[RonHendriks1966]

I went with my photography classmate the other day to get some self portrait pictures.

I lent her my camera and adjusted the camera's ISO, shutter speed, and Aperture settings for her (she was still learning camera settings, i.e. did not know to use a fast shutter speed so the waves don't blur), posed in ways I thought would work, and positioned myself in regards to where the camera was as she shot away.

Now, my classmate is REALLY big on receiving credit for the pictures she's taken. I've tonemapped a few pictures of hers in the past and have given her credit, but this time, regarding the editing, I feel way too partial to giving myself the credit, because I feel like I did most of the work.

My question is:

Should I give her credit for the picture?

You really need this photography course! A selfportrait is made by one self and not by someone else, since then it is a portrait of you made by that other person.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Self-portrait

So credit her and never talk again about having a not so good image.

From wiki:
Two methods of obtaining photographic self-portraits are widespread. One is photographing a reflection in the mirror, and the other photographing one's self with the camera in an outstretched hand. Eleazar Langman photographed his reflection on the surface of a nickel-plated teapot.

Another method involves setting the camera or capture device upon a tripod, or surface. One might then set the camera's timer, or use a remote controlled shutter release.

Finally, setting up the camera, entering the scene and having an assistant release the shutter (i.e., if the presence of a cable release is unwanted in the photo) can arguably be regarded as a photographic self-portrait, as well.


So it is still a selfportrait when you do all the work. Since that is not the case here, you blame her making a lousy picture, but with a selfportrait you would have set the camera to M-mode and made all setting right in the first place. So you can't blame her for not making a good image. She did that to her skills. I would say you thank her for the job and the learning curve she is in.

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Last edited by RonHendriks1966; 05-06-2013 at 01:10 AM.

[altopiet]

Well, after all this, I presume she is in your class, but definitely not your "mate" any more. If you think the shot is worth a lot of money, you'll have to fight for it, if not, hand her the unedited version and move on, life is too short to waist time over something like this...rather look for another mate, one who's not interested in photography

[BeginnerDave]

You really need this photography course! A selfportrait is made by one self and not by someone else, since then it is a portrait of you made by that other person.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Self-portrait

So credit her and never talk again about having a not so good image.

From wiki:
Two methods of obtaining photographic self-portraits are widespread. One is photographing a reflection in the mirror, and the other photographing one's self with the camera in an outstretched hand. Eleazar Langman photographed his reflection on the surface of a nickel-plated teapot.

Another method involves setting the camera or capture device upon a tripod, or surface. One might then set the camera's timer, or use a remote controlled shutter release.

Finally, setting up the camera, entering the scene and having an assistant release the shutter (i.e., if the presence of a cable release is unwanted in the photo) can arguably be regarded as a photographic self-portrait, as well.

Our photography teacher said the exact opposite, that you can have someone else take a self portrait picture.

Let's not include that I took pictures of her and she can do whatever damn thing she wants with the pictures I took, which I sent to her (like the pictures she took).

And she did not mention anything about "full ownership" of the images, yet she says that it's sad that I would consider the pictures anything but hers, and that I have no right to edit or use her pictures even if I credit her (I'm giving her full credit for taking the picture).

So it is still a selfportrait when you do all the work. Since that is not the case here, you blame her making a lousy picture, but with a selfportrait you would have set the camera to M-mode and made all setting right in the first place. So you can't blame her for not making a good image. She did that to her skills. I would say you thank her for the job and the learning curve she is in.

It was in fully manual mode and I actually did adjust every single setting (Aperture, Shutter Speed, ISO, white balance) to make a silhouette and underexpose the sunset to bring out the colors of the sunset while not blurring the waves (I do not mean to brag at all [because I really DO consider myself a beginner], I've taken and toggled with probably around 2-3 thousand sunset pictures in the last couple months of my starting photography, and have watched several videos and read several forums on the topic taking pictures of sunsets, knowing that I'd tend to be able to recover colors that are underexposed; I've also edited 400 pictures [individual] just this last week in Lightroom).

I also adjusted the focusing in advance (before posing repeatedly) since she didn't know how to like all the other settings.

Now, if she asked for or made it clear in advance that she wanted "full ownership" of the pictures that she took and if I agreed with her, then obviously I would understand that she has total control of whatever picture she pressed the shutter at.

If I was threatening not to give her credit for taking the pictures and use her pictures, then we'd have a problem; however, as I've said, I'm giving her full credit for taking the shot - while crediting myself for the editing - but she says that I have no right to edit or even use her pictures even in such a case.

Well, after all this, I presume she is in your class, but definitely not your "mate" any more. If you think the shot is worth a lot of money, you'll have to fight for it, if not, hand her the unedited version and move on, life is too short to waist time over something like this...rather look for another mate, one who's not interested in photography

This is a case where absolutely NO money is involved, but she made an outrageously big deal out of it, calling me sick for even considering the pictures anything but completely and totally hers. I mean, we're ******* amateurs. This is not even taking into account that these are 3-4 pictures she would probably have never used.

And if there's one thing I won't do, it's give someone stuff ("full power" to the extent that I can't edit pictures I directed) because she's selfish. A nicer person might do that, but why should I?

[JenniferLeigh]

Personally, it sounds like she is being unreasonable. You set up the image, and all she did was push the button then I would think credit would go to you - but this is not always the case in copyright law, which I am no expert in.

I would drop it, go out and reshoot without her. Give her the unedited copy or just delete them.

[BeginnerDave]

I don't mind giving her credit even after directing the pictures.

And I've already given her the original versions of the pictures she's taken.

The question is whether I should listen to her and not post the pictures I like anywhere nor edit them (giving her credit for taking the shot each time I do). I don't see why I should.

[JenniferLeigh]

The question is whether I should listen to her and not post the pictures I like anywhere nor edit them (giving her credit for taking the shot each time I do). I don't see why I should.

Concept, Camera Direction & Editing by BeginnerDave, Button Pressing by Unreasonable Classmate.

Seriously though, if it is really going to cause bad blood then drop it. If you don't care about the drama then go ahead a post it and credit her nicely. I'm no lawyer so who knows how this would go in court, but I doubt it'll ever get there (although weirder things have happened). Your call. What does your instructor say about this?

[BeginnerDave]

Concept, Camera Direction & Editing by BeginnerDave, Button Pressing by Unreasonable Classmate.

Read my mind, but seriously, I'm currently shooting photography as a volunteer to spread awareness about causes that I care about and am not big on receiving credit at the moment (besides, as I said before, we're both [she and I] amateurs). I mainly want to be able to showcase some pictures of myself that I spent time and effort making and feel good about.

Seriously though, if it is really going to cause bad blood then drop it. If you don't care about the drama then go ahead a post it and credit her nicely. I'm no lawyer so who knows how this would go in court, but I doubt it'll ever get there (although weirder things have happened). Your call. What does your instructor say about this?

Well I'm most definitely not a drama person, but i don't like giving in to someone who I believe is completely wrong.

If I were someone else that I cared about, I wouldn't let that person give in to another person's selfishness if they were proud of a picture they directed and edited.

Class is this Thursday.

Also, thanks, everyone, for taking the time to read through my stuff and give me your opinions.

I do appreciate it and am doing my best to view this from different angles.

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Last edited by BeginnerDave; 05-06-2013 at 08:23 AM.

[aurele]

Well I'm most definitely not a drama person, but i don't like giving in to someone who I believe is completely wrong.

sometime, the great victory is not to (maybe) succeed after lots of talk to make people change their minds, the great victory is to accept to let it go, and move on, as hcc said it before.

I do appreciate it and am doing my best to view this from different angles.

Don't try to explain her non-sense, and move on !

You'll have enough work with your work, don't add to it a lot of useless talk with stubborn people (with all due respect to her). If you like photography, stay, talk, work with people you like or that are professional and make it fun or easy.
Don't let the other (like her) disgust you of photography.

Photography is supposed to be a fun or at least an enjoyable process/work, if some people make it ... well ... annoying, just stop working with them, move on, etc ...

I guess the harder for you is not about the work, but about the fact you discover she can be incredibly selfish and unreasonable, am i right ?

[Reliant K1000]

If she represents herself as this being "her" shots, someone will eventually end up asking "how did you set the exposure" or some such technicality and she will most likely trip herself up and look foolish, or be asked to reproduce a similar image, and not be able to do it.

I would just tell her to have a nice life, and take her off your Christmas Card list!