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09-13-2011, 06:41 PM   #1
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How Much Did You Spend (Invest) When Starting Up?

It's been a long road since I graduated from my photo school, stopped assisting, started working at a camera store. But now I'm finally in a spot where I really want to get back to focusing on weddings. I'm not quitting my day job, so I can keep paying my bills/rent etc from that. But I have gear I need, outside of just photo gear. A macbook, graphic design work, website stuff etc... I just want to know how much people started throwing down when they started their business? Lucky for me I don't have to bank a Nikon full frame system which I think is unnecessarily expensive for a starter, that saved me a ton of cash... But I've been accumulating a healthy bit of debt while putting myself in position to get through a wedding day, and really serve my clients as I think they should be. I'm not drowning in debt, but I am pretty much spending every dollar I make on my business.

Call me crazy, but I just need to check that that's what I should be doing right? It is true that a big investment in equipment and other things has to be made on the outset, and slowly over time you get into a position to turn a profit. You spend a little time in the red, but dig yourself out and start making cash...

...right?

Any starter tips would be appreciated.

09-14-2011, 01:46 PM   #2
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A new member says he's a wedding/portrait shooter in Calgary and lists his working gear:

2 K-7 bodies
DA* 16-50
DA* 50-135
2 AF540FGZ flashes and Cactus V4 triggers

That seems like a good place to start, along with a couple umbrellas. Or I've read of another wedding pro who just uses a Kx, kit.lens, and a big potato-masher flash. That sounds a little minimal to me. (My wedding shooting was an abject failure so I won't try to be a role-model.) Any business is a people business. Deal with people, and buy just enough gear to get the job done.

And see this: https://www.pentaxforums.com/forums/professional-photography-publications/150...ml#post1648316

Last edited by RioRico; 09-30-2011 at 04:29 PM.
09-14-2011, 03:48 PM   #3
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Well like I said in my OP I have all the photo gear I really need. Lenses and cameras and flashes etc... My expenses now are like getting a macbook or not (I have an iMac), getting graphic design done, a printed portfolio, marketing etc etc...

It all adds up. My real question was how much debt I should safely incur...
09-14-2011, 04:06 PM   #4
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Well, if you have everything you need, there is no need to invest, none whatsoever. Typically, businesses invest only in what they need to get the job done.

09-14-2011, 04:11 PM   #5
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QuoteOriginally posted by Sperdynamite Quote
Well like I said in my OP I have all the photo gear I really need. Lenses and cameras and flashes etc...
Sorry, I read your OP as saying exactly the opposite. You said,

QuoteQuote:
But I have gear I need, outside of just photo gear. A macbook, graphic design work, website stuff etc...
Which I read as, you have the macbook etc, and don't have photo gear.

QuoteQuote:
It all adds up. My real question was how much debt I should safely incur...
That comes down to your comfort level with debt. And, have you drafted a business plan? Do you have a reasonable forecast of income and expenses? Website design and maintenance: DIY, or contract for it, or get an off-the-shelf package? Will you buy traditional advertising? For portraiture, do you need studio space, and how much and where? Google for BUSINESS PLAN. Good luck!
09-14-2011, 08:13 PM   #6
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Yeah, haha, still writing the legit business plan. I'm treating this just like I was treating photo assisting. You don't write business plans at first, you get out there and find work. I'm a moonlighter at this point, and I think that's a good way to run a photography business. However I don't want to run it like a weekend warrior. There will be no selective black and white or girls posing with swords coming out of my portfolio. It's just hard to know on some things what's needed and what isn't. Sometimes the simplest things can go a long way, like one well thought out promo. But doing stuff like that is expensive!

I have a wedding this weekend and the K-5 is going to rock out that job.

I have 1 K-5 and 1 MZ-S
a 16-50mm
50-135mm
70mm 2.4
31mm 1.8
a 15mm f4
and a Metz AF-1

I also use an X100 and super 8 cameras thought out the day. It's going to be awesome. My clients this weekend are my first (solo) wedding. I've so far only 2nd shot the gigs, but I'm prepared and I'm hoping that they flip when they see what I deliver. They are friends of friends so I cut them a good deal ($1k for the day). Thus far I'm borrowing my girlfriend's macbook pro for back up, but I really think I should pick one up because it seems like I'll want a laptop for every job I do...
09-28-2011, 03:37 PM   #7
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QuoteOriginally posted by Sperdynamite Quote
Thus far I'm borrowing my girlfriend's macbook pro for back up, but I really think I should pick one up because it seems like I'll want a laptop for every job I do...

I'll quickly point out first, that I'm not a photographer. I've been into this as a hobby for the last year or so

Is there any particular reason you want a Macbook, as opposed to a standard (not Apple) laptop? What is it you want to use the laptop for? I'm not anti-Apple, but their products tend to be roughly twice as expensive as their PC counterparts. If you're just using it to show the photos to the client, pretty much anything will do, and you can use any existing computer you have to do PP at home.

QuoteOriginally posted by Sperdynamite Quote
I'm not drowning in debt, but I am pretty much spending every dollar I make on my business.
At the moment, you don't want to be spending money if you don't have to. A friend of mine did my wedding photos using a Nikon with just one or two lenses, a flash, and various settings. The photos were great, and my wife was happy. He didn't have a big bag full of kit, and didn't need it

09-30-2011, 03:32 PM   #8
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QuoteOriginally posted by RioRico Quote
A new member says he's a wedding/portrait shooter in Calgary and lists his working gear:

2 K-7 bodies
DA* 16-50
DA* 50-135
2 AF540FGZ flashes and Cactus V4 triggers

That seems like a good place to start, along with a couple umbrellas. Or I've read of another wedding pro who just uses a Kx, kit.lens, and a big potato-masher flash. That sounds a little minimal to me. (My wedding shooting was an abject failure so I won't try to be a role-mode.) Any business is a people business. Deal with people, and buy just enough gear to get the job done.
That would be me!

That list has actually grown since I posted that (and should have originally included an umbrella, small octobox, and collapsible reflector) but that's the heart of it. My wife is my second shooter, so between the two of us that pretty much covers our primary needs.

And I 100% agree with the bolded part in the above quoted post. At this point the business is still in the initial growth stage, so we've only added gear as funds allow and/or a need presented itself. And of course there are incidental costs such as spare memory cards and battery power (both camera and flash) that are needed for reliability, software that's needed to streamline the editing workflow, and business costs like licencing, registration, and insurance.

I don't see a problem in reinvesting all your photography income into the business for the time being, so long as doing so puts you in a position to offer an improved product in the future, or allows you to grow the business further.

I edit on a PC laptop, btw.
10-03-2011, 08:27 PM   #9
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Yeah, reinvesting I totally believe in. I believe I'm capable and have the ability to produce a high-end product. But there are cost associations with that. I put myself a little into debt getting everything I have now, which is a fairly complete kit. But then I think well...I could sure do some amazing things for clients on film, like some people are with a Contax 645. Or it would be great to have a laptop of dumping cards...or idk a better scanner for the film I currently do shoot. A friend of mine bought a 8K inkjet printer and started a fine art printing business. I haven't put myself THAT into debt, but I wonder if that's what it takes.
10-03-2011, 08:51 PM   #10
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QuoteOriginally posted by Sperdynamite Quote
I have a wedding this weekend and the K-5 is going to rock out that job.

I have 1 K-5 and 1 MZ-S
a 16-50mm
50-135mm
70mm 2.4
31mm 1.8
a 15mm f4
and a Metz AF-1

I also use an X100 and super 8 cameras thought out the day. It's going to be awesome. My clients this weekend are my first (solo) wedding. I've so far only 2nd shot the gigs, but I'm prepared and I'm hoping that they flip when they see what I deliver. They are friends of friends so I cut them a good deal ($1k for the day). Thus far I'm borrowing my girlfriend's macbook pro for back up, but I really think I should pick one up because it seems like I'll want a laptop for every job I do...
I'd only add a backup digital body to the mix (even a secondhand K-x) and another flash. For lenses you're covered. I'll even swap you my K-x for your MZ-S if you like
10-03-2011, 09:01 PM   #11
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Well I'm not doing weddings, but I dropped around $3000 on the K-5, Metz 58-AF2, 43mm Ltd (used), Grip, extra battery, 16Gb + 8Gb SDHC and the 18-135mm WR, I wouldn't have got the 18-135 in hindsight, the 18-55WR would be just fine, I could have put that extra money towards a DA 12-24 or DA 15. BUT If I was gearing that towards weddings, I would probably get the K-5w/Kit lens, Grip, DA*50-135 and a Metz 58-AF2 or AF540FGZ's and some difusers/light boxes and that will easily run up over $3000 Depends on what you really need and/or think you need. If your looking at needing a second body, as backup, I would suggest a K-r with the 2 kit lenses, hard to beat for the price!
10-04-2011, 09:41 AM   #12
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If you're doing weddings you must have a backup body. The MZ-S isn't going to cut it IMO ... as far as I can see you only have one full-frame lens anyway? (Sure, it's a nice one , but would you really want to shoot an entire wedding with it?)
10-04-2011, 09:42 AM   #13
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QuoteOriginally posted by Sperdynamite Quote
Yeah, reinvesting I totally believe in. I believe I'm capable and have the ability to produce a high-end product. But there are cost associations with that. I put myself a little into debt getting everything I have now, which is a fairly complete kit. But then I think well...I could sure do some amazing things for clients on film, like some people are with a Contax 645. Or it would be great to have a laptop of dumping cards...or idk a better scanner for the film I currently do shoot. A friend of mine bought a 8K inkjet printer and started a fine art printing business. I haven't put myself THAT into debt, but I wonder if that's what it takes.
Unless you're absolutely commited to the idea of doing a slideshow of your photos at the reception, then I think you can do without a laptop for the wedding day. If storage space is an issue I'd recommend purchasing some extra sd cards, which are good to have as backups anyway and are relatively cheap these days. Of course that's just my opinion, based on the weddings I've photographed. In my experience time is always a factor so setting up a slideshow or taking time to download my images during the day just isn't practical.

If you feel shooting film offers you an advantage in your local area, then that's probably something worth exploring.

I'd agree with the suggestions of a backup digital body though, even if you just rent one. In my mind reliability is key, and that's where most of my money has been spent. It all adds up quickly, but a camera, memory card, or battery failure can be disastrous without backups! I just invested in a K-5 for the improved dynamic range and noise performance, which means I now have 3 bodies and needed a larger bag to house everything, so of course it can snowball rather easily.

So I'd say it does take require carrying a certain amount of debt off the start. Of course the key to success lies more in your skills, experience, and ability to deal with people, but being professional also means you need to be prepared for any issues throughout the day, and that requires a certain amount of gear.
10-04-2011, 10:13 AM   #14
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More memory cards seconded. The imac is perfectly able. You don't "need" the laptop. I'd be less concerned about the memory cards failing and more concerned about the camera or a lens.
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