[aleonx3]

The K3 will be APS-C.

Why do you guys still associate the K3 with FF? The rumour was a hoax, as we all should know by now.

Do you have any insider information that k-3 should be aps-c? why wasted one level for another aps-c sensor, why not save k-3 for FF and then k-1 for supreme FF?

[maxfield_photo]

The K3 will be APS-C.

Why do you guys still associate the K3 with FF? The rumour was a hoax, as we all should know by now.

The rumor was a hoax (an April Fools joke to be precise), started in these very forums, but just because you're paranoid doesn't mean they aren't out to get ya'.

[philbaum]

That is because after a certain number developing cost is covered and cost per customer flattens out. Theres probably not much savings per body, say, if yoiu are making 400 000 units or 700 000 units. APS is there volume wise. For Pentax FF is not. Pentax could hope to sell about 10 000 FF bodies. They would have to charge much for it if they are going to have the profit margin of an FF Nikon or Canon. They also would have to take the expense of a number of FF lenses that it will take long to recover profitwise. The sensor in the 645D cost Pentax less than $2000 but the camera still cost $10 000 (at the cheapest) in spite of being a K-5 is a different body.....

Thats true, and there are other factors as well that allows a small company like Pentax to sometimes compete with the big guys.

a) There's an old rental car company ad: "When you're number 2, you have to try harder" or something like that. After changing hands twice, you can bet the Pentax staff knows their jobs are online every day. You can bet that those guys are working harder.

b) Big companies tend to get more and more bloated with overhead costs and people. They usually have many more levels of supervision which tends to inhibit innovation. These overhead costs and inhibitory levels of management tend to offset natural advantages of the larger companies. Look how startup companies like Apple and Microsoft supplanted old establishment IBM.

c) What Pentax is demonstrating is steady progress in its comback, with K10...K5...K30 and 645D all being major achievements. With Ricoh's background and experience added to Pentax - I expect to see major improvements in the K01 line as well.

K3 may well be an APS sensor, which i expect, but eventually, I would think Pentax would go FF. Hopefully we will see more solid information in Sept.

[Pål Jensen]

K3 may well be an APS sensor, which i expect, but eventually, I would think Pentax would go FF. Hopefully we will see more solid information in Sept.

I doubt there will be an FF camera from Pentax anytime soon for a number of reasons. Likewise I believe Pentax have made the decision to stay with cropped 645 sensor as both their MF offering and their answer to FF.

[miles]

The K3 will be APS-C.

Why do you guys still associate the K3 with FF? The rumour was a hoax, as we all should know by now.

Yes the K3 will most likely be the name of the K5 successor. The rumor was a prank hosted here on April fool's. I spilled my coffee that day...

But back to the thread's subject: the K3FF, or K1, or K135, or K24x36 (whatever) is the one we're dreaming about, and unfortunately there's little chance of us seing one any time soon.
That said, I was playing with a friends Canon 1Diii again tonight, and the viewfinder is awesome, and its speed and almost-zero blackout time even nicer...

So here's another wish for future Pentax upper-end cameras, APS-C or other: shorter black-out time.
This should help AF-C too.

[GreenMachine]

If a full frame camera actually became reality, it would be nice to see some new lenses to go with it . . say in the FA or FA/D prime line something wide 14mm to 24mm and in telephoto something 180mm to 200mm. That would complete the FA line into a very well rounded selection for all users needing wide for architectural/landscape and mid-telephoto for portraits and such.

[Clavius]

I think, lots of Pentaxians would already be very happy with a barebones FF DSLR. A FF body that is missing some features to bring down the costs a lot, and then marketed as 'retro'. That's the only way they're going to be able to be cheaper then the competition without being flimsey.

[Pål Jensen]

I think, lots of Pentaxians would already be very happy with a barebones FF DSLR. A FF body that is missing some features to bring down the costs a lot, and then marketed as 'retro'. That's the only way they're going to be able to be cheaper then the competition without being flimsey.

The problem is that features today are mostly of the electronic variety and often just software on a chip; after it is developed it cost virtually nothing to implement. Although it might be true that many will be happy with a bare bone FF from Pentax, the company need to keep the FF line viable in the long term as well. What is problematic is how Pentax is going to keep all those DSLR line-ups going and be competitive technically and price wise. They are after all a small company with low marketshare and have marketing and distribution challenges.

[Clavius]

The problem is that features today are mostly of the electronic variety and often just software on a chip; after it is developed it cost virtually nothing to implement. Although it might be true that many will be happy with a bare bone FF from Pentax, the company need to keep the FF line viable in the long term as well. What is problematic is how Pentax is going to keep all those DSLR line-ups going and be competitive technically and price wise.

I was talking BAREbones. Even without SR etc.

They are after all a small company with low marketshare and have marketing and distribution challenges.

Chicken & the egg story. They've got to (re)start somewhere. They need something to market.

[GreenMachine]

This can go two ways . . . Pentax will build a DSLR brand around the APS-C sensor like Olympus did around the Four Thirds and Micro Four Thirds . . . . or they will eventually introduce a full frame camera based on the standard 35mm film format.

[philbaum]

If a full frame camera actually became reality, it would be nice to see some new lenses to go with it . . say in the FA or FA/D prime line something wide 14mm to 24mm and in telephoto something 180mm to 200mm. That would complete the FA line into a very well rounded selection for all users needing wide for architectural/landscape and mid-telephoto for portraits and such.

I don't know - perhaps expectations have changed on how to introduce a new camera model. Fuji with their Xpro1 and Canon with their M mount have introduced models without a lot of lenses. Perhaps Pentax just needs to get the model out there without a lot of new lenses to reassure the faithful

Since Ricoh just took over Pentax, i think they have the opportunity NOW to trim the number of mounts supported. e.g. i don't think there is going to be a lot of effort spent on future Q mount lenses. Same thing with the XS lenses for the K01. I hope they keep developing the K01 though. I also hope they keep working on the 645D line. But how do the MF manufacturers survive without a sensor mfr, the successor to Kodak, was it Truesense or something like that, doesn't seem to be very active with publicity releases.

[GreenMachine]

Teledyne DALSA . . . If you haven't heard of them, I would say go visit their web site. They provide sensors to some Medium Format camera companies like Leaf, Mamiya and Phase One. Teledyne DALSA

[miles]

The problem is that features today are mostly of the electronic variety and often just software on a chip; after it is developed it cost virtually nothing to implement. Although it might be true that many will be happy with a bare bone FF from Pentax, the company need to keep the FF line viable in the long term as well. What is problematic is how Pentax is going to keep all those DSLR line-ups going and be competitive technically and price wise. They are after all a small company with low marketshare and have marketing and distribution challenges.

That could be a possibility. Make it look like an LX, with a biiig pentaprism, throw in a second focusing screen with split-prism, style it to match the limiteds and the A's, kinda like the new Olympus.
I'd get one in a heartbeat. Then they can launch an FA 20 limited and an FA 135 limited. They'll have the same filter diameter as the 31. I mean why must there be a 24-70. Leica doesn't have one. Pentax could chose to do what makes them special, and that's small rugged ergonomic bodies, and limited lens. I know this is a niche market, somewhere between Canikon and Leica. There are many (lucky) people with Nikon AND Leica systems!

I don't need many AF points, many fps, advanced AF tracking algorithms and a huge buffer on a FF camera.

In fact, I'd rather have them on an APS-C, for wildlife and sports.

[LamyTax]

I think, lots of Pentaxians would already be very happy with a barebones FF DSLR. A FF body that is missing some features to bring down the costs a lot, and then marketed as 'retro'. That's the only way they're going to be able to be cheaper then the competition without being flimsey.

By a lot you mean "a few" and those will be pretty much the only ones who'll buy it.
Try selling a "barebone FF body" to someone who doesn't already have old FF glass. Good luck.

[Clavius]

By a lot you mean "a few" and those will be pretty much the only ones who'll buy it.
Try selling a "barebone FF body" to someone who doesn't already have old FF glass. Good luck.

You think so? I would buy one, and I only own 2 FF lenses! There's even people who dream of the full manual version: https://www.pentaxforums.com/forums/pentax-news-rumors/15728-dear-pentax-63.html#post2081708

I even know a pro, who already uses multiple systems, Canon, Nikon and Leica, that explicitly and repeatedly states how he would instantly buy any FF Pentax DSLR to mount his, one and only Pentax lens, the manual focus Pentax 50mm 1.2 on. Which he currently mounts on his Canon. (Apparently, the Canon 50 1.2 sucks bigtime.)

They could still be the first company to make a barebone FF mirrorless camera, being able to mount about any lens from any brand via adapters. Enabling people from CanNikSon who want FF, but can't afford it, to find what they are looking for with Pentax.

And, I'm sad to admit it, but this is the ONLY niche Pentax can still realisticly fill now.