (I am spoiled by the K1 )
Where it works, I think are in scenes where there is less need to pull/push the highlights and shadows.

Q7+08




05-19-2021, 06:52 AM   #23
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To me the great fail of the Q series is lens availability. I really think very wide aperture lenses were needed. The Panasonic LX-7 has an f1.4-2.3 zoom on a similar sized sensor. The fast zoom helps a lot in capturing scenes at lower iso. But faster lenses would also be largerů .
05-19-2021, 08:58 AM   #24
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QuoteOriginally posted by Serkevan Quote
I'd say that the better comparison is stuff like the Xiaomi Mi 10 (Reflection | My all time high is also from this location: ww? | Flickr, for example). It has a bigger UWA sensor than the iPhone.
Thanks, that looks pretty good as a phone UWA especially at the center. At the corners/edges it looks quite blurry though, maybe it's the lens?

I sometimes wish handheld stacking like in this example were available on Q too. That will be super convenient for reducing noise (VS tripod and remote and stacking in post).
05-19-2021, 10:14 AM   #25
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QuoteOriginally posted by kwb Quote
Thanks, that looks pretty good as a phone UWA especially at the center. At the corners/edges it looks quite blurry though, maybe it's the lens?

I sometimes wish handheld stacking like in this example were available on Q too. That will be super convenient for reducing noise (VS tripod and remote and stacking in post).
Yeah, it suffers at the edges, but still... it's a phone with a 13mm equivalent lens and pretty good center detail even on a 22" screen. The only options my K-1 has to even get *that* wide are the the Irix 11mm or the Laowa 12mm!


Honestly, if I ever buy a smartphone for its camera, it will be only so I can use the UWA, since it's the one lens that is somewhat impractical or expensive to replicate on a DSLR. Every other smartphone lens gets stomped with a cheap and cheerful 50/1.7 or any kit zoom
05-19-2021, 06:02 PM - 4 Likes   #26
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QuoteOriginally posted by UncleVanya Quote
To me the great fail of the Q series is lens availability. I really think very wide aperture lenses were needed. The Panasonic LX-7 has an f1.4-2.3 zoom on a similar sized sensor. The fast zoom helps a lot in capturing scenes at lower iso. But faster lenses would also be largerů .
Too hard and too expensive
Just look at the 08 wide.
They bothered with it and most just did not want to spend the money.


For me, the 01 prime is decent enough as a fast lens.
The 06 zoom isn't too bad either.

With the 01




With the 06


05-27-2021, 07:08 PM - 1 Like   #27
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I'll just chime in here, since I own both a Q7 and an iPhone 11 Pro (the one with 3 lenses).

The iPhone is basically always with me, and it's great for casual snapshots to be viewed on another phone, which I think is exactly what the majority of people want. When the images are viewed on a large monitor, and when compared side-by-side with a "real camera", then the flaws become apparent. The photos are very over-processed. It is possible to work around that by getting camera apps that allow you to shoot raw images. However, my brief experience with those is that most of them are awkward and user-hostile, plus then you are giving up the computational photography features that are supposed to be a strength of phone cameras.

To me, the Q7 is far more capable and satisfying to use. To get good results it does require you to learn its quirks and how to deal with them. It's not as forgiving as some newer cameras, but the user interface is very good and helpful. And that is the other big advantage over a phone, because shooting with a phone is always a kind of awkward and crummy experience.
05-29-2021, 07:11 PM   #28
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QuoteOriginally posted by caliscouser Quote
Look like massive noise suppression combined with over sharpening and over saturation, just like my Samsung Galaxy.
Not sure if you can get RAW from the iPhone so maybe it would be better starting with that. I can't get RAW on my Samsung.

Q-S1 plus 08 blows it out of the water.

This is the Q-S1 plus 02, but I have this printed at 20 x 30 and it looks great. Tons of detail in the scaled up version.
Gorgeous photo on any camera. Like it more knowing it was made with our "little toy cameras" !
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