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08-09-2013, 12:49 PM   #1
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Is Sigma BAD for camera makers?

Just wondering;

We keep hearing reports of how gloomy the forecasts for profit for camera companies are.

For those making DSLR's one money maker was lenses. Sigma makes lenses for various mounts I am told without a license. And lately they have been making some good ones. And that is good for the consumer.

BUT is the long term effect to eat into their profits and contribute to further weakening them. Just pondering...

08-09-2013, 01:25 PM - 1 Like   #2
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If they can make them at affordable prices then the camera makers should be able to as well.
08-09-2013, 01:53 PM - 1 Like   #3
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QuoteOriginally posted by VoiceOfReason Quote
If they can make them at affordable prices then the camera makers should be able to as well.
+1 Sigma (and other 3rd party makers) have always been 2nd tier, selling below the OEM pricing though often with lesser quality. A niche they filled for a long time. Lots of old used gear with just a Pentax 50mm f/2 that came with the camera and then a suite of Sigma or Tamron lenses. So there was a clear market differentiation: high price and quality versus lower price and quality, people could choose based on their priorities.

But I think that is changing, Sigma has really been upping their game lately and they have potentially an advantage in that they can spread R&D over several mounts from the basic design. And their new usb dock to program lenses at home? Pure genius for the enthusiast market. What gearhead would not want to tinker with the lens programming? And now they announce they will change the mount if you change camera brands? I'm not sure how many will do that but I can envision a scenario where you buy all Sigma glass and the camera is an add on. We always say bodies come and go, glass is forever. Looks to me like Sigma is listening.
08-09-2013, 02:00 PM   #4
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I think Sigma puts pressure on camera/lens makers to have quality gear. If Nikon/Canon/Pentax lens is high quality, they definitely still have the inside edge. If, on the other hand, Pentax has a weak offering (like the DA *16-50) for too much money, then yes, Sigma is going to edge them out. I still think Sigma lenses are too big and not flare resistant enough, but they still have some awesome options.

08-09-2013, 02:13 PM   #5
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Sigma is an interesting company. They perform a role that only Tamron comes close to matching in the interchangeable lens market, but they're unique in having their own line of camera bodies, as well, and they cater for more brands and formats with their lenses than anyone other than Zeiss does. AFAIK, neither do they make OEM lenses for camera manufacturers.

I don't believe they're bad for camera body makers, on balance. While they might take some lens sales from OEM lower-price lines, they provide competition in that area, and increasingly in the higher-priced range, now. On that last point, we'll know they're a serious competitor when they start making M mount lenses. Overall, though, they probably help to sell more camera bodies, by making entry-level body kits more attractive to buyers. If they ever brought out an entry-level body of their own, I would say that they'd be a threat to the other manufacturers.
08-09-2013, 02:19 PM   #6
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QuoteOriginally posted by psychdoc Quote
Sigma makes lenses for various mounts I am told without a license.
I'm pretty sure they have a license for every mount they use.
08-09-2013, 02:45 PM   #7
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Nikon has sued Sigma, but over stabilization tech, not the mount.

08-09-2013, 03:04 PM   #8
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QuoteOriginally posted by Pablom Quote
I'm pretty sure they have a license for every mount they use.
Maybe. But I see this kind of thing all the time: [On a review of the Sigma dock in this example]

"Without the Canon specifications available to them, Sigma must reverse engineer the Canon AF system. Occasionally, a new camera model does not play well with an existing third party lens model. With the ability to update lens firmware via the dock (and an internet-connected computer), some of these compatibility issues theoretically could be resolved, making your Sigma investment more future-proof".

Sigma Dock Review
08-09-2013, 03:13 PM   #9
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We shouldn't forget all the other after market suppliers of flash systems, grips, and everything else that makes up a camera system.

I personally believe that the third party vendors make the more expensive camera systems a bit more attractive to consumers because they give us the option, potentially, to buy a more expensive body by saving some money on the lenses and other accessories.
08-09-2013, 03:57 PM   #10
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The president of Sigma decided that he didn't want to be a lens manufacturer for people who can't afford name brand glass. He wants to make great lenses that people want to use, as a first choice. The great lenses they are making should be shaking up the industry and pushing things forward. The big brands can't rely on built in customers who don't want to bother changing mounts. They can still lose business to Sigma. I think Sigma is good news for consumers and photography in general.

QuoteOriginally posted by Pablom Quote
Sigma makes lenses for various mounts I am told without a license.
Sigma is known to reverse engineer the specs rather than pay fees.
08-09-2013, 05:49 PM   #11
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I am a fan of Sigma and what they are doing. I have the Sigma 50mm F/1.4 and the 85mm F/1.4. They are both excellent lenses, but the build quality is just not the same as Canon L glass, Nikon D/G series, Sony Zeiss, Pentax LTDs, or Olympus SHG.

The latest round of Sigma lenses seem to be challenging the build quality issue, but we will have to see. Just a few years ago Sigma was having issues with their finish, AF, build quality...... They have come a long way.
08-09-2013, 08:21 PM   #12
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Anything that makes a company work harder is good for the consumers, but also the company being challenged, unless it fails, then it is very very bad. The Japanese automakers caused the big 3 to dramatically improve their vehicles. Unfortunately for them, the competition keeps getting even better just as fast. Maybe Sigma today is Honda from 1978 (or Huyndai of 2000), people are just starting to go Hmmmm, this really is just as good as the big guys...
08-09-2013, 09:11 PM   #13
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Back in the early 70's I bought two after market lenses (not Sigma or any other firm currently making lenses) and I was very disappointed with their quality.

To the point that I rarely used them and until this year...always used only...the manufacturer's lenses.

This year I had a hankering to have a super telephoto and pretty well the only game in town ....if you want a new 500mm....and have Pentax bodies...well then it's Sigma.

So a few months ago, I bought a new Sigma 150-500. Aside from the fact that the lens seems not as tight on the lens mount as I would like...it's been a very good lens. Sharp, quiet AF, smooth...so far I like it.

Since 2007...when I bought my first digital Pentax...a K10D....I have bought in total 3 Pentax DSLR bodies, 2 grips, 1 flash and 10 other lenses....all Pentax.

If Pentax had made a super telephoto zoom in my Sigma 150-500 price category I would of gone with the Pentax.

With the purchase of my Sigma...or Bigma...or whatever they call it...I will admit Sigma seems to make a fine quality lens for the price.

I have seen other photographers, with higher end Pentax, Canon, Nikon, Olympus DSLR bodies use Sigma or Tokina. No one I've spoke to, with these bodies seems to have any complaints with their after market Sigma/Tokina lenses.

Is it good for the industry and the major players?

I say yes.

I believe that having aftermarket manufacturers offer similar lenses, provides competition and also ensures that Canon, Nikon, Pentax, Olympus, Sony (did I miss anyone ?) are cogniscent of keeping their products price and quality competitive with the market alternatives.

Last edited by lesmore49; 08-09-2013 at 09:18 PM.
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