[carrrlangas]

Wowowow wait a minute.
Fisrt, I think you are being rude to me and you also were rude on your answer to specialK saying "this is ALL you could..." Who do you think you are?
You are going to be adviced by different people with their experience and ways. You may take or leave what you please but be respectful.
Second:

Why isn't it realistic? What do you all have against poor people?

People don´t have "humble expectations" for a wedding photographer. Either like the pictures or not. Also, Poor people? What does the quality of your job has to do with the economic situation of a customer? If a rich person hires you, then you´ll do a better job?

Third, I wasn´t judging you and indeed suggested you learn about wedding sessions by the side of a photographer with experience in that field before trying to put toghether a package, fix rates or whatever.
I hope you can sort out all your doubts cause I can tell you are short of experience and don´t know how to deal with people very nicely (even ifyou disagree). I guess I am judging you now. No need to answer, I don´t really care.

EDIT: Forgot to add: Who said anything about poor people before your comment?!

---

Last edited by carrrlangas; 06-25-2013 at 10:18 PM.

[NiftyFifty]

Wowowow wait a minute.
Fisrt, I think you are being rude to me and you also were rude on your answer to specialK saying "this is ALL you could..." Who do you think you are?
You are going to be adviced by different people with their experience and ways. You may take or leave what you please but be respectful.
Second:

People don´t have "humble expectations" for a wedding photographer. Either like the pictures or not. Also, Poor people? What does the quality of your job has to do with the economic situation of a customer? If a rich person hires you, then you´ll do a better job?

Third, I wasn´t judging you and indeed suggested you learn about wedding sessions by the side of a photographer with experience in that field before trying to put toghether a package, fix rates or whatever.
I hope you can sort out all your doubts cause I can tell you are short of experience and don´t know how to deal with people very nicely (even ifyou disagree). I guess I am judging you now. No need to answer, I don´t really care.

EDIT: Forgot to add: Who said anything about poor people before your comment?!

I can deal with people just fine. What I have low patience for is people answering questions I didn't ask. Why is it so hard to just answer the doggone question that was asked? Why is it so hard to ASK for clarification if you're not sure what someone meant? Why make assumptions about X,Y, or Z and then give answers based on those assumptions - which, again, doesn't actually answer the question asked? But, after reading useless response after response, I'm wrong for saying "Hey, please answer the question I asked or just don't reply"? Seriously? Whatever.

People with a total wedding budget of less than $5,000 do have humble expectations. You don't think they already browsed websites and called wedding photogs and found out nobody will touch them with a ten foot pole? As I stated, I've seen some of the pics that were taken by "pro" photogs who "lowered" themselves to do an ultra low budget shoot. The quality of their work WAS different - no fancy filter effects, etc. They corrected for color, clarity and exposure and cropped, and that was it. That is a difference from what they show on their sites and in their portfolios and that difference in EFFORT is 100% due to the Time/Value ratio of money, which in this context inherently involves issues of class -- because do you think well off people have total wedding budgets of less than $5K? Now, if you think what I just described doesn't happen, I have some ocean-front property in Arizona to sell you.

[jatrax]

Despite what you think you have been given a lot of good advice. Weddings are hard work and invariably the client will find something to complain about. Ever worked with an hysterical bride or mother? Gotten sued because your photos make the bride look fat? Do you have business and liability insurance?

Instead of arguing with people and making snide remarks about people who are trying to help you maybe you should listen. But it sounds like you don`t really want advice. You want to take pictures of the wedding without being a wedding photographer. I am not sure that will end well, as noted above what people tell you and what they really expect is never the same.


If you can deliver a great wedding package at an affordable price and make money my hats off to you. The problem is what are you going to cut out to reduce the cost? A wedding is a wedding, big or small there is a certain basic amount of work that has to be done. Someone above quoted 20 hours of work. I think tbat is low but ok what is 20 hours of your time worth?

The key to weddings is anticipating the action. You MUST be in the right place at the right time and if you miss there is no do over. Are you experienced enough to be in the right place?

If you really want to do this the best advice is find a wedding pro that will take you on as third shooter for free and show you how it is done.

[NiftyFifty]

Despite what you think you have been given a lot of good advice. Weddings are hard work and invariably the client will find something to complain about. Ever worked with an hysterical bride or mother? Gotten sued because your photos make the bride look fat? Do you have business and liability insurance?

Instead of arguing with people and making snide remarks about people who are trying to help you maybe you should listen. But it sounds like you don`t really want advice. You want to take pictures of the wedding without being a wedding photographer. I am not sure that will end well, as noted above what people tell you and what they really expect is never the same.


If you can deliver a great wedding package at an affordable price and make money my hats off to you. The problem is what are you going to cut out to reduce the cost? A wedding is a wedding, big or small there is a certain basic amount of work that has to be done. Someone above quoted 20 hours of work. I think tbat is low but ok what is 20 hours of your time worth?

The key to weddings is anticipating the action. You MUST be in the right place at the right time and if you miss there is no do over. Are you experienced enough to be in the right place?

If you really want to do this the best advice is find a wedding pro that will take you on as third shooter for free and show you how it is done.

Okay, so people give me non-answers and when I point that out I'm arguing with them? I just want answers to the question I asked. If nobody wants to actually do that, they should not have replied. I would NOT have been offended if nobody responded. I would have just gone elsewhere to find the info I was looking for. That's what I'm going to have to do anyway.

No, I won't be anticipating any action at any weddings I do. If it's not on the shot list for the package they bought, it doesn't get shot. The end. If they want a traditional shoot, they need to pay traditional shoot money. You can't expect champagne if all you can afford is kool-aid. You want champagne? Save up longer and pay for champagne.

As I said in an earlier post, no wedding photogs will touch these ultra low budget couples. But, I think they should have better pics than what drunk Uncle Bubba will produce with his 3MP Kodak EasyShare. I'm not offering what the experienced wedding photogs offer as far as choices in shoots or even experience. But I sure as heck can best Uncle Bubba and give these couples something they won't be ashamed to hang on their wall and show people.

No, I don't want to be a wedding photographer, especially in the traditional sense. I admit that this is more of an opportunistic venture, but that's the basis of business! See a need, if you can fill it, fill it. I won't be "full service", but I can give these couples SOME of the "must have" wedding shots to commemorate their special day. If something off the wall happens, with the proliferation of good cell phone cameras, you can bet more than one guest will catch it if I miss it by going to the bathroom. :S

The cold reality of the situation is that if what I'm willing to do is all they can afford, then that has to be enough. And, whether you all want to believe it or not, for many of the people I'm talking about that IS enough. If no other photogs in my area want to do these shoots, I'll do them. I live in a small city in the Deep South where most of the residents don't get paid much. The wedding photogs here focus on the middle and upper class. I'm sure there are some lower economic folks who save until they can afford one of these photogs, but some people can't or don't do that. That is a demographic that is NOT being served. They are priced out and iced out. If they find their way to me, why shouldn't I do it?

The legal and insurance side of things will be in place before I do ANYTHING for money.

---

Last edited by NiftyFifty; 06-25-2013 at 11:41 PM.

[carrrlangas]

Again, it looks like you didn´t read anything.

No, I won't be anticipating any action at any weddings I do.

but I can give these couples SOME of the "must have" wedding shots

This is the proof of your ignorance.
For example, "the kiss" moment, which is a "must have" for sure: With an SLR, while looking through the viewfinder, If you can see the couple´s lips touching each other, then you´ve missed the shot. That is an example "antisipating action", of which you won´t be doing any (????)

Apart from the advice against your bussiness idea, this is the best advice before you think of anything else:

find a wedding pro that will take you on as third shooter for free and show you how it is done.

learn about wedding sessions by the side of a photographer with experience in that field before trying to put toghether a package, fix rates or whatever.

PS: READ the post before answering, mainly the las 3 lines

[NiftyFifty]

Again, it looks like you didn´t read anything.


This is the proof of your ignorance.
For example, "the kiss": With an SLR, while looking through the viewfinder, If you can see the couple´s lips touching each other, then you´ve missed the shot. That is an example "antisipating action", of which you won´t be doing any (????)

Apart from the advice against your mediocre bussiness idea, this is the best advice:

I'm going to say this and then I'm done with this entire thread. People are reading and focusing on what they want to and not what I've actually been saying. The whole point of this thread was for me to get some ideas for a bare bones wedding package for a SPECIFIC wedding that I was asked to do yesterday. I need to give them an answer - either way - in a couple of days. THEY told me that they were not looking for anything but some good and decent wedding photos, because THEY KNEW they didn't have much money to work with and that was all they could afford to pay for.

I came here to get a quote for that specific situation.

I then added that IF... IF... and again, IF... I was ABLE to accommodate this couple and everything went well, I would CONSIDER doing what I did for them for other couples in the same situation.

I never said that I wanted to definitely start a photog business doing low budget wedding photography. I merely saw that there could POSSIBLY be an opportunity to make some money on the side doing this when it was needed. I'm happy. Cash-strapped couples are happy.

There was nothing more to it than that.

Most of you all are the ones who started assuming things and giving me answers to questions I never asked, etc. I go out of my way to clearly say/ask what I mean, so I do get irritated when people just spout off answers without considering or fully understanding what I'm asking OR start giving me advice for things I never asked about. I would rather get no help than have that happen.

Have a good night. The End.

[altopiet]

THEY told me that they were not looking for anything but some good and decent wedding photos,

I never did a wedding for money, so can't comment on that, and the other posters probably have more experience in the matter, but I "feel" what you're trying to do, and as far as I can see the main problem is to establish exactly what their expectations are, as that might influence the time you spend, and time equals money in the end. If they are satisfied with a certain amount of shots and you can limit your time by lets say, only doing the pre-wedding, then church and departure from church shots, and not the hours after that at the reception, then obviously that would work out cheaper for them. You know your capabilities as photographer, and the amount of time you'll need on PP, to give them some decent shots, so if you add that time at an hourly rate acceptable to you, and get a total that you feel is what you can live with, present it to them and see what happens. I would just make very sure that you all are on the same page as to what they will get for their money, to prevent any regrets by both parties at a later stage...

[NiftyFifty]

I never did a wedding for money, so can't comment on that, and the other posters probably have more experience in the matter, but I "feel" what you're trying to do, and as far as I can see the main problem is to establish exactly what their expectations are, as that might influence the time you spend, and time equals money in the end. If they are satisfied with a certain amount of shots and you can limit your time by lets say, only doing the pre-wedding, then church and departure from church shots, and not the hours after that at the reception, then obviously that would work out cheaper for them. You know your capabilities as photographer, and the amount of time you'll need on PP, to give them some decent shots, so if you add that time at an hourly rate acceptable to you, and get a total that you feel is what you can live with, present it to them and see what happens. I would just make very sure that you all are on the same page as to what they will get for their money, to prevent any regrets by both parties at a later stage...

EXACTLY what I was thinking. Finally, someone gets what I've been repeating throughout this entire thread. I don't have any clue as to why almost everybody else had such a hard time understanding what I meant. You obviously got it, so I know I wasn't speaking/typing gibberish. Shoot, I was starting to feel like I was in an episode of The Twilight Zone or had woken up speaking an alien language nobody but me understood.

My personality type is INTJ, so trust me when I say every couple will be very well aware of what I can and cannot do for them, and what they will be able to get for their money. We will ALL be on the same page before any contract is signed. I might even video the contract signing session where everything is read off by me, verbally affirmed by them, initialed by them, and then signed by us all.

Thanks for your help and ideas! I have some research to do over the next couple of days so I can give my cousin a price quote to pass on to the couple. If they agree to the price, then I'll meet with them, personally. But, no need for that until I know they can afford whatever (reasonable, but not cheap) quote I come up with.

[MRRiley]

Member asks question... Other members answer in ways that they honestly believe have a bearing on the OP's question. OP doesn't like answers. Thread spirals out of control and beyond civility and is closed.

Mike
PF Moderation Team