What would cause this odd flaring?

Sagitta · 01-27-2012, 12:13 PM

I tried googling this down with no luck, so I'm guessing someone here probably has an idea.

I'm thinking it's something to do with the aperture not behaving itself and not closing tight - but I could be wrong.

More importantly, is it something I could fix or should I just delegate this lens to daylight-only use?

The lens itself works fine, so long as I'm not expecting flare.

FWIW, its a $10 Sears 28mm lens, so I have no qualms going in and operating on it if its something easy I can fix myself.

Purposely choosing a shot that was blown out since it shows the oddball flaring off nicely.

JinDesu · 01-27-2012, 12:29 PM

that... is some serious flare...

What settings? wide open?

Sagitta · 01-27-2012, 12:40 PM

Originally posted by JinDesu

that... is some serious flare...

What settings? wide open?

No, that was stopped down somewhat. I couldn't say how much, simply because this was actually just a shot to test if I had the white balance set properly at the time. I'd guess f/4-ish or so? I wouldn't have had it stopped down too overly far from 2.8 (which would be wide open).

EDIT: On second glance, maybe that WAS wide open. I'll have to deliberately force a flare shot once It gets dark later to see if I can reproduce this wide open or not.

vonBaloney · 01-27-2012, 12:40 PM

Any filters on the lens?

This is not that unusual -- I have a few lenses that are prone to similar at night. Not multi-coated, I'm guessing?

Sagitta · 01-27-2012, 01:02 PM

Originally posted by vonBaloney

Any filters on the lens?

This is not that unusual -- I have a few lenses that are prone to similar at night. Not multi-coated, I'm guessing?

Nope, no filters. I found a wide-open shot (much faster exposure at 1/40 of a sec) I'll post in a bit. The lens says its multicoated, so it was coated by whatever company (or companies) did the Sears 28mm macro lenses back in the day.

I'd love to fix (or at least lessen) the effect if I can as its a nice solid little prime, but as I like taking night shots and see myself getting into it more now that I live 'in town' not being able to use the thing for long exposures would be unfortunate.

Sagitta · 01-27-2012, 01:16 PM

OK, this one is wide open, 1/40 second @ f2.8. You can still see the flaring (just not nearly as bad as the longer exposure had). If you look at it 100%, theres fringing going on with the flare as well - opposite sides of the lights between left and right side of the shot.

westmill · 01-27-2012, 01:43 PM

It might be worth trying a good multi coated filter ! If its an old lens, there is a good chance that the lens may have had its multicoating removed
with over zelous cleaning etc.

Sagitta · 01-27-2012, 01:56 PM

Originally posted by westmill

It might be worth trying a good multi coated filter ! If its an old lens, there is a good chance that the lens may have had its multicoating removed
with over zelous cleaning etc.

Shouldn't it be flaring evenly though? Even with the coating gone (if it is). It seems like the pattern going around the lights is off-kilter.

westmill · 01-27-2012, 02:07 PM

Its poss its worn patchy or anything ! Gotta be worth a try ! process of elimination an all that.

Wheatfield · 01-27-2012, 05:17 PM

That is actually two kinds of flare. The streaks coming off the lights are caused by reflections off the aperture blades. This particular flare does increase with longer exposure times. The other flare is veiling flare, and that is the bright looking "haze" that is very prevalent in the first image, and still quite strong in the second one.
There is no fixing either one. It is just normal properties of the lens you are using. Some lenses are better, some worse. This one happens to be worse (quite worse, actually).
It may be an excellent lens for other purposes, so do keep using it, and work to it's strengths.

vonBaloney · 01-27-2012, 05:59 PM

Originally posted by Wheatfield

That is actually two kinds of flare. The streaks coming off the lights are caused by reflections off the aperture blades.

I was wondering about that -- I have a cheap 400/6.3 telephoto with oily blades that flares like that. I wondered if the oil was causing it or making it worse.

Sagitta · 01-27-2012, 09:40 PM

Originally posted by vonBaloney

I was wondering about that -- I have a cheap 400/6.3 telephoto with oily blades that flares like that. I wondered if the oil was causing it or making it worse.

This prompted me to go hold the lens up in front of a bright light. I can see shiny marks on the blades that are either areas where the coating wore through or is maybe oil. It looks more 'scuffy' than oily, but the result is a shiny surface to them.

01-27-2012, 12:13 PM	#1
Sagitta Veteran Member Join Date: Feb 2011 Location: Maine Photos: Gallery Posts: 3,081	What would cause this odd flaring? I tried googling this down with no luck, so I'm guessing someone here probably has an idea. I'm thinking it's something to do with the aperture not behaving itself and not closing tight - but I could be wrong. More importantly, is it something I could fix or should I just delegate this lens to daylight-only use? The lens itself works fine, so long as I'm not expecting flare. FWIW, its a $10 Sears 28mm lens, so I have no qualms going in and operating on it if its something easy I can fix myself. Purposely choosing a shot that was blown out since it shows the oddball flaring off nicely.

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01-27-2012, 12:29 PM	#2
JinDesu Veteran Member Join Date: Jun 2011 Location: New York City Photos: Gallery Posts: 5,638	that... is some serious flare... What settings? wide open?

01-27-2012, 12:40 PM	#3
Sagitta Veteran Member Join Date: Feb 2011 Location: Maine Photos: Gallery Posts: 3,081 Original Poster	Originally posted by JinDesu that... is some serious flare... What settings? wide open? No, that was stopped down somewhat. I couldn't say how much, simply because this was actually just a shot to test if I had the white balance set properly at the time. I'd guess f/4-ish or so? I wouldn't have had it stopped down too overly far from 2.8 (which would be wide open). EDIT: On second glance, maybe that WAS wide open. I'll have to deliberately force a flare shot once It gets dark later to see if I can reproduce this wide open or not.

01-27-2012, 12:40 PM	#4
vonBaloney Pentaxian Join Date: Oct 2011 Location: Albuquerque, NM Posts: 6,029	Any filters on the lens? This is not that unusual -- I have a few lenses that are prone to similar at night. Not multi-coated, I'm guessing?

01-27-2012, 01:02 PM	#5
Sagitta Veteran Member Join Date: Feb 2011 Location: Maine Photos: Gallery Posts: 3,081 Original Poster	Originally posted by vonBaloney Any filters on the lens? This is not that unusual -- I have a few lenses that are prone to similar at night. Not multi-coated, I'm guessing? Nope, no filters. I found a wide-open shot (much faster exposure at 1/40 of a sec) I'll post in a bit. The lens says its multicoated, so it was coated by whatever company (or companies) did the Sears 28mm macro lenses back in the day. I'd love to fix (or at least lessen) the effect if I can as its a nice solid little prime, but as I like taking night shots and see myself getting into it more now that I live 'in town' not being able to use the thing for long exposures would be unfortunate.

01-27-2012, 01:16 PM	#6
Sagitta Veteran Member Join Date: Feb 2011 Location: Maine Photos: Gallery Posts: 3,081 Original Poster	OK, this one is wide open, 1/40 second @ f2.8. You can still see the flaring (just not nearly as bad as the longer exposure had). If you look at it 100%, theres fringing going on with the flare as well - opposite sides of the lights between left and right side of the shot.

01-27-2012, 01:43 PM	#7
westmill Veteran Member Join Date: Jan 2012 Location: Stoke on Trent Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 1,146	It might be worth trying a good multi coated filter ! If its an old lens, there is a good chance that the lens may have had its multicoating removed with over zelous cleaning etc.

01-27-2012, 01:56 PM	#8
Sagitta Veteran Member Join Date: Feb 2011 Location: Maine Photos: Gallery Posts: 3,081 Original Poster	Originally posted by westmill It might be worth trying a good multi coated filter ! If its an old lens, there is a good chance that the lens may have had its multicoating removed with over zelous cleaning etc. Shouldn't it be flaring evenly though? Even with the coating gone (if it is). It seems like the pattern going around the lights is off-kilter.

01-27-2012, 02:07 PM	#9
westmill Veteran Member Join Date: Jan 2012 Location: Stoke on Trent Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 1,146	Its poss its worn patchy or anything ! Gotta be worth a try ! process of elimination an all that.

01-27-2012, 05:17 PM	#10
Wheatfield Moderator Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: The wheatfields of Canada Posts: 15,981	That is actually two kinds of flare. The streaks coming off the lights are caused by reflections off the aperture blades. This particular flare does increase with longer exposure times. The other flare is veiling flare, and that is the bright looking "haze" that is very prevalent in the first image, and still quite strong in the second one. There is no fixing either one. It is just normal properties of the lens you are using. Some lenses are better, some worse. This one happens to be worse (quite worse, actually). It may be an excellent lens for other purposes, so do keep using it, and work to it's strengths.

01-27-2012, 05:59 PM	#11
vonBaloney Pentaxian Join Date: Oct 2011 Location: Albuquerque, NM Posts: 6,029	Originally posted by Wheatfield That is actually two kinds of flare. The streaks coming off the lights are caused by reflections off the aperture blades. I was wondering about that -- I have a cheap 400/6.3 telephoto with oily blades that flares like that. I wondered if the oil was causing it or making it worse.

01-27-2012, 09:40 PM	#12
Sagitta Veteran Member Join Date: Feb 2011 Location: Maine Photos: Gallery Posts: 3,081 Original Poster	Originally posted by vonBaloney I was wondering about that -- I have a cheap 400/6.3 telephoto with oily blades that flares like that. I wondered if the oil was causing it or making it worse. This prompted me to go hold the lens up in front of a bright light. I can see shiny marks on the blades that are either areas where the coating wore through or is maybe oil. It looks more 'scuffy' than oily, but the result is a shiny surface to them.